How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby zill » Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:41 am

ironhanglider wrote:
zill wrote:
I won't be at A grade level in 3 months time (being at racing weight doesn't automatically mean A grade) but hopefully B grade (fitness but not skill) level (and that is why I am starting in D grade). Actually, I love to race and often try to race anyone that look fast every time I go out riding or commuting. However, I don't want to do it formally yet. I take formal racing very seriously and feel that physically and mentally I am not ready now. When I do enter into regular crits, it might turn out that I hate racing in a bunch in which case I will only enter in time trial races.

I actually have started a topic on power
viewtopic.php?f=43&t=75281

What I really want to achieve is a high 20 min watt/kg (purely for personal satisfaction).


Crits are a bad way to get into bunch racing. You need to be good at riding in a bunch before you enter your first crit, particularly at Kew which whilst it only has one tight corner there is not a lot of room to recover from someone messing it up. Someone like Jules21 will have a better idea of how often that occurs but my experience there was that someone would touch a pedal on that corner at least once every race, although it didn't always send them off line. The fight for position going into that corner could be pretty intense too.


That is why I want to start out in D grade crits so that I can ride at the back and then fly past them in the second last or last laps (hence the need to be very fit) :D

What group races in Melbourne do you recommend for someone who is inexperienced in bunch racing?
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by BNA » Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:29 pm

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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby GAV!N » Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:29 pm

If you're inexperienced at riding in a bunch, I would suggest not racing yet. Go and find some local groups to ride with / shop rides/ coffee rides etc. This will get your basics down first. Diving straight in to a race with no bunch experience is a disaster waiting to happen, for both yourself, and the others you bring down with you. Don't think it won't happen, but when it does, it's nice to know it was entirely your own fault...
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby mikesbytes » Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:47 pm

zill wrote:
mikesbytes wrote:It told me my idea weight was my current weight

As it doesn't ask you your height, is it saying that midgets and basketball players should be the same weight?


So you currently have very low body fat? How does it feel having such low body fat? Are you natural this way or strictly diet and exercise?

I wouldn't consider my body fat levels to be low, unless you are comparing it with the general population rather than what is ideal. Optimum perhaps

My diet consists of eating a lot of food that is good for you and a bit of junk. The better your food knowledge the smarter you eat. No doubt my diet will be better in the future as ones food knowledge improves.

I do a lot of exercise
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby dalai47 » Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:05 pm

GAV!N wrote:Diving straight in to a race with no bunch experience is a disaster waiting to happen, for both yourself, and the others you bring down with you.


^^^^This^^^^

I am still recovering from my collarbone broken on the velodrome before Easter and still off the bike at least another 6 weeks due to this! Because there weren't enough of us in A grade for the night, they grouped us with B grade on the track for the first race. Young guy who was fast enough to have made it to B grade but not experienced enough to handle the bike properly was racing... He got too close to the rider in front of him and crashed right in front of me resulting in me going over him and the bars at 55km/hr! So I'm out from racing for months, out of pocket for a few $1000's for the operation even once I get back money from the Insurance and also need to replace my written off track bike; all because someone didn't progress slowly through the apprenticeship phase!
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby singlespeedscott » Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:28 pm

dalai47 wrote:
GAV!N wrote:Diving straight in to a race with no bunch experience is a disaster waiting to happen, for both yourself, and the others you bring down with you.


^^^^This^^^^

I am still recovering from my collarbone broken on the velodrome before Easter and still off the bike at least another 6 weeks due to this! Because there weren't enough of us in A grade for the night, they grouped us with B grade on the track for the first race. Young guy who was fast enough to have made it to B grade but not experienced enough to handle the bike properly was racing... He got too close to the rider in front of him and crashed right in front of me resulting in me going over him and the bars at 55km/hr! So I'm out from racing for months, out of pocket for a few $1000's for the operation even once I get back money from the Insurance and also need to replace my written off track bike; all because someone didn't progress slowly through the apprenticeship phase!

Alternatively they dropped you down a grade. Racing has crashes. It's a fact. No matter the grade. You have to be willing to accept the risks. It's not a matter of if you will crash but when you will crash. I have seen plenty of A grade crashes for the same simple wheel rub.
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby zill » Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:14 am

mikesbytes wrote:
zill wrote:
mikesbytes wrote:It told me my idea weight was my current weight

As it doesn't ask you your height, is it saying that midgets and basketball players should be the same weight?


