Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby AndrewBurns » Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:50 pm

My 29er disc carbon clinchers from Farsports arrived today, no photos yet but I'll get some eventually. They were extremely well packed and the box was in great condition. Both wheels look immaculate, I got 3k matte finish and you can't see any segments or anything just a flawless weave.

Front wheel = 644 grams
Rear wheel = 774 grams
Skewers = 104 grams

Total wheelset (no skewers) = 1418 grams, about 2 grams under the minimum specified weight, close enough.

My 700x28c GP4 seasons tyres were IMPOSSIBLY hard to fit, I honestly at times thought I was going to break either my tyre levers or my rims getting them on. Also I was going to transfer the discs and cassette from my old wheels unfortunately whomever put them together at Wiggle over-torqued everything to the max. The cassette took my whole weight on a shifter to get off and the 6.4Nm max screws on the disc rotors managed to munch my torx screwdriver and give me a huge linear blood blister on my hand. So I have to take them to work tomorrow to get them off.

Look great on the bike though, looking forward to riding them home if everything goes well.
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by BNA » Thu Jun 14, 2012 12:27 am

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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby Mulger bill » Thu Jun 14, 2012 12:27 am

Can't wait for the pics and a ride report Andrew. What spoke count and what was the bottom line?

Shaun
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby nickobec » Thu Jun 14, 2012 1:03 am

Crawf wrote:nicobec, are you looking at an FM066?
Whats it going to cost you?

Paid invoice today of 701USD for for FM066 superlight 56cm including seatpost, headset, spacers, spare dérailleur hanger, delivery to Australia & paypal fees

frame weight: 850+/-20g
fork weight: 370+/-15g
27.2mm seatpost weight: 190+/-15g

still probably 30 days before I get my hands on it
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby AndrewBurns » Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:04 am

Mulger bill wrote:Can't wait for the pics and a ride report Andrew. What spoke count and what was the bottom line?

Shaun


28 holes front and rear and $655 AUD delivered.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby Crawf » Thu Jun 14, 2012 7:39 am

nickobec wrote:
Crawf wrote:nicobec, are you looking at an FM066?
Whats it going to cost you?

Paid invoice today of 701USD for for FM066 superlight 56cm including seatpost, headset, spacers, spare dérailleur hanger, delivery to Australia & paypal fees

frame weight: 850+/-20g
fork weight: 370+/-15g
27.2mm seatpost weight: 190+/-15g

still probably 30 days before I get my hands on it


I think i'm going to sell the FM028 as I plan to go Di2 internal, and the FM066 would be perfect.
Looks like the GB has closed though.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby AndrewBurns » Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:53 pm

Mulger bill wrote:Can't wait for the pics and a ride report Andrew. What spoke count and what was the bottom line?

Shaun


Rode the new wheels the 24km home today. Can't say I notice much difference as they're on a heavy commuter bike :P It did feel lighter and more responsive though, I'm loving the disc brakes for braking at the last moment and really throwing it into corners.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby Crawf » Thu Jun 14, 2012 7:30 pm

Got my 38mm clincher rims.
32h = 375g
28h = 379g
Better than expected!
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby Mulger bill » Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:49 pm

Thanks Andrew. Soooooooo tempted....

Shaun
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby jaseyjase » Fri Jun 15, 2012 12:26 am

Crawf wrote:
nickobec wrote:
Crawf wrote:nicobec, are you looking at an FM066?
Whats it going to cost you?

Paid invoice today of 701USD for for FM066 superlight 56cm including seatpost, headset, spacers, spare dérailleur hanger, delivery to Australia & paypal fees

frame weight: 850+/-20g
fork weight: 370+/-15g
27.2mm seatpost weight: 190+/-15g

still probably 30 days before I get my hands on it


I think i'm going to sell the FM028 as I plan to go Di2 internal, and the FM066 would be perfect.
Looks like the GB has closed though.


think we should start a BNA one? i think min order is 10. they can send to diff addresses so shouldnt be too much of a hassle.

surely we can find 10 people!

id be keen on a FM066 as well
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby Mulger bill » Fri Jun 15, 2012 12:41 am

I just looked at Hongfu, silly me. Now I'm dreaming of theFM089 disc equipped CX frame to replace the 'Dale...
...whatever the road rules, self-preservation is the absolute priority for a cyclist when mixing it with motorised traffic.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby Crawf » Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:36 am

Mulger bill wrote:I just looked at Hongfu, silly me. Now I'm dreaming of theFM089 disc equipped CX frame to replace the 'Dale...


I've been riding the same frame as a commuter(from a diff supplier) but with external routing, i'm glad I didn't go internal routing on this occasion, hasn't missed a beat.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby MichaelB » Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:27 pm

Crawf wrote:Got my 38mm clincher rims.
32h = 375g
28h = 379g
Better than expected!


