Most durable tubular tires?

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Most durable tubular tires?

Postby zill » Sun Jun 29, 2014 11:18 pm

I've been using the Durano Plus on my old clincher and it worked really well. I recently purchased a pair of tubular carbon wheels and looking for a tubular tire of similar puncture resistance or better. Any suggestions?

Thanks.
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by BNA » Wed Jul 02, 2014 5:49 pm

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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby ironhanglider » Wed Jul 02, 2014 5:49 pm

Durability is an odd concept for tubular tyres. A lot will come down to the likelihood of puncture on any given ride. If you are riding the Kew boulevard with its tack attacks lately then thick and heavy clinchers would be a better bet.

Many people these days use some sort of sealant in their tubulars as a preventative in case they get a puncture. Others will carry the sealant with them and not use it until they get a puncture. Either way you should always carry a spare because sealants will not always work, depending on the size and location of the hole. Sealants also make it difficult to repair a puncture, so if you are one of the minority who choose to repair tyres, then it is best to not bother with them.

By far the majority of people who ride tubulars do so either for 'performance' or for 'feel'. There are a tiny minority who use tubulars because they are too cheap to buy a new set of wheels, they will also typically repair the tyres when they get a puncture too.

Durable tyres do not suit the goals of the majority. Puncture resistance and tread life come at a heavy cost in both performance and feel.

Reputably Tufo tyres which are a version of tubeless tyres at least work well with sealant, Continental sprinters get a good rap for durability too. Mind you they both get panned for their performance and feel such that many tubular snobs would wonder why you have tubular wheels if you want to use tyres that are no better than clinchers.

If you have the inclination to repair tyres then the yellow jersey tubulars are good value. They are both cheap to buy and easy to repair.


Cheers,
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby bosvit » Wed Jul 02, 2014 6:18 pm

You can get GP4000S in tubies as well as Gatorskins, which are commonly used as training tyres.

The Gatorskin tubies (in my opinion that is) seem to roll much better than the clincher version.
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby ValleyForge » Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:48 pm

The Veloflex Roubaix tubulars are always popular in, well the Paris-Roubaix! I normally ride Veloflex Servizio Corse and when I've swapped to the Roubaix, I've never had one puncture.
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby zill » Wed Jul 02, 2014 10:26 pm

According to this article, http://road.cc/content/news/80505-paris ... directions

So maybe tyres there are the most durable http://www.fmbtires.com/

Anybody used them?
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby open roader » Wed Jul 02, 2014 10:39 pm

zill wrote:Anybody used them?


Yep.

Have only started riding a pair of cotton casing FMB Paris Roubaix in the 25mm width. Less than 400km ridden so far - too early to tell about longevity. However, of all the tubular tyres I've tried, these provide the most comfortable ride and feel as nimble in the steering as narrower tyres despite running only 70 psi in the front.

At $150+ per tyre - twice the price of a Vittoria or a Conti, you will not get twice the durability or longevity but the ride quality is truly brilliant.
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby zill » Wed Jul 02, 2014 10:55 pm

open roader wrote:
zill wrote:Anybody used them?


Yep.

Have only started riding a pair of cotton casing FMB Paris Roubaix in the 25mm width. Less than 400km ridden so far - too early to tell about longevity. However, of all the tubular tyres I've tried, these provide the most comfortable ride and feel as nimble in the steering as narrower tyres despite running only 70 psi in the front.

At $150+ per tyre - twice the price of a Vittoria or a Conti, you will not get twice the durability or longevity but the ride quality is truly brilliant.


Oh wow. Must try them someday. What is the labour price that you pay to get them fitted in a shop for both wheels?

Also how long is the delivery?
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby ironhanglider » Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:39 pm

Never ever trust someone else to glue your tyres on.

No-one else cares about keeping your skin intact as much as you do.

Read this and you will be much better off.


The FMBs would be very fine tyres, however the European roads don't have nearly so much in the way of broken glass and goat head thorns as we get here. They would be terrific for the sorts of roads which I race on. I have worn a couple of tyres down to the casing, but I have race only wheels. Sometimes it takes many km for a piece of glass to work it's way through the casing and pierce the tube. I suspect that the majority of people who puncture during the races here, have actually brought their piece of glass with them as a result of riding in the city.

Tubulars ridden on suburban streets almost always die from an unrepairable puncture a long time before the tread wears out and it doesn't sound like you'd be repairing tubulars. For your purposes, durability will be directly linked to puncture resistance.

