Fitness or Ease??

open topic, for anything cycling related.

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby DaNmAn » Wed Apr 22, 2009 8:43 pm

I noticed that with a lighter bike (I went from generic 21 speed MTB to 8 speed alfine cell hybrid) my polar still clocks up as much calories, and I actually have higher highs as far as BPM goes.
I attribute this to having a lighter bike and trying to smash the hills and PB more than when I had a cumbersome MTB

I guess the lighter bike enables me to go harder but for a shorter period, but still get as much benefit as before.
Also when a hill is less daunting on your lighter bike, you tend to do a lot more recreational riding rather than just commuting.

Thats my angle, may not be the same as everyone else though
User avatar
DaNmAn
 
Posts: 71
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2009 7:01 pm

by BNA » Wed Apr 22, 2009 9:13 pm

BNA
 

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby Nobody » Wed Apr 22, 2009 9:13 pm

simonn wrote:
Nobody wrote:I think the position is the significant difference. Most of the total resistance by far is wind resistance and most of that is the rider.


~30km/h+ sure, but not at ~10-20km/h going up hill on mtb when you do the same hills at 15-25km/h on a roadie with hands on the middle of the bar, so similar position.

As the MTB was likely the past and the road bike is the present, is it possible you are fitter now?

Yes, 5-6Kg is a significant difference, but I don't think that alone would give you 5Km/h. I used the calculator below with 75Kg person, 14Kg bike, bar ends, 5% grade and 250W. Then I changed to bar top and dropped weight by 6Kg to 8Kg bike to find less than 1Km/h gain.
http://www.bikecalculator.com/veloMetric.html
Nobody
 
Posts: 6640
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby Mulger bill » Thu Apr 23, 2009 12:20 am

Five flights of stairs?

Methinks you've sussed it Suze .Go a drop bar roadie, a set of cross levers maybe if you plan to ride on the tops a fair bit. Keep the MTB as a rain bike.

Now, the fun part. Finding the right scoot :D

Shaun
...whatever the road rules, self-preservation is the absolute priority for a cyclist when mixing it with motorised traffic.
London Boy 29/12/2011
User avatar
Mulger bill
Super Mod
Super Mod
 
Posts: 25778
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 2:41 pm
Location: Sunbury Vic

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby 3rdKogCruiser » Thu Apr 23, 2009 1:42 am

So, it looks like you're being steered away from the menace of the mountain bike commuter, but now the debate is on over which handlebars you should go for - don't believe any of it, but check it out or reason it out for yourself, 'cos you'll be the one riding it.

And back up just a little to the Hybrid debate. Presuming you dont have a penthouse at the top of those stairs, yu may want to save some space by keeping only one bike. A hybrid could give you a good road riding experience (you'll still get passed by roadies, but you can pass the MTBs :)), with the capacity to handle dirt paths confidently as well. Within that, give some thought to whether you want front shock absorbers (extra weight) as well.

If getting a road bike, it's probably more important to be comfortable than worry about drop bars. I have drop bars, but tend to ride more upright unless I'm really pushing it, and I don't just automatically go faster when I drop down - I have to work for it! Another issue is whether you've got or are prone to any back pain - that tends to be a clincher for the flat-bar!
A work colleague just switched from MTB to flat-bar roadie (he gets back pain) and reckons it's taken about 10 min. off his commute ride (<10km). Another friend feels safer with the braking ergonomics of flat-bar.

On the issue of taking the "more rugged tyres" out in the rain, much has been written to debunk the myth that nobby tyres give you better grip the wet (Google tyres & "sheldon Brown"). In the wet, slow down a bit more for turns and esp. for shiny surfaces (like paving tiles).

Back to your original post - I've long wanted to ask "Why do people commute on mountain bikes?" Perhaps one day you'll ask the same question. 8)

- Colin.
- Ciao; 3rd Kog.("I'm not racing, just trying to catch the dude up ahead")
Now: Avanti Monza (to keep up with Pinarello riders), Shogun Metro (+ tag-along)
B4: Phillips Multi-track (really bad, but got me back into riding)
User avatar
3rdKogCruiser
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 8:54 pm
Location: NW Adelaide

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby m@ » Thu Apr 23, 2009 12:05 pm

3rdKogCruiser wrote:If getting a road bike, it's probably more important to be comfortable than worry about drop bars.