So you currently have very low body fat? How does it feel having such low body fat? Are you natural this way or strictly diet and exercise?

I wouldn't consider my body fat levels to be low, unless you are comparing it with the general population rather than what is ideal. Optimum perhaps

My diet consists of eating a lot of food that is good for you and a bit of junk. The better your food knowledge the smarter you eat. No doubt my diet will be better in the future as ones food knowledge improves.

I do a lot of exercise


It seems that the ideal racing weight is about 5-6% of your body weight. Is that how much fat you have?

How often would you eat junk?
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby dalai47 » Wed Jun 25, 2014 7:49 am

singlespeedscott wrote:Alternatively they dropped you down a grade. Racing has crashes. It's a fact. No matter the grade. You have to be willing to accept the risks. It's not a matter of if you will crash but when you will crash. I have seen plenty of A grade crashes for the same simple wheel rub.


I realise there is a risk of crashing at any grade - this wasn't caused by a touch of wheels though, he steered down onto the duckboard in the middle of the turn and his wheel washed out.
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby mikesbytes » Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:11 am

Last time I had my BF measured was 20 years ago. I would guess its around 10% which isn't too bad for a M5 rider but certainly not in the league of 5-6%. By cycling standards I'm fairly muscular and weigh in between 78 and 80kg, which means that I need to generate 10-15% more power in a climb to stay with the climbers. Of course the extra power comes in handy where weight is not an issue, such as crits or track.
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby GAV!N » Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:28 am

zill wrote:
I do a lot of exercise


It seems that the ideal racing weight is about 5-6% of your body weight. Is that how much fat you have?

How often would you eat junk?[/quote]

Zill. I just want to confirm that you heeded the comments regarding racing with no bunch experience. Yes, there is a risk of crashing in any grade. Just look at the pro peleton. But before you start looking at getting your body fat to 5-6%, just start riding with some bunches, then move in to racing, then move up in grades, and THEN you can start thinking about body composition. Get the basics down first. You really don't want to be the one responsible for breaking your own plus several other bikes worth thousands of dollars, plus potentially injuring yourself and others, knowing that rather than thinking about jumping straight in to A or B grade at 5% body fat, you should have just been enjoying a friendly bunch ride and learning the basics of bunch riding. You can't learn this stuff online...
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby Xplora » Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:08 am

Please reread Gavin's post. Then reread it.

TL:DR Get the licence. Start racing. If you really feel strong now, just ride in A grade, and try to hang on. If your goal is to race A, then riding at the back of A, and trying to stay with them until the bunch sprint will develop your fitness and skills quite safely. You'll be on the back the whole time suffering. That's OK as long as you don't want prize money :lol:

Just for some perspective on "riding experience".

Xplora has commuted well over 20000kms over the past 2-3 years, on very busy rat runs in the dark and the day. Done the bunch ride almost every Saturday for 2 years before starting to race in October. Competitive in the final 5km blowtorch sprint to the coffee shop, which included strong riders at the top of the MTB Elites in Sydney, regular A grade winners/parttime NRS. Held my own against some classy A graders in some other group rides. Quite good at rolling turns safely. Great resume. Right?

My racing style is breakaways and sometimes an attacking breakaway :lol: . I don't have a thundering sprint (and my guess is neither will you, zill, at your height and weight) but my TT fitness is reasonably good. I started in D for one race, almost overtook all of C grade competing for the prime. I took off half a lap early and they didn't chase me, came 3rd for the C grade prime as well. (didn't understand the prime lap) What a moron. Anyways, after promoting myself because I don't like sandbagging I attacked a few weeks later on the prime lap with a couple other riders (who have been winning B grade since LOL) and I ended up riding into a guy's wheel and brought down the bunch after falling off the back of the break and really being unable to control the bike while fatigued.

Poor Steve was a barked up mess, with his bike tangled in mine, it costs me a hundred bucks in spokes, truing and RD hangers, and I have since realised that my bike handling skills, despite THOUSANDS of hours in the saddle, including extremely tight pacelining on the weekend, are pretty crap. My handling abilities are so poor that I don't feel comfortable going around corners in the pack. Even big wide tracks like the Grand Prix circuit (20 across can be done).