Cheers,

Cameron
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby zill » Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:59 pm

ironhanglider wrote:Never ever trust someone else to glue your tyres on.

No-one else cares about keeping your skin intact as much as you do.

Read this and you will be much better off.


The FMBs would be very fine tyres, however the European roads don't have nearly so much in the way of broken glass and goat head thorns as we get here. They would be terrific for the sorts of roads which I race on. I have worn a couple of tyres down to the casing, but I have race only wheels. Sometimes it takes many km for a piece of glass to work it's way through the casing and pierce the tube. I suspect that the majority of people who puncture during the races here, have actually brought their piece of glass with them as a result of riding in the city.

Tubulars ridden on suburban streets almost always die from an unrepairable puncture a long time before the tread wears out and it doesn't sound like you'd be repairing tubulars. For your purposes, durability will be directly linked to puncture resistance.

Cheers,

Cameron


How does the FMBs compare with Durano Plus clincher tires?
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby ValleyForge » Thu Jul 03, 2014 11:01 am

ironhanglider wrote:Never ever trust someone else to glue your tyres on.

No-one else cares about keeping your skin intact as much as you do.


+ several.
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby Cul » Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:16 pm

ValleyForge wrote:
ironhanglider wrote:Never ever trust someone else to glue your tyres on.

No-one else cares about keeping your skin intact as much as you do.


+ several.


+ Several More... Learn how to do your own glue job, it is not hard just takes a little practice not to get mess everywhere.
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby Thoglette » Thu Jul 03, 2014 4:45 pm

zill wrote:Oh wow. Must try them someday. What is the labour price that you pay to get them fitted in a shop for both wheels?


I only glue my own - but that's because I'm cheap. Someone who knows what they are doing should be able to glue two on in under an hour of effort.

Elapsed time will be longer (I prestretch on the rims, then there's waiting for tackiness once glue is put on. Then 24hrs later to see that it's all set nicely)
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby zill » Thu Jul 03, 2014 9:09 pm

Anyone tried the new SCHWALBE ONE?
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby ValleyForge » Fri Jul 04, 2014 9:01 am

Thoglette wrote:
zill wrote:Oh wow. Must try them someday. What is the labour price that you pay to get them fitted in a shop for both wheels?


I only glue my own - but that's because I'm cheap. Someone who knows what they are doing should be able to glue two on in under an hour of effort.

Elapsed time will be longer (I prestretch on the rims, then there's waiting for tackiness once glue is put on. Then 24hrs later to see that it's all set nicely)


More than 72 hr turnaround for me. Cleaning first - using acetone until the rim is spotless; sham tyre fit pumped up for about 72 hrs; glue both; wait 12hrs; reglue tyre; fit & pump up. Then wait 24hrs.

Usually it pays to do something really pointless while waiting - perhaps ring Telstra Customer Support, or maybe Medicare. :D
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby dalai47 » Fri Jul 04, 2014 9:07 am

ValleyForge wrote:More than 72 hr turnaround for me. Cleaning first - using acetone until the rim is spotless; sham tyre fit pumped up for about 72 hrs; glue both; wait 12hrs; reglue tyre; fit & pump up. Then wait 24hrs.


Only one layer on the rim and two on the tyre? I am two on the rim and three on the tyre (add one more layer for both when gluing CX tubulars) without cleaning the previous glue off!
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby ironhanglider » Fri Jul 04, 2014 10:55 pm

zill wrote:How does the FMBs compare with Durano Plus clincher tires?


zill wrote:Anyone tried the new SCHWALBE ONE?


Not ridden any of them.

The problem is that few people wear tubulars out frequently enough to provide meaningful results. The people who use tubulars for performance will only pull them out on race day, which means that they will have to be doing a lot of racing to wear more than one rear tyre out in a year. If people are changing tyres more frequently than that it will be as a result of some sort of premature failure, be that puncture, blow-out, flat spot etc.

If I was choosing tubulars for training I simply wouldn't be spending more than $50 each on them, though I'd probably also have a 'good' set of wheels and tyres for racing on.

Cheers

Cameron
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby zill » Sat Jul 05, 2014 11:44 am

How much of a difference does puncture protection fluid make to a tubular tire?

If so which brand and product is most reliable?
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby Thoglette » Sat Jul 05, 2014 5:03 pm

zill wrote:How much of a difference does puncture protection fluid make to a tubular tire?

If so which brand and product is most reliable?


