1x11 11-42

User avatar
Derny Driver
Posts: 2075
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:18 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby Derny Driver » Thu Dec 17, 2015 12:15 am

ironhanglider wrote:
That's not like you DD.


:D :D :D

User avatar
Derny Driver
Posts: 2075
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:18 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby Derny Driver » Thu Dec 17, 2015 12:28 am

RonK wrote:
Shimano XT M8000: 11-13-15-17-19-21-24-28-32-37-42

SRAM XG-1150: 10-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36-42


Ewwww :shock:
dem 5 and 6 tooth gaps :roll:

Whatever happened to
the hard man stack
the corn cob
the straight block
the cogent cluster

koshari
Posts: 902
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2013 5:33 pm

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby koshari » Thu Feb 04, 2016 8:59 am

Duck! wrote:
koshari wrote:I would imagine one would need a long cage derailleur as well?

No, a very long body. You need a very specific derailleur to cope with such a massive sprocket, and no road derailleur, even long cage will come near it. The only available system that works is SRAM's CX1 (available on Force and possibly Rival groups); Shimano and SRAM's MTB 11-sp. derailleurs use a different leverage ratio to the road gear, so don't play with road shifters, but CX1 has the leverage ratio to play with SRAM 10 & 11-sp. road shifters and the body geometry to handle dinner plate sprockets (so you can use a 10-sp. cassette with bigger than the 32T maximum of standard WiFli derailleurs).

As others have pointed out, the trade-off from ditching the second ring & covering all the gear range in the cassette is that you lose the smooth progression between gear ratios; it's reasonably probable that you'd find you need gears that aren't there a fair bit of the time because the gaps are so much wider.


thanks for the input Duck, I have only now appreciated that its the dérailleur body width that enables the mechanics of getting the chain up onto a 42.
I are in the process of converting my 26er to 1x10 and have chosen shadow+ zee as the foundation of this, so far i have done most of the back end as the shifter, dérailleur and cassette have arrived and took it for a run yesterday with the front locked onto the middle cog of my triple (32T). I found that I only needed to get onto the 36t sprocket on the back once however spent about 75% of the time switching between the 11 and 12 tooth on the back, and was definitely spinning out above 40km/h. I have both a 34 and 38 narrow/wide chanring coming to try out to see if this fixes the top end, and when the 42t rear gear arrives hopefully this will still meet the climbing requirements I want for the back. But i have to say just having the single pod to worry about is great, no double shifting to get the correct gear in uphill transitions and little risk of chaindrop.

The 1x11 idea on my commuter/cross bike looks to be a bit of a pie in the sky proposition ATM looking at the fact that there dont appear to be any suitable dérailleurs for the job keeping with shimano road pull ratios. I believe I could achieve 1x10 with say an RD-M4000 9 speed RD with 10 speed road shifter however this would make the space jumps between gearing even more pronounced. prolly keep the current setup for a while until I have done more KMs on my 26er to determine if the space between intermediate shifts is a deal breaker. if it wasnt an issue with regard to jump sizes then i could choose a front ring that effectively replicates my gear inches on the 26er to the 700.
Coming from an 8 speed background the tighter shifts are likely less a bother to me than someone who has spent a lot of time on 11x2 speed transmissions.

btw this is a great resource for info on pull/ratio/pitch setups http://blog.artscyclery.com/science-behind-the-magic/science-behind-the-magic-drivetrain-compatibility/

if i were to go 1x11 gevenalle gx dynashift shifters would likely be the best drop mounted shift option with a shadow RD. then the whole experiment starts to become pretty exxy.
Last edited by koshari on Thu Feb 04, 2016 10:51 am, edited 5 times in total.
Image

User avatar
Derny Driver
Posts: 2075
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:18 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby Derny Driver » Thu Feb 04, 2016 9:20 am

ironhanglider wrote:I used two-tooth jump clusters (5 spd) when I was a junior with a half-step pair of chainrings (42-44?) It was a good combination which put the front change right in between a rear change. It was really easy to know where the next gear was going to be.

Cheers,
Cameron

How old are you Cameron? haha :D :D
My dad is 93 and he had a setup like that.

ironhanglider
Posts: 2220
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:44 pm
Location: Middle East, Melbourne

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby ironhanglider » Fri Feb 05, 2016 6:53 pm

Not quite as old as you (or Foo) but older than your friend Danny, who I suspect used to manage the Wheels In Motion Belconnen, at the time when I managed the WIM Greensborough.

That was my first 'real' race bike, which followed on from my 24" Peugeot with the mudguards and lights removed, and upgraded from 3spd to 5spd.

The frame had 'track ends' and hung the derailer from a hook. Supposedly it had been ridden in (not necessarily to) Australian Track championships, and Australian Road championships. Sadly after I outgrew it and passed it on to my mum, the frame broke and we turned the rear triangle into a stool.

The same chain and cluster survived the entire time that we owned the bike for (1980-6)

I suspect the bike was built in the 60's, and was top quality for it's day.

That said (to bring the thread back on track) big jumps in the big cogs is not a big deal, but the 2 tooth gaps in the small cogs is significant, hence the usefulness of the half-step chainrings.