Noice !!!
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby petie » Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:34 pm

Purt wrote:
petie wrote:I'm feeling a little lazy and was wondering if anyone had a link to a geometry discussion of chinese carbon frames? I don't race and am coming to the realisation that I prefer comfort over speed/looks/racing position. I have been browsing hongfu and dengfu and most of the geometry seems to be hard edge racer (not surprisingly). I did see the FM028 on the dengfu site and it seemed like a more relaxed geometry. Has anyone had any experience with this particular frame or know somewhere with a good review of the geometry? (have tried google)


People looking for a more relaxed ride seem to go for the fm028.

Racers head for the fm015. Not sure about the fm066, fm039 and fm098, but I'd say the fm066 is racer and fm039, fm098 are leaning toward racing as well.

As above though head over to roadbikereview, hundreds of pages to read through (took me about 2 weeks).


Thanks for that, guess i'll need a couple of days off and a few beers!

It seems both frames and wheels come in underweight reasonably often, why is this and does it concern anyone?
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby PawPaw » Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:58 pm

If anyone is interested in a bulk order with Farsports, maybe you could post it here. I've developed quite a rapport with 'Smart', and he is open to such a deal.
I'd be happy to liaise in the first instance, to get something rolling.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby brawlo » Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:26 pm

Hey Paw Paw, do Farsports do track wheels?

I'd be interested in a 50mm 28/28 CXray set if they do.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby PawPaw » Sat Jun 16, 2012 10:55 pm

brawlo wrote:Hey Paw Paw, do Farsports do track wheels?

I'd be interested in a 50mm 28/28 CXray set if they do.


Mate, I don't know. but just had a squiz at their website, and they have 5 carbon spoke wheels with around 60cm rims.
http://www.farsports.cn/ViewProduct.aspx?id=522

Suggest you fire an email to Smart
[email protected]

Let him know Pawpaw from "Bicycle Network Australia" forum recommended you email him. He'll know who I am.
I've been trying to get him to understand how much business comes from internet forums, and how to keep forum customers happy through more reliable website information, manufacturing standards, despatch etc. and he seems to understand, but is still not beyond giving slack excuses.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby PawPaw » Sun Jun 17, 2012 9:09 pm

Did a lighter Sunday group ride today, after a 65km handicap road race yesterday arvo.
Nevertheless, I still had a bit of pep, and put in a few 45+km efforts, one of which was along Sandgate Rd.
I got a red light late, and decided to brake hard rather than run it.
I was leading a pack of 6 and everyone behind me got a face full of lingering burning rubber.

Seems the Farsports blue brake pads supplied with my CCs can't be too hard a compound.
First time I've ever smelt burning rubber from brake pads.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby liamb » Sun Jun 17, 2012 9:58 pm

Hi All

Have been having a keen look around at these various frames from various companies and am super keen to get started on building myself a light hill climber. Does anyone have a good recomendation on a light strong frame??. I am vertically challanged (165cm tall) and am looking at fitting Shimano grear.

Cheers

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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby ray » Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:45 pm

brawlo wrote:Hey Paw Paw, do Farsports do track wheels?

I'd be interested in a 50mm 28/28 CXray set if they do.


They do - I placed an order for a set about 2 weeks ago with a 15-20 day ETA.

My order is based on the FSC-50CM wheelset (20/24) http://www.farsports.cn/ViewProduct.aspx?id=685 but with track hubs. I wanted to use lighter hubs than what they had on offer because I won't be using it for track just general road riding and commuting. The hubs that they have are the Novatec 565SBT/566SBT (comes in fixed/free configuration and black only - see http://www.farsports.cn/ViewProduct.aspx?id=711). I think drillings could be limited to F20/R24 but I would confirm with Farsports. I enquired about getting some Yuhub: RC-F01AB/RC-R03AB 28/32/36H - 138g/148g = 286g (doesn't use track nuts instead allen key bolt on) or Novatec: A265SBT/A266SBT 20F-24-36H - 157g/217g = 374g small flange but unfortunately min. order quantity (e.g. 100) and no samples with Yubub or Novatec. Before going with what they have in-stock, one option I was thinking about was to purchase my own hubs and send it to them or purchase rim/spokes only and build.

So my build will be 50mm clincher rim with basalt brake track, 3k matt finish, Sapim CX-Ray spokes, external nipples in red, front radial lacing and rear 2x on both sides (be sure to specify the lacing for the rear as they would by default have 2 x on DS and radial on NDS which is strange give you are likely to flip the wheel or use them for track). Estimated total weight is 1640g +/- 30g. The 50mm alloy wheelset they will be replacing came to approximately 3.3kg - a big saving.