Your plan of racing D and launching a winning break is not going to develop racing bunch skills. You learn them in the final kilometre, that's where things get ugly. Rolling around the track waiting for the sprint is easy, no one is fighting you for position, no one is worried about losing speed.

I SHOULD have started racing a full year earlier. I would have been stuck in C grade longer but I would have been much better at managing the bunch sprint because I lacked the fitness to toy with the bunch and attack them all mercilessly.
(BTW you know that you'll be hated if you choose to sandbag, right? They know if you're capable of riding in a higher grade, but they don't really notice how crappy you are at riding unless you crash a few times. You'll be forced to ride up, or you'll feel pressured to ride up. I've been told to "(*^ OFF TO B GRADE" quite forcefully after my second strong win in a row. Sprinters, man, they just don't like the time triallers :lol: )
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby zill » Wed Jun 25, 2014 8:41 pm

GAV!N wrote:
zill wrote:
I do a lot of exercise


It seems that the ideal racing weight is about 5-6% of your body weight. Is that how much fat you have?

How often would you eat junk?

Zill. I just want to confirm that you heeded the comments regarding racing with no bunch experience. Yes, there is a risk of crashing in any grade. Just look at the pro peleton. But before you start looking at getting your body fat to 5-6%, just start riding with some bunches, then move in to racing, then move up in grades, and THEN you can start thinking about body composition. Get the basics down first. You really don't want to be the one responsible for breaking your own plus several other bikes worth thousands of dollars, plus potentially injuring yourself and others, knowing that rather than thinking about jumping straight in to A or B grade at 5% body fat, you should have just been enjoying a friendly bunch ride and learning the basics of bunch riding. You can't learn this stuff online...


Yes, I know all about crashes. In fact, I lost 2 years of riding from a crash due of psychological reasons ( too scared to ride the bike - I am very risk averse). Problem was I gained a lot of weight as a result and now I am back and more determined than before.

I don't think I will try to ride in the middle of a pack in a race unless if it's a really small group of riders. Maybe racing is not for me in which case I will just concentrate on my own fitness (for fun).
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby zill » Wed Jun 25, 2014 8:48 pm

Xplora wrote:Please reread Gavin's post. Then reread it.

TL:DR Get the licence. Start racing. If you really feel strong now, just ride in A grade, and try to hang on. If your goal is to race A, then riding at the back of A, and trying to stay with them until the bunch sprint will develop your fitness and skills quite safely. You'll be on the back the whole time suffering. That's OK as long as you don't want prize money :lol:

Just for some perspective on "riding experience".

Xplora has commuted well over 20000kms over the past 2-3 years, on very busy rat runs in the dark and the day. Done the bunch ride almost every Saturday for 2 years before starting to race in October. Competitive in the final 5km blowtorch sprint to the coffee shop, which included strong riders at the top of the MTB Elites in Sydney, regular A grade winners/parttime NRS. Held my own against some classy A graders in some other group rides. Quite good at rolling turns safely. Great resume. Right?

My racing style is breakaways and sometimes an attacking breakaway :lol: . I don't have a thundering sprint (and my guess is neither will you, zill, at your height and weight) but my TT fitness is reasonably good. I started in D for one race, almost overtook all of C grade competing for the prime. I took off half a lap early and they didn't chase me, came 3rd for the C grade prime as well. (didn't understand the prime lap) What a moron. Anyways, after promoting myself because I don't like sandbagging I attacked a few weeks later on the prime lap with a couple other riders (who have been winning B grade since LOL) and I ended up riding into a guy's wheel and brought down the bunch after falling off the back of the break and really being unable to control the bike while fatigued.

Poor Steve was a barked up mess, with his bike tangled in mine, it costs me a hundred bucks in spokes, truing and RD hangers, and I have since realised that my bike handling skills, despite THOUSANDS of hours in the saddle, including extremely tight pacelining on the weekend, are pretty crap. My handling abilities are so poor that I don't feel comfortable going around corners in the pack. Even big wide tracks like the Grand Prix circuit (20 across can be done).

Your plan of racing D and launching a winning break is not going to develop racing bunch skills. You learn them in the final kilometre, that's where things get ugly. Rolling around the track waiting for the sprint is easy, no one is fighting you for position, no one is worried about losing speed.

