[TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

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[TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby bigfriendlyvegan » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:28 am

Last night, Simon Gerrans won the stage (yay!), and seeing the finish from overhead it was a little different from the normal bunch sprints I've seen. Gerrans was behind his leadout man (Impe?) and Sagan was behind him. Sagan started to come around on the left and Gerrans looked over his shoulder. As he looked, he dropped back a bit then accelerated forward, past and won with Sagan behind him.

Sherwin (I think) said that he dropped off the wheel a bit deliberately, then rode into the back wheel and slingshot around Impe. Is this a "thing"? Or did he just drop back because he was having a look at Sagan? I know how slipstreaming works and how to come around riders (I race track), but I haven't noticed the slingshot as described by Sherwin, but maybe I'm simply wasn't paying attention to it. I certainly haven't felt the effect, but then again, I'm not the fastest rider in the field.

So, is the slingshot thing real?
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by BNA » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:43 am

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Re: Slingshot?

Postby vander » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:43 am

Watch track team sprints, happens all the time. Smart move by Gerro.

The aim is to accelerate into the slipstream (get a bit more acceleration) before coming out and around. It also helps to prevent being boxed in.

Doesnt often happen in bunch sprints because if you leave 1mm someone will steal the wheel, or if you slow down you will have missed the kick and someone will come around you. Or there is someone else sprinting on the other side of the road. In a small group it works well if it plays out right. It looked like people reacted to Gerro kicking rather than going first. I think if that situation was run another 10times Gerro would not win it again.

If Sagan didnt throw his bike too early I think he would of won.
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Re: Slingshot?

Postby bigfriendlyvegan » Tue Jul 02, 2013 12:03 pm

Thanks, Daniel. Now I know it's real I'll keep an eye out for it.
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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby thearthurdog » Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:56 pm

Yes it's a completely standard maneuver especially if you have a quality lead out as Gerrans did on this occasion. Also known as 'running at' someone.
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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby Philipthelam » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:12 pm

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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby bigfriendlyvegan » Tue Jul 02, 2013 6:52 pm

Philipthelam wrote:do you mean this? http://www.cyclingtipsblog.com/2008/12/ ... the-wheel/


Yep, that's what I meant. I've been picking up bits and pieces by watching and chatting with people who know better at the track, but this one hadn't been pointed out to me. Always keen to learn new tricks.
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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby thearthurdog » Wed Jul 03, 2013 6:16 am

^^ the trick to that one is also to be able to jam your 11 cog at 2000 watts. It's a maneuver that you need to have the ability to pull off.
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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby brawlo » Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:00 am

Your size may work against your ability to try this on. First you need someone big enough to provide you with a good draft, and then you need that draft to assist from a bit further back. Once someone of your size drops back from a smaller rider you are really working hard to stay there. I can ride behind the moto up around 50 fairly comfortably, but if I sit 2nd or further rider back, I find I really have to work a lot harder. My size kills a lot of draft advantage, while giving all the advantage to those happily sitting behind me :?
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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby bigfriendlyvegan » Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:37 am

True that. I'm a natural wind barrier for everyone behind me and I can lead out when I have to, but there are a couple of guys in my normal fields who are a bit bigger than me, the problem is they're also faster than me (then again, almost everyone is faster than me).
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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby foo on patrol » Fri Jul 05, 2013 4:24 pm

You charge at the rear wheel and flick out at the last moment and stay as close to the rider as possible. Think wash and wake from a boat and you will understand what I'm talking about. :wink:

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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby foo on patrol » Fri Jul 05, 2013 4:26 pm

brawlo wrote:Your size may work against your ability to try this on. First you need someone big enough to provide you with a good draft, and then you need that draft to assist from a bit further back. Once someone of your size drops back from a smaller rider you are really working hard to stay there. I can ride behind the moto up around 50 fairly comfortably, but if I sit 2nd or further rider back, I find I really have to work a lot harder. My size kills a lot of draft advantage, while giving all the advantage to those happily sitting behind me :?


This is why, you should train with the MB and drop off and practice the charge and flick. :idea:

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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby scotto » Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:05 pm

bigfriendlyvegan wrote:.....So, is the slingshot thing real?

that explains a bit ;)

expect to see quicker overtaking now at the track.
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Re: [TDF spoiler warning] Slingshot?

Postby Astanal » Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:19 pm

I think it works in two ways:

1. By moving back a bit, the angles of the path that Gerrans needed to take to get around Impey are smoother which means he is able to maintain momentum.

2. By sitting back a bit before he opens his sprint, his kick seems more dramatic. This is because his speed increases by him sprinting, and also by him riding across the zone of lowest aerodynamic drag. This means its harder for Sagan to stay on his wheel and may result in Gerrans getting a bit of a gap on Sagan.
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