My contact was Johnston ( [email protected] )
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby PawPaw » Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:54 pm

Sorry Brawlo, I totally misunderstood what you meant.
I thought you were after disc and carbon spoke wheels for the track.

A mate recently enquired about 28H 50mm rims and Farsport say they can't do them.
I wonder if so many spokes are necessary with a carbon rim anyways.
A larger number may weaken a carbon rim more than strengthen the overall wheel performance.

edit: I hit a reasonable pothole during a handicap road race yesterday with my wheels.
I certainly felt the shock go right through the bike.
I checked the carbon rim and spoke holes very carefully and there's no sign of cracking or de-lamination.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby ray » Sun Jun 17, 2012 11:17 pm

PawPaw wrote:...
A mate recently enquired about 28H 50mm rims and Farsport say they can't do them.
I wonder if so many spokes are necessary with a carbon rim anyways.
A larger number may weaken a carbon rim more than strengthen the overall wheel performance.
...


Interesting, was reading a blog entry http://www.novemberbicycles.com/blog/2012/5/23/the-wrong-tool-for-the-job.html from November Bicycles about a 240 pound guy who luckily only ended up with warped carbon rims after using them for a very long, steep descent in a mass participation event when warned explicitly against using them in this type of ride and course. As a result November will only sell wheels in a 20/24 configuration (previously had a 24/28 option I think for heavier riders) as they are plenty strong for the most powerful of sprinters but will discourage buyers heavier than the 210 pounds weight limit.

On a side note I'm only 59kg (130 pounds) so on the light side to be able to ride most wheelsets without worrying about the weight limit.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby brawlo » Mon Jun 18, 2012 8:25 am

PawPaw wrote:Sorry Brawlo, I totally misunderstood what you meant.
I thought you were after disc and carbon spoke wheels for the track.

A mate recently enquired about 28H 50mm rims and Farsport say they can't do them.
I wonder if so many spokes are necessary with a carbon rim anyways.
A larger number may weaken a carbon rim more than strengthen the overall wheel performance.

edit: I hit a reasonable pothole during a handicap road race yesterday with my wheels.
I certainly felt the shock go right through the bike.
I checked the carbon rim and spoke holes very carefully and there's no sign of cracking or de-lamination.


Bugger hey. As it turns out a meet with a bike fitter puts the wheels on the backburner now anyway. 2 new cranksets are now needed. Ouch!

I was hoping as they will do the CXray build. There was a heavy guy that got a 32/32 set on the RBR forums. Going to go back and do some trolling to try and find out where he got them from and keep them in my bookmarks for later. Still keen but they might be 6 months or more away now.

I just might have to go back to plan A and buy the rims and do the build myself. I am heavy at 120kg now. I know some makers are fine with that, especially for the track. Not too many potholes there, and no risk of delamination from brake heat. The more spokes the better for a heavy sprinter too, and 28 would be my minimum for a rear wheel.

I'll just have to sit back and keep tabs on things. Just hoping now that before I start looking seriously again, that some maker starts doing 23mm wide clinchers. That would be great!
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby Big Lance » Mon Jun 18, 2012 9:26 am

PawPaw wrote:If anyone is interested in a bulk order with Farsports, maybe you could post it here. I've developed quite a rapport with 'Smart', and he is open to such a deal.
I'd be happy to liaise in the first instance, to get something rolling.

I'll get in on that please.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby PawPaw » Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:42 am

ray wrote:Interesting, was reading a blog entry http://www.novemberbicycles.com/blog/2012/5/23/the-wrong-tool-for-the-job.html from November Bicycles


thanks for that link Ray. Good reading to keep in context the physical limits of carbon rims. I've found it difficult to get beneath the marketing and industry hype about carbon products. Obviously wheel manufacturers are not interested in publishing the objective limitations of their products.

My goal is to keep using my Farsports 50mm cc's for all purposes (race, group, randonneur), and see how they wear. However, now, if I know I'm going to do a lot of descents, I'll ride alloy. I weigh 85, so I'd generate more brake heat than a sub 75kg guy on steeper descents.
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Re: Chinese carbon frame and wheels thread

Postby PawPaw » Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:54 pm

Big Lance wrote:I'll get in on that please.


After thinking about it, rather than wait for a group of people to come forth, and put in a common order, I thought it might be easier if everyone contacts Smart via his email address [email protected] , and mention you are a BNA member, and PawPaw said to contact you re a discounted order. At this point the discount would be small. To get a bigger one, I presume they will want 6+ orders, but this may take several months to materialize via the BNA forum.

Smart already knows several people from BNA forum have bought wheels. The more we bring it to his attention how much business is being generated through info sharing on the forum, the more seriously BNA members will be taken as customers. BTW, I am not getting kick backs.
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