I SHOULD have started racing a full year earlier. I would have been stuck in C grade longer but I would have been much better at managing the bunch sprint because I lacked the fitness to toy with the bunch and attack them all mercilessly.
(BTW you know that you'll be hated if you choose to sandbag, right? They know if you're capable of riding in a higher grade, but they don't really notice how crappy you are at riding unless you crash a few times. You'll be forced to ride up, or you'll feel pressured to ride up. I've been told to "(*^ OFF TO B GRADE" quite forcefully after my second strong win in a row. Sprinters, man, they just don't like the time triallers :lol: )


True, I am all about breakaways and dislike sprints. I am not after race wins but just want to increase push my fitness levels. If I can get to 5% body fat and with an A grade level watts/kg in 20min then for me, I have won! So racing isn't all that important to me but I do realize that racing will improve your fitness level and that is the only reason why I would like to race at all.
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby GAV!N » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:33 am

zill wrote:
Xplora wrote:Please reread Gavin's post. Then reread it.

TL:DR Get the licence. Start racing. If you really feel strong now, just ride in A grade, and try to hang on. If your goal is to race A, then riding at the back of A, and trying to stay with them until the bunch sprint will develop your fitness and skills quite safely. You'll be on the back the whole time suffering. That's OK as long as you don't want prize money :lol:

Just for some perspective on "riding experience".

Xplora has commuted well over 20000kms over the past 2-3 years, on very busy rat runs in the dark and the day. Done the bunch ride almost every Saturday for 2 years before starting to race in October. Competitive in the final 5km blowtorch sprint to the coffee shop, which included strong riders at the top of the MTB Elites in Sydney, regular A grade winners/parttime NRS. Held my own against some classy A graders in some other group rides. Quite good at rolling turns safely. Great resume. Right?

My racing style is breakaways and sometimes an attacking breakaway :lol: . I don't have a thundering sprint (and my guess is neither will you, zill, at your height and weight) but my TT fitness is reasonably good. I started in D for one race, almost overtook all of C grade competing for the prime. I took off half a lap early and they didn't chase me, came 3rd for the C grade prime as well. (didn't understand the prime lap) What a moron. Anyways, after promoting myself because I don't like sandbagging I attacked a few weeks later on the prime lap with a couple other riders (who have been winning B grade since LOL) and I ended up riding into a guy's wheel and brought down the bunch after falling off the back of the break and really being unable to control the bike while fatigued.

Poor Steve was a barked up mess, with his bike tangled in mine, it costs me a hundred bucks in spokes, truing and RD hangers, and I have since realised that my bike handling skills, despite THOUSANDS of hours in the saddle, including extremely tight pacelining on the weekend, are pretty crap. My handling abilities are so poor that I don't feel comfortable going around corners in the pack. Even big wide tracks like the Grand Prix circuit (20 across can be done).

Your plan of racing D and launching a winning break is not going to develop racing bunch skills. You learn them in the final kilometre, that's where things get ugly. Rolling around the track waiting for the sprint is easy, no one is fighting you for position, no one is worried about losing speed.

I SHOULD have started racing a full year earlier. I would have been stuck in C grade longer but I would have been much better at managing the bunch sprint because I lacked the fitness to toy with the bunch and attack them all mercilessly.
(BTW you know that you'll be hated if you choose to sandbag, right? They know if you're capable of riding in a higher grade, but they don't really notice how crappy you are at riding unless you crash a few times. You'll be forced to ride up, or you'll feel pressured to ride up. I've been told to "(*^ OFF TO B GRADE" quite forcefully after my second strong win in a row. Sprinters, man, they just don't like the time triallers :lol: )


True, I am all about breakaways and dislike sprints. I am not after race wins but just want to increase push my fitness levels. If I can get to 5% body fat and with an A grade level watts/kg in 20min then for me, I have won! So racing isn't all that important to me but I do realize that racing will improve your fitness level and that is the only reason why I would like to race at all.


Not necessarily. Training will improve your fitness level. Racing will improve your race skills and race speed. There's nothing to say you can't push yourself just as hard in training, if not more. In a race you'll find yourself sucking wheel a lot of the time and therefore putting down less power for a large amount of time. I think you need to think about what you really want. If you don't like sprints, and you don't want to ride mid bunch like you've said, then racing might not be for you. If you are only using it to get to 5% body fat, then there are probably better avenues to take...
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby zill » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:54 am

GAV!N wrote:
zill wrote:
Xplora wrote:Please reread Gavin's post. Then reread it.