I don't quite understand this statement - why are flats the 'default' choice and drops something to 'worry' about? At any rate, the larger number of hand positions offered by drop bars make them more comfortable for most people (ie, those without chronic back injuries)...
harmonix1234 wrote:Forecast for Hobart next week is rain, sleet, ice and all kinds of hell.
HTFU harmonix.
User avatar
m@
Super Mod
Super Mod
 
Posts: 4445
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:20 pm
Location: Northlandia

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby simonn » Thu Apr 23, 2009 12:40 pm

Nobody wrote:As the MTB was likely the past and the road bike is the present, is it possible you are fitter now?


I am fitter now, but this was only a couple of weeks ago. My roadie was un-roadworthy for a couple of weeks so I was commuting on my MTB.

Nobody wrote:Yes, 5-6Kg is a significant difference, but I don't think that alone would give you 5Km/h. I used the calculator below with 75Kg person, 14Kg bike, bar ends, 5% grade and 250W. Then I changed to bar top and dropped weight by 6Kg to 8Kg bike to find less than 1Km/h gain.
http://www.bikecalculator.com/veloMetric.html


FWIW, using the weigh myself on scales then pickup bike and weigh myself again then subtract my weight, MTB is ~16kgs, roadie is ~10.5kgs - not including pannier.
Image
User avatar
simonn
 
Posts: 3597
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2008 10:46 am
Location: Sydney

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby suzieQ » Thu Apr 23, 2009 4:45 pm

Mulger bill wrote:Five flights of stairs?
Shaun



Yup I ride along a bike path under a bridge, then have to get on top of the bridge to go the rest of the way, not my fave part of the ride but gives you a chance to have a drink and a breather.

And to answer your question Colin - People commute on MTBs because they are cheap!! (well some of them are)
I think often are just a really common bash around bike that people have already so it's easier to start with that and see how it goes rather than investing in a decent bike and fid out you hate commuting!

Thanks for your info on road bikes too, really helpful. :D
suzieQ
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 12:27 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby 3rdKogCruiser » Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:25 am

suzieQ wrote:
And to answer your question Colin - People commute on MTBs because they are cheap!! (well some of them are)
I think often are just a really common bash around bike that people have already so it's easier to start with that and see how it goes rather than investing in a decent bike and fid out you hate commuting!

Thanks for your info on road bikes too, really helpful. :D


No worries! Hey, its the weekend already! Time to leave this thread to those who want to argue about THEIR OWN bike preferences whilst you do the rounds of the local bike shops for something that suits YOU! Apart from style, find out what frame size you should be looking for and get a bit of advice on choosing a seat. Don't commit to anything B4 checking to see if you can get it for half the price on ebay (esp those "hardly used, couple of years old deals):wink: LBS will still get plenty of money out of you as you go for accessories, etc.

All the best with it - Colin.
- Ciao; 3rd Kog.("I'm not racing, just trying to catch the dude up ahead")
Now: Avanti Monza (to keep up with Pinarello riders), Shogun Metro (+ tag-along)
B4: Phillips Multi-track (really bad, but got me back into riding)
User avatar
3rdKogCruiser
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 8:54 pm
Location: NW Adelaide

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby 3rdKogCruiser » Sat Apr 25, 2009 1:02 pm

Another useful site for seeing what's locally available: http://www.bikeexchange.com.au All the hybrids on my local search have have front suspension, except Trek 7.3FX and Specialised Globe Elite (womens) which also has only eight (internal) gears...No, wait - another search brought up Giant CRX & Elwood ranges, which are probably more biased to the road than the trail - worth considering IMO.

Ciao - 3rdKog.
- Ciao; 3rd Kog.("I'm not racing, just trying to catch the dude up ahead")
Now: Avanti Monza (to keep up with Pinarello riders), Shogun Metro (+ tag-along)
B4: Phillips Multi-track (really bad, but got me back into riding)
User avatar
3rdKogCruiser
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 8:54 pm
Location: NW Adelaide

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby funsta13 » Sat May 02, 2009 5:26 pm

Until you can