Anecdote - the YJ tubulars have removable valves - I got a slow leak (caltrop I'm sure) and pulled valve, slopped a half bottle of Stan's in and the leak stopped. Small bump where some got between tube and tyre but it's fine.
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby morini » Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:35 pm

Racing aside. It sounds like you guys use your mobile phones too much instead of using your bikes. Learn to put them on yourself and learn how to fix them. It's not rocket science and it doesn't need to be done by some half wit kid in a bicycle shop.
There's so much crap about singles I can't believe half the rubbish I read. I ride on them nearly day and if I get a puncture I either call home for some one to come and get me, hitch home or sit on the side of the road, unpick the stitching, put a patch on the hole, stitch it it back up and glue it back on. If anyone tells you you can't they're full of sh*t. Myself and plenty of others have been fixing them on the side of the road for decades. Maybe I need to make a Youtube video of how to fix a tyre on the side of the road? Good grief.....
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby mikesbytes » Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:38 am

Doesn't it depend on whether the single is stitched or glued?
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby morini » Tue Jul 08, 2014 5:49 pm

That's a rhetorical question and obviously choosing Tufos isn't going to help much. Stitched tyres are the only ones you can fix though I've come across a forum where someone tried to fix a glued tub with limited success. They destroyed the tyre in the name of science and worked out it could be done and also worked out it wasn't worth the trouble. So I'd be buying stitched for that reason.
Singles/tubulars are very old technology but like most cycling equipment these days it makes good business sense to market the concept of riders needing bike shops just like we need garages for our cars. We seem to be developing generations who struggle with using spanners, let alone unpicking tyres and to whom loyalty to the "brand" and "procedures" is more important than questioning the dominant paradigm. My point being, that if the trade says it's too much mucking around fixing a tubular tyre, then some people believe it. When I was young it was the other way around, everyone learnt how to work on their bikes because the general consensus was that it wasn't difficult. I wonder what's changed? Does austerity breed a form of environmental awareness? By the way, my apologies for leering off topic.

I don't race but personally I like Vittoria tyres.
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby Derny Driver » Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:19 pm

Young DD has pinch flatted 4 brand new Conti Competition singles in 5 rides. They were pumped to 120psi and he weighs 68kg.
Conti Competitions are considered a heavy durable tubular tyre

#1 He hit a pothole on a training ride near our house and pinch flatted the front. I replaced it.
#2 A week later he was descending a 30% hill after the finish of a stage in an overseas race and ran off the road and into a deep concrete drain culvert busting the new front tyre with only 120km on it. I replaced it and he successfully raced a rough stage the next day without incident.
#3 In the next days stage he hit a bad hole and flatted the rear 10km into the stage.
#4 After getting another rear wheel from the team car he hit a hole chasing back on and flatted the front again.

The only good news is that my dad who is 91 is repairing them all. He says that the Continentals are easy to fix.
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby zill » Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:37 pm

Derny Driver wrote:Young DD has pinch flatted 4 brand new Conti Competition singles in 5 rides. They were pumped to 120psi and he weighs 68kg.
Conti Competitions are considered a heavy durable tubular tyre

#1 He hit a pothole on a training ride near our house and pinch flatted the front. I replaced it.
#2 A week later he was descending a 30% hill after the finish of a stage in an overseas race and ran off the road and into a deep concrete drain culvert busting the new front tyre with only 120km on it. I replaced it and he successfully raced a rough stage the next day without incident.
#3 In the next days stage he hit a bad hole and flatted the rear 10km into the stage.
#4 After getting another rear wheel from the team car he hit a hole chasing back on and flatted the front again.

The only good news is that my dad who is 91 is repairing them all. He says that the Continentals are easy to fix.


Would you use tubular over clinchers? If so why?
Last edited by zill on Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby Cul » Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:45 pm

If you are looking to use Tubulars for durability reasons, you are using them for the WRONG reasons. Yes in my experience they have been much more durable than clinchers on the crappy roads around home... But my reasoning behind using them is because they ride MUCH better than any clincher I have ridden. Much like Tubeless tires on an MTB (of which I was an early adopter).

Derny, that is just showtime luck!!!
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Re: Most durable tubular tires?

Postby Derny Driver » Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:55 pm

Yes its just luck ...
Ive only just upgraded young DD to tubbys for racing because they are faster and (usually) more reliable.
They are certainly a hassle, the Contis are very tight to get on when not pre-stretched.
I would prefer clinchers I think, but we got the wheels very cheap, and tubulars are light and fast for racing.
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