TL:DR Get the licence. Start racing. If you really feel strong now, just ride in A grade, and try to hang on. If your goal is to race A, then riding at the back of A, and trying to stay with them until the bunch sprint will develop your fitness and skills quite safely. You'll be on the back the whole time suffering. That's OK as long as you don't want prize money :lol:

Just for some perspective on "riding experience".

Xplora has commuted well over 20000kms over the past 2-3 years, on very busy rat runs in the dark and the day. Done the bunch ride almost every Saturday for 2 years before starting to race in October. Competitive in the final 5km blowtorch sprint to the coffee shop, which included strong riders at the top of the MTB Elites in Sydney, regular A grade winners/parttime NRS. Held my own against some classy A graders in some other group rides. Quite good at rolling turns safely. Great resume. Right?

My racing style is breakaways and sometimes an attacking breakaway :lol: . I don't have a thundering sprint (and my guess is neither will you, zill, at your height and weight) but my TT fitness is reasonably good. I started in D for one race, almost overtook all of C grade competing for the prime. I took off half a lap early and they didn't chase me, came 3rd for the C grade prime as well. (didn't understand the prime lap) What a moron. Anyways, after promoting myself because I don't like sandbagging I attacked a few weeks later on the prime lap with a couple other riders (who have been winning B grade since LOL) and I ended up riding into a guy's wheel and brought down the bunch after falling off the back of the break and really being unable to control the bike while fatigued.

Poor Steve was a barked up mess, with his bike tangled in mine, it costs me a hundred bucks in spokes, truing and RD hangers, and I have since realised that my bike handling skills, despite THOUSANDS of hours in the saddle, including extremely tight pacelining on the weekend, are pretty crap. My handling abilities are so poor that I don't feel comfortable going around corners in the pack. Even big wide tracks like the Grand Prix circuit (20 across can be done).

Your plan of racing D and launching a winning break is not going to develop racing bunch skills. You learn them in the final kilometre, that's where things get ugly. Rolling around the track waiting for the sprint is easy, no one is fighting you for position, no one is worried about losing speed.

I SHOULD have started racing a full year earlier. I would have been stuck in C grade longer but I would have been much better at managing the bunch sprint because I lacked the fitness to toy with the bunch and attack them all mercilessly.
(BTW you know that you'll be hated if you choose to sandbag, right? They know if you're capable of riding in a higher grade, but they don't really notice how crappy you are at riding unless you crash a few times. You'll be forced to ride up, or you'll feel pressured to ride up. I've been told to "(*^ OFF TO B GRADE" quite forcefully after my second strong win in a row. Sprinters, man, they just don't like the time triallers :lol: )


True, I am all about breakaways and dislike sprints. I am not after race wins but just want to increase push my fitness levels. If I can get to 5% body fat and with an A grade level watts/kg in 20min then for me, I have won! So racing isn't all that important to me but I do realize that racing will improve your fitness level and that is the only reason why I would like to race at all.


Not necessarily. Training will improve your fitness level. Racing will improve your race skills and race speed. There's nothing to say you can't push yourself just as hard in training, if not more. In a race you'll find yourself sucking wheel a lot of the time and therefore putting down less power for a large amount of time. I think you need to think about what you really want. If you don't like sprints, and you don't want to ride mid bunch like you've said, then racing might not be for you. If you are only using it to get to 5% body fat, then there are probably better avenues to take...


But there is nothing like the thrill of racing someone! Also even when out training, I tend to push myself harder when there is someone (a stranger) I am trying to race against.

I do love cycling (though not riding in a group) and my goal is actually to be as fit a cyclist as possible (the dream is to get over 6 watts/kg over 20 minutes). I assume 5% body fat or lower is required for that optimum level for someone who isn't talented in the cardiovascular department?

Also what other avenues do you have in mind for reducing body fat? I am thinking of taking up another discipline to compliment cycling and get fitter. The thing I have in mind is doing workouts on a rowing machine.
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby dalai47 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:30 am

zill wrote:I assume 5% body fat or lower is required for that optimum level for someone who isn't extremely talented in the cardiovascular department?


