Rust spots, now what?

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Rust spots, now what?

Postby stryker84 » Mon Apr 02, 2007 3:30 pm

heya, i asked a bit ago on bike maintenance, and was redirected to an old thread.
that was helpful, but lately i've noticed a few spots of rust on the chain (buckets of rain recently, autumn's hit us with a vengeance here in Melbourne), and was wondering, what exactly do i do about that? was thinking WD-40 it off, and re-lube it? or is WD-40 bad for chains? what do i do bout the rusty bits?

assume i'm completely ignorant of maintaining a bike, cos (apart from what's in that thread), I AM. :shock:
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by BNA » Mon Apr 02, 2007 3:35 pm

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Postby pugsly » Mon Apr 02, 2007 3:35 pm

I hope WD40 isn't bad for components - I gave the lot a soak yesterday after coming back from a ride where I could hear something squeaking.

I have NFI on maintenance either - maybe a good one for the FAQs?
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Postby wndrdr1111 » Mon Apr 02, 2007 3:36 pm

You will generally get few rusty bits when it's wet. Just apply lube and the rusty bits will disappear as you ride. If it was really wet you can give the chain a good clean and apply lube when the chain is dry.

Cheers,
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Postby sogood » Mon Apr 02, 2007 3:43 pm

Agree with above. Superficial rust after a wet ride isn't a problem. Just wipe it down and relube. DO NOT use WD40 on the bike ever. It'll drive out all the remaining good grease within the chain and make it more prone to rust at the next rain.
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Postby pugsly » Mon Apr 02, 2007 3:44 pm

argh!
So what should I do now that I've soaked everything? :( :oops:
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Postby sogood » Mon Apr 02, 2007 4:25 pm

pugsly wrote:argh!
So what should I do now that I've soaked everything? :( :oops:

WD40 would hang around in all the critical crevices to degrease any lube you put on. :shock:

If I were you, I'd fully degrease the chain and running gear using citrus degreaser (aided with a chain cleaner unit if you can't get the chain off), rinse with tap water, dry, and then do a proper lube.
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Postby pugsly » Mon Apr 02, 2007 4:27 pm

*smacks head against wall*
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Postby Halfanewb » Mon Apr 02, 2007 4:43 pm

yea i did the same thing once and used WD40 on the cruiser, when i took it a few weeks later to the lbs they all but hissed and made a cross with their fingers at me :shock:
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Postby pugsly » Mon Apr 02, 2007 5:08 pm

Now I have to go spend more money on stuff for the bike.
I've easily spent twice the value of the bike (it was a cheap bike)
on associated bits. I'll wander into the LBS, tell them the error of my ways and get chain cleaner etc.
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Postby sogood » Mon Apr 02, 2007 5:18 pm

pugsly wrote:Now I have to go spend more money on stuff for the bike.
I've easily spent twice the value of the bike (it was a cheap bike)
on associated bits. I'll wander into the LBS, tell them the error of my ways and get chain cleaner etc.

If you bought an expensive bike, then the bits won't add up to 2x but more like 0.69x. 8)

Get those chain cleaners bits off eBay and shouldn't cost you more than $25 or there abouts. Try Rebel Sports for that citrus degreaser. I once came across a batch with good discount to those LBS prices but have not had luck since. You might get lucky. In any case, a chain cleaner is a basic and useful piece of maintenance equipment. There's nothing better looking than nicely degreased chain and running gears.
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Postby Bnej » Mon Apr 02, 2007 5:19 pm

I have heard of people who use WD40 for motorcycle chains, by applying it every day they ride. It probably would be okay for bicycle chains as long as you don't mind applying it constantly.

But pretty much anything else is better.

Especially don't use WD40 around the bottom bracket, cranks, pedals, hubs etc.. they need proper lubrication.
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Postby sogood » Mon Apr 02, 2007 5:20 pm

Bnej wrote:It probably would be okay for bicycle chains as long as you don't mind applying it constantly.

Pretty crazy proposition for the rider but a bonanza for WD40's stock holders! 8)
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Postby pugsly » Mon Apr 02, 2007 5:20 pm

ok, then, whilst we're on the buying of bits to keep the treadly rolling - what other things should I have for keeping things in tip top shape - I may as well get it all at once. I've got an allen key tool that came with the bike that goes in the saddle bag, apart from that - nada.

