Titanium

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Re: Titanium

Postby barefoot » Mon Oct 07, 2013 9:42 am

scirocco wrote:I suspect that what happens is that they don't just pick tubing that is really thick and strong. Cost is everything with Ti, and to keep the cost down on the low end versions, they deliberately select a size down (in diameter and thickness) from the higher spec models. This is not quite thick enough to be really stiff where it needs to be, and it's not quite thin enough to save weight where you can get away with less stiffness. Kind of the worst of both worlds. But good enough to market as "the fantastic ride of titanium". (And it is).

To be fair, this may not be all that big an effect. Probably you get more stiffness from oversized bottom brackets and head tubes. And you don't get those on "budget" Ti, again, because that costs more than just welding straight gauge tubes together.


That doesn't play out this way when ordering a Ti frame from the big Chinese custom shops (XACD in my case).

Within reason, the customer is free to spec whatever tube spec they want, for no change in price. Straight-gauge only, of course (butted tubing is an extra cost, because the butting process is expensive), and restricted to standard tube sizes and thicknesses. I went for "standard" 38.1 x 0.9mm downtube, for example, but others have gone fatter (I've seen up to 50.8mm), and some people up the thickness to 1.2mm if they think they'll need it.

Things like integrated or tapered head tube cost more, I assume because they need to be machined out of a very thick chunk of material - which is expensive in both material and process.

Butting tubes gives a typical option of 0.9 - 0.6 - 0.9mm wall thickness. So you save 0.3mm thickness in the centre section (you need the thicker ends for weldability)... for whatever weight benefit that gives. My rough calcs say you'll drop about 15g off the downtube by going butted. Expensive way to shave weight, IMO.

tim
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by BNA » Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:23 pm

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Re: Titanium

Postby autumn acid » Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:23 pm

Sorry for the late follow up.

Well, after toying with the idea of titanium and a good performance orientated cf bike, I had the opportunity to test ride both. In this case, it was the Rivet Resolutus (titanium) and a Specialized Tarmac Pro SL4. Both are wildly different machines, each with their own merits.

TheTarmac feels like a purpose built speed weapon. It is very clinical in its approach. Super stiff and power transfer is immediate. It feels exceptionally light. What you see is what you get, basically.

The Rivet is a little more compliant but the geometry is still very race focused. Road feel is absolutely sublime. I also really enjoyed the handling. It really felt confident. I'd even go as far as saying the bike had character.

I understand the basic premise of each bike, though.

Both are fantastic bikes. To be honest, I'd love both, but decided to go for the Rivet because I just really enjoyed the ride. It left an impression on me. Otherwise, I'm glad I satisfied my curiosity. I'm a 27 year old, most of my cycling buddies ride top of the line cf machines so it's actually psychologically difficult not to go down the track.
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Re: Titanium

Postby 1q2w3e4r » Mon Oct 14, 2013 7:10 pm

I've got a couple of Madone's from a few years back and two Ti bikes (Baum Corretto and Moots RSL) I really enjoy the Ti bikes for the reasons you've stated, they ride fantastic and are stiff as well. Custom geometry is a nice plus.

Enjoy the new bike when you get it! Keep the rubber side down :)
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Re: Titanium

Postby Mick Dee » Thu Oct 24, 2013 4:34 pm

autumn acid wrote:Sorry for the late follow up.


Both are fantastic bikes. To be honest, I'd love both, but decided to go for the Rivet because I just really enjoyed the ride. It left an impression on me. Otherwise, I'm glad I satisfied my curiosity. I'm a 27 year old, most of my cycling buddies ride top of the line cf machines so it's actually psychologically difficult not to go down the track.


Hi

Seriously thinking of a Rivet too. I'd be racing mine mostly. Would you consider it responsive, without too much flex? Any other comments appreciated.

Cheers
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Re: Titanium

Postby autumn acid » Fri Oct 25, 2013 2:09 pm

Hi Mick, that's really difficult to assess without all other things being even. I couldn't really say to be honest. It felt very direct though, and I could not feel any noticeable flex or otherwise.

I recommend a test ride.

To put it in perspective though, this bike will be thrashed within an inch of its life for training, crits and long rides and it is being designed around this philosophy. :)
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Re: Titanium

Postby Mick Dee » Fri Oct 25, 2013 3:33 pm

Thanks mate, that's the precisely the use I'll be putting mine too! Are you going the custom fit?

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Re: Titanium

Postby autumn acid » Mon Oct 28, 2013 7:43 am

Custom fit, I've done a BG fit with velofix before which totally rectified a few issues I was having so I have no qualms having total faith in Anthony's judgement.
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