Please stop assuming and do some research. 4–6% is generally considered a physiological minimum for human males to protect the internal organs[1]. Once you get that low you will be more susceptible to illnesses which will impact training. Also in the process of getting that low there will be some loss of muscle mass so also a loss of power...

Be wary of tests such as skin folds given these are open to variations due to the users ability and the number of measurements taken. Plus this method also only measures one type of fat: subcutaneous adipose tissue (fat under the skin) and not other body fat deposits such as visceral adipose tissue.

Just eat healthy, exercise and your body will find the healthy fat levels for you.

1. Friedl, KE; Moore RJ; Martinez-Lopez LE; Vogel JA; Askew EW; Marchitelli LJ; Hoyt RW; Gordon CC (August 1994). "Lower limit of body fat in healthy active men". J Appl Physiol. 77 (2): 933–40. PMID 8002550
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby dalai47 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:45 am

Please be wary of obsessively focusing on weight. Eating disorders are not just a female domain.

My professional sporting career had a much higher requirement for power to weight measurement than cycling and I would therefore obsessively watch my diet. I can personally say it isn't good from a mentally or physically perspective the obsess over diet. In some ways I am still managing the side effects of this...

Of the cyclists you often refer to, remember they are balancing that very fine line but unlike the general public have a huge team of sports doctors, nutritionists and support staff to monitor diet and health; even then note how often they get sick and pull out of races.
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby zill » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:51 am

dalai47 wrote:Please be wary of obsessively focusing on weight. Eating disorders are not just a female domain.

My professional sporting career had a much higher requirement for power to weight measurement than cycling and I would therefore obsessively watch my diet. I can personally say it isn't good from a mentally or physically perspective the obsess over diet. In some ways I am still managing the side effects of this...

Of the cyclists you often refer to, remember they are balancing that very fine line but unlike the general public have a huge team of sports doctors, nutritionists and support staff to monitor diet and health; even then note how often they get sick and pull out of races.


Which professional sporting career have you had or is in at the moment?
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby zill » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:56 am

I've actually had a DEXA scan done recently and got 14% body fat. What is the minimum healthy level that can be maintained throughout the year (without medical nor doctor intervention) for a non professional athlete do you think?
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby dalai47 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 10:07 am

It was Sport Climbing and a very long time ago - I officially retired back in 98! Since then I've focused on other sports; training and competing obsessively till injuries again keep moving me on. Now just train and race bikes and hopefully can stay injury free...
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby dalai47 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 10:31 am

zill wrote:What is the minimum healthy level that can be maintained throughout the year (without medical nor doctor intervention) for a non professional athlete do you think?


I'm not the person to ask as I try not to focus on this anymore. I would suggest seeing a sports nutritionist to answer all your questions. I used to go to OIympic Park Sports Medicine - but the person I saw now works for the US Olympic team in the States so can't refer you to her. I am sure though others there are just as good.
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby GAV!N » Thu Jun 26, 2014 1:05 pm

zill wrote:
But there is nothing like the thrill of racing someone! Also even when out training, I tend to push myself harder when there is someone (a stranger) I am trying to race against.

I do love cycling (though not riding in a group) and my goal is actually to be as fit a cyclist as possible (the dream is to get over 6 watts/kg over 20 minutes). I assume 5% body fat or lower is required for that optimum level for someone who isn't talented in the cardiovascular department?

Also what other avenues do you have in mind for reducing body fat? I am thinking of taking up another discipline to compliment cycling and get fitter. The thing I have in mind is doing workouts on a rowing machine.


You keep confusing me. One minute you're saying you don't want to race, not looking for wins, and don't enjoy riding in a bunch, next minute you're saying you do love racing and want to be at your 'ideal racing weight'. Again, you need to think about what you really want. If you simply want to get an extremely low body fat level, go and see a personal trainer & nutritionist & sports scientist and probably a whole lot more. Cycling alone isn't going to do it. I think you may be in some kind of dreamland. 6w/kg over 20 minutes is very high. Do not expect to do this without making cycling pretty much a full time career (you've already said you're not a professional athlete). Racing old mate up ahead on the road is not racing. You might be racing him, but is he racing you? 5% body is also extremely low! As stated above, borderline dangerous. Yeah maybe lance was at that when doing a Grand Tour, but you're not Lance, and you're not doing a grand tour.