Any advice is appreciated. :)
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Postby sogood » Mon Apr 02, 2007 5:33 pm

pugsly wrote:ok, then, whilst we're on the buying of bits to keep the treadly rolling - what other things should I have for keeping things in tip top shape - I may as well get it all at once. I've got an allen key tool that came with the bike that goes in the saddle bag, apart from that - nada.

I think you'll have to ask yourself how much you want to do the work yourself vs let wrench monkeys do the work for you. Do you like mucking around with mechanical things and do you mind getting your hands dirty?

For the very basic, I'd say that some allen keys and philips head screw drivers (multi-tool) are all you need. That pretty much allows you to adjust all the bits and change all the common bits on the bike. The next step would be in the cleaning of chains, replacing chains, remove and mounting of cassettes, and these would include what we have just talked about along with a chain breaker, a chain whip and a cassette locknut remover. At this point, you might start to consider a bicycle repair stand to make these jobs easier and not let the bike fall over in the process. This is where I stop at the moment and think where the cost-benefit ratio stops. Beyond this are wheel truing and BB replacement/service. These require more experience and additional tools. Given the infrequency of these services, I suspect it might be better to get someone to do it for you unless you are keen to have the experience.

Oh yes, I assume you already have tyre levers and tube patching kits right?
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Postby heavymetal » Mon Apr 02, 2007 7:00 pm

sogood covers it all. A lot of these tools are only required if you do a lot of work.

However I would add a good hammer to the list. :shock: :D
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Postby MJF » Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:34 pm

I like WD40... but light oils on chains end up on the rim, and lubricant & brake blocks don't mix. Doesn't do much good for tyres either.

I've fitted an SRAM powerlink so I can R&R the chain for cleaning/lubing. I'm using a chain oil - it does tend to make the dirt stick, but it doesn't wash off in the rain.

I might try the Prolink lube again now that the rainy season appears to be over.
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Postby pugsly » Tue Apr 03, 2007 6:38 am

ah crap, went out for this mornings ride, good news was the squeak that was annoying me is gone, but the bad news is that there's a hell of a racket coming from the pedals/crank area :( :( :(

Since I don't have the tools yet, I think I might head to the LBS and negotiate with them to lube all the vitals, and show me how it's done, so I can do it for next time. I did all of 3km :(
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Postby pugsly » Tue Apr 03, 2007 7:00 am

sogood wrote:I think you'll have to ask yourself how much you want to do the work yourself vs let wrench monkeys do the work for you. Do you like mucking around with mechanical things and do you mind getting your hands dirty?


I don't mind either so much as actually having the time to do it. I'd rather spend the hour or so I have available at whatever time riding than working on the bike. Having said that, I don't want to have to take the bike to a shop for the day, for what amounts to 10 mins of work.


sogood wrote:For the very basic, I'd say that some allen keys and philips head screw drivers (multi-tool) are all you need. That pretty much allows you to adjust all the bits and change all the common bits on the bike.


Check. Got that stuff - it's been very handy to date.

sogood wrote:The next step would be in the cleaning of chains, replacing chains, remove and mounting of cassettes, and these would include what we have just talked about along with a chain breaker, a chain whip and a cassette locknut remover. At this point, you might start to consider a bicycle repair stand to make these jobs easier and not let the bike fall over in the process. This is where I stop at the moment and think where the cost-benefit ratio stops. Beyond this are wheel truing and BB replacement/service. These require more experience and additional tools. Given the infrequency of these services, I suspect it might be better to get someone to do it for you unless you are keen to have the experience.


egads! Cleaning and lubing, with the ocassional cable adjustment is probably about as far as I want to go I think, and puncture repair of course. Any more than that and I risk breaking something, and probably myself when the component I thought I fixed breaks as I'm on the bike.

sogood wrote:Oh yes, I assume you already have tyre levers and tube patching kits right?


Yup, sure do.

ok, so dumb question time - I now know that wd40 and the like are no-no's as far as lubricant is concerned. I have a inkling that k-y would be no good as well ;) what lubricant should I be getting for what bits, how should it be applied with what frequency, and where do I get the stuff?