Cheers,

Cameron
Image

User avatar
trailgumby
Posts: 12875
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:30 pm
Location: Northern Beaches, Sydney
Contact:

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby trailgumby » Fri Feb 05, 2016 7:56 pm

Having ridden 1x11 on a 120mm travel Trek Fuel EX9 on a test day around Old Man's Valley in Hornsby about a year ago, I found the larger gaps in the gears compared to 2x10 rather awkward.

Compared to the 2x10 it lost me one gear off the bottom end and two off the top that I never use except when riding on the road. That's doable for a lot (but not all) of my local trail riding, but becomes problematic on the longer steeper climbs like the Oaks Trail up-and-back, or Oaks-Ingar-Andersons-Oaks loop if I'm out for an all-day epic.

I didn't really like the larger gaps between gears, and noticed it immediately. Losing the front shifter was good for my thumb though, which gets a bit irritated sometimes by the end those epics. That bonus disappears though for road riding, as the ergonomics of Shimano's road shifters are vastly superior to MTB thumb shifters of any description. (I still mourn the demise of Dual Control for MTB The ergonomics of the 2010 edition was brilliant.)

Won't ever be going 1x on the 29er unless they stop making front shifters and multiring setups for the top of the range MTB gruppo. Can't see it gaining a foothold in road unless it's for flat terrain or CX where the speed range is more limited than road.

User avatar
DTdotcom
Posts: 955
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:35 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby DTdotcom » Mon Apr 18, 2016 5:11 pm

koshari wrote:With shimano looking to bring out a 11to42 rear cassette has anyone considered running a 1x11 setup? And if so would a 50 ring un the front be the obvious choice? Would the 42 off the 50 chainrings gear inches be in the ballpark of say a 25 off a 42?

I would imagine one would need a long cage derailleur as well?


I guess things have moved a little in this space since your original post.

My new roadie is running SRAM Force 1x & so far very happy with the build/performance.
I opted for 11-36 cassette over the 10-42 as I didn't want to fiddle with the XD driver body & go to a long cage RD so I could swap out wheels.

The 50T chainring gives me most of the range of a 2x but with only 11 steps vs the traditional 16

User avatar
Duck!
Expert
Posts: 6353
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 8:21 pm
Location: On The Tools

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby Duck! » Mon Apr 18, 2016 7:41 pm

The bonus of Shimano's 11-sp. cassette is that by sticking with the 11T top gear it fits on a standard freehub, so no stuffing about with converting to an XD driver, and the other funky thing about it is that unlike road 11-sp. it fits on a regular 8/9/10-sp. body. and it fits in with otherwise SRAM systems. But you do still need the long body derailleur to fit the 42.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

koshari
Posts: 902
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2013 5:33 pm

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby koshari » Mon Apr 18, 2016 10:35 pm

thanks for that post DT, interesting looking at the sram setup, the shifter pairs with a combined gear/brake rear shifter and the dedicated brake lever do look pretty neat.

Image
Image

User avatar
DTdotcom
Posts: 955
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:35 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby DTdotcom » Tue Apr 19, 2016 8:17 am

The no paddle looks weird at first for sure, here's mine built up.

Image

User avatar
Xplora
Posts: 8272
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 12:33 am
Location: TL;DR

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby Xplora » Tue Apr 19, 2016 10:14 am

I was thinking about how dumb this entire direction was but then I saw SRAM are releasing the Eagle TWELVE SPEED XX1 groupset. 10-50t cassette. They've finally swapped a road bike drivetrain around. :lol:

User avatar
DTdotcom
Posts: 955
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:35 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby DTdotcom » Wed Apr 20, 2016 7:57 am

You should hold out till Shimano execute their 14 speed patent

Nobody
Posts: 8509
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby Nobody » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:25 am

I'll just add my experience of riding 1 X on road.

I have a 48 X 14-25, 9 speed on my road bike and a 44 X 12-28, 7 speed on my road going MTB (wet bike). Where I ride is mainly Sydney Olympic Park area with a few short hills thrown in. I use the bikes for exercise, so prefer to climb out of the saddle even though it's more efficient to stay seated on climbs. These bikes work for me as I found I wasn't using the smaller rings on my rides. Having said that, if my local terrain was steeper, or the hills were bigger, I would have kept the front derailleurs and the smaller chainrings as I prefer less steps between gears on the cassette. Especially on flat ground.

Arlberg
Posts: 409
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:43 pm

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby Arlberg » Wed Apr 27, 2016 10:27 pm

My mate (he's also my coach) has a 1 x 11 with an 11 - 46 on the back. He uses it almost exclusively for climbing events and he's a very strong climber.

Image

Arlberg
Posts: 409
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:43 pm

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby Arlberg » Wed Apr 27, 2016 10:50 pm

DTdotcom wrote:The no paddle looks weird at first for sure, here's mine built up.

Image



That's an awesome bike and I just love the colour! What's the name of it? (the colour).
Last edited by Arlberg on Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

softy
Posts: 1663
Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 3:44 pm

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby softy » Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:02 pm

I really like the one times, waiting till Sram etap the bigger derailleurs.

blip buttons on the aero base bars. :)

User avatar
DTdotcom
Posts: 955
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:35 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby DTdotcom » Thu Apr 28, 2016 9:14 am

Arlberg wrote:
DTdotcom wrote:The no paddle looks weird at first for sure, here's mine built up.