From what you've said, you're around 73kg, at 14% body fat. This is a perfectly acceptable range to begin racing! What you need to decide is whether or not you actually WANT to race, or do you just want to lose weight? If you're not sure, my advice is just buy your licence, and start racing a low grade. If you win, they'll move you up. See if you like it. BUT, before you do this, go and get some bunch experience.

OK I'm done now. Good luck. I'm out...
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby zill » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:26 pm

GAV!N wrote:
zill wrote:
But there is nothing like the thrill of racing someone! Also even when out training, I tend to push myself harder when there is someone (a stranger) I am trying to race against.

I do love cycling (though not riding in a group) and my goal is actually to be as fit a cyclist as possible (the dream is to get over 6 watts/kg over 20 minutes). I assume 5% body fat or lower is required for that optimum level for someone who isn't talented in the cardiovascular department?

Also what other avenues do you have in mind for reducing body fat? I am thinking of taking up another discipline to compliment cycling and get fitter. The thing I have in mind is doing workouts on a rowing machine.


You keep confusing me. One minute you're saying you don't want to race, not looking for wins, and don't enjoy riding in a bunch, next minute you're saying you do love racing and want to be at your 'ideal racing weight'. Again, you need to think about what you really want. If you simply want to get an extremely low body fat level, go and see a personal trainer & nutritionist & sports scientist and probably a whole lot more. Cycling alone isn't going to do it. I think you may be in some kind of dreamland. 6w/kg over 20 minutes is very high. Do not expect to do this without making cycling pretty much a full time career (you've already said you're not a professional athlete). Racing old mate up ahead on the road is not racing. You might be racing him, but is he racing you? 5% body is also extremely low! As stated above, borderline dangerous. Yeah maybe lance was at that when doing a Grand Tour, but you're not Lance, and you're not doing a grand tour.

From what you've said, you're around 73kg, at 14% body fat. This is a perfectly acceptable range to begin racing! What you need to decide is whether or not you actually WANT to race, or do you just want to lose weight? If you're not sure, my advice is just buy your licence, and start racing a low grade. If you win, they'll move you up. See if you like it. BUT, before you do this, go and get some bunch experience.

OK I'm done now. Good luck. I'm out...


It seems you don't understand me and my circumstances very well which is alright as I am not your average rider.

I am in cycling for the long haul but my biological clock is ticking so happy to dedicate a lot of time into it for these few years. I will start racing not too distant in the future. Thanks for the advice.
zill
 
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby zill » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:32 pm

dalai47 wrote:
zill wrote:What is the minimum healthy level that can be maintained throughout the year (without medical nor doctor intervention) for a non professional athlete do you think?


I'm not the person to ask as I try not to focus on this anymore. I would suggest seeing a sports nutritionist to answer all your questions. I used to go to OIympic Park Sports Medicine - but the person I saw now works for the US Olympic team in the States so can't refer you to her. I am sure though others there are just as good.


Thanks for the recommendation. I'll check them out.
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby GAV!N » Fri Jun 27, 2014 8:45 am

zill wrote:
It seems you don't understand me and my circumstances very well which is alright as I am not your average rider.



Clearly... :roll:
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Re: How accurate is the calculator for ideal racing weight?

Postby happysumo » Fri Jun 27, 2014 8:58 am

Please start racing so you can stop these threads :lol:

1) You won't really know your weaknesses till you've started racing
2) Bodyweight is useless unless it's a hilltop finish after a 20 minute climb. 14% is fine. Eat healthy, train lots, and keep half an eye on the scales once or twice a week. That's really all you need to know. Most racing here is pretty flat, 80kg guys mixing it up with 65kg guys all the time.

For reals, just start racing already. Faffing about and trying to be in ideal shape before starting D grade is honestly a little useless. If your 'clock is ticking', you're way better off spending your time actually doing it rather than contemplating it. You can't learn jack on the internet.

6w/kg for 20 minutes is crazy. Like KOM'ing any local 20 minute climb on strava that a pro hasn't demolished. Nice to have a long term goal, but you need to break it down into achievable things that you can measure and reassess almost monthly.
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