*wishes he'd put up with the squeak and asked before doing*
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Postby wndrdr1111 » Tue Apr 03, 2007 7:52 am

I use ProLink lube. Apply it every second weekend or so (but that would depend on how often and how much you ride, I do around 150km each week). One drop per link, run the chain through all gears, wipe off the excess and I am done.

You can get it at almost any LBS. About $17 per bottle, which should last you a while.

Cheers,
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Postby sogood » Tue Apr 03, 2007 7:52 am

pugsly wrote:ok, so dumb question time - I now know that wd40 and the like are no-no's as far as lubricant is concerned. I have a inkling that k-y would be no good as well ;) what lubricant should I be getting for what bits, how should it be applied with what frequency, and where do I get the stuff?

*wishes he'd put up with the squeak and asked before doing*

You've only just bought your bike not too long ago right? This present problem surely can be looked after under that new purchase goodwill umbrella, right?

There are too many brands of lube out there. Essentially there's a triangle of 3 performance parameters out of which you typically can only choose 2 with any one product. They are,

1) Lubrication quality
2) Durability especially wet resistance
3) Dirt resistance

Presently I use Weldite's spray on lube. It doesn't last well in the wet and I have to apply weekly, but it doesn't attract much dirt (ie. Relatively clean chain). But I may try Prolink next.
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Postby LuckyPierre » Tue Apr 03, 2007 10:49 am

I use Prolink. Like Tom (wndrdr1111) says, a bottle lasts a long time.

If you WD40'd your chain, just treat it like the instructions say to treat a new chain. Prolink displaces any grease from a new chain when you first apply it anyway, so it should displace the WD40 too. I re-lube after cleaning my bike and after riding in the rain (a whole twice in twelve months!), so the chain gets done every couple of weeks.
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Postby pugsly » Tue Apr 03, 2007 10:51 am

So how about the other components, the little wheels in the derailers, the cranks, etc etc?

I've called the LBS - sounds like they have to pull it all apart, regrease and put together. :( :evil:
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Postby LuckyPierre » Tue Apr 03, 2007 11:30 am

pugsly wrote:So how about the other components, the little wheels in the derailers, the cranks, etc etc?

The rear derailleur is pretty easy to re-grease - just do one cog at a time and remember how it goes back together. If it's a Shimano, each cog just runs on a metal bush between two metal cups, it's - take a cog out of the derailleur frame, wipe off the WD40, re-grease the bushes, re-assemble and put it back in the the derailluer frame. A couple of drops of light oil on each of the joints in the main derailleur body won't hurt - just lube each joint, work the mecahanism by hand a few times, then wipe off any excess.
If there's noise from the bottom bracket, then it's probably best to let the shop do it (nothing difficult, but you need special tools to remove the cranks and get to the bottom bracket). The bottom bracket should be a sealed unit though, so it shouldn't be that.
If there's noise from the pedals, take them off (you'll need a pedal spanner) and lube them as best you can - if you dis-assemble them, they can be tricky to get back together, especially if they have loose bearings on the outer end of the pedal spindle. :wink:
Hopefully, the noise will just be chain noise as it goes around the chainrings.
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Postby sogood » Tue Apr 03, 2007 11:36 am

LuckyPierre wrote:If you WD40'd your chain, just treat it like the instructions say to treat a new chain. Prolink displaces any grease from a new chain...

The issue here is that WD40 is not grease, it's primarily a solvent and stays being a solvent. At the end of the day, the chain won't suddenly self destruct with WD40 and there are plenty of bike owners who use WD40 without knowing any better. So unless you are a purist, treat it as a learning lesson and just use other lubes over it and forget about it. Eventually the new lubes will take over from WD40. And when the chain is due for its proper clean, then make sure WD40 is not used.
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Postby MJF » Tue Apr 03, 2007 2:27 pm

pugsly wrote:So how about the other components, the little wheels in the derailers, the cranks, etc etc?

I've called the LBS - sounds like they have to pull it all apart, regrease and put together. :( :evil:


Unlikely - WD40 is volatile and evaporates off anyway, and the worst case is that it will have washed dust into some of the bearings - but if they were greased properly in the first place, that shouldn't happen.

Unless you got totally carried away with the spray and sprayed into gaps in the rear hub and bottom bracket, I'd just wash down the bike with detergent, and then re-lube the chain.
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