Image



That's an awesome bike and I just love the colour! What's the name of it? (the colour).


It's Matte Army Green

User avatar
cancan64
Posts: 1512
Joined: Tue Oct 22, 2013 9:13 pm
Location: Auckland

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby cancan64 » Fri Apr 29, 2016 10:48 am

I am looking at converting my CX bike (Trek Boone 9) to a 1x11 set up. I do use this on the road and run out of gears now with the 36/46 front so have been hesitant but after riding the singlespeed (44x16) mostly this year I am now keen to head the 1x11 route, more so now that I have to replace the crank set after a crash. Has been fun researching my options, I am happy with the Sram CX1 crank set on the CXSS but the geared CX bike has a BB90 bottom bracket so I have stayed with the Ultrega FC6800 crankset and will get a 40t Wolf Tooth drop stop chain ring for it and remove the front derailleur. Also looking at replacing the Di2 rear with Shimino XTR Di2 and reprograme 1 shifter for up shifts and the other for down shifts. Its like getting a new toy although the changes will happen over a period due to zero funds
“Some say he isn’t machine washable, and all his potted plants are called ‘Steve’.

koshari
Posts: 902
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2013 5:33 pm

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby koshari » Tue Jan 03, 2017 9:06 am

btw has anyone used a roadlink cassette extender?
Image
Image

User avatar
trailgumby
Posts: 12875
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:30 pm
Location: Northern Beaches, Sydney
Contact:

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby trailgumby » Wed Jan 04, 2017 7:30 pm

If you're going to go 1x on the front without a chainguide you need to put on a mountain bike rear derailleur with a clutch, and use a narrow-wide chainring. Otherwise it will jump off the front on anything rough you hit at speed.

I have no idea why CX bikes have traditionally used short-ratio big rings without doing the same on the inner ring. Surely you would go short on both? 36-46 makes no sense to me at all........

Nobody
Posts: 8509
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby Nobody » Wed Jan 04, 2017 11:20 pm

trailgumby wrote:If you're going to go 1x on the front without a chainguide you need to put on a mountain bike rear derailleur with a clutch, and use a narrow-wide chainring. Otherwise it will jump off the front on anything rough you hit at speed.

Or use an old front derailleur or a simple chain guide/keeper.
Image
https://paulcomp.com/shop/components/chain-keeper/

I've got one like above, but different brand. Works well. I don't have a clutch rear derailleur or a narrow-wide chainring.

User avatar
baabaa
Posts: 705
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2009 8:47 am

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby baabaa » Thu Jan 05, 2017 10:05 am

btw has anyone used a roadlink cassette extender?

yes, and did so just to avoid the mixing up of road and mtn stuff. Such a simple bit of kit. Rear 11-36 and front 34 on a long cage 105 5700(a?) with a dura ace 10 speed bar end shifter. Smooth shifting on a basic DT 350 135mm disc rear hub
Image
Had all the parts just not the roadlink, lasted about two weeks as went from a single speed set up to gears as felt I was getting old. Now back to ss as hated the gears off and on road as just made me ride a bit faster and starting thinking of ratios and not the ride.
May shift this over to my cx bike from time to time but doubt will go single up front as I do like pretty chainlines. Dont know what sort of riding you do but I would suggest a cx front end comb of 46/36 to best work out what you think you need up front. Should be able to find the right gear in between that 10 teeth or may end up sticking with this instead of a single up front.

User avatar
cancan64
Posts: 1512
Joined: Tue Oct 22, 2013 9:13 pm
Location: Auckland

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby cancan64 » Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:44 pm

My CX bike (Trek Boone) is set up as a 1x11 with 50 front and 11-40 rear. I use an xtr rear derailleur but Di2. Works well on the road, CX racing I did find it a bit tuff but very muddy in NZ but still manageable although I missed a podium spot in the NZ nationals with a dropped chain in the last lap... now have made a chain guide for it.
Just done a 4 day bike packing trip carrying a lot of weight with an average of 170km days and did struggle on some steep single track climbs and grinded on 18%+ hills otherwise worked well.
If I am racing in NZ this year I will drop to a 44 front cog but if I am back in Brisbane where the circuits are faster I will leave it
“Some say he isn’t machine washable, and all his potted plants are called ‘Steve’.

User avatar
cancan64
Posts: 1512
Joined: Tue Oct 22, 2013 9:13 pm
Location: Auckland

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby cancan64 » Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:59 pm

This is it with road wheels

“Some say he isn’t machine washable, and all his potted plants are called ‘Steve’.

User avatar
cancan64
Posts: 1512
Joined: Tue Oct 22, 2013 9:13 pm
Location: Auckland

Re: 1x11 11-42

Postby cancan64 » Sun Jan 08, 2017 7:25 am

Pictures of my chain guide ... wasnt hard to make



“Some say he isn’t machine washable, and all his potted plants are called ‘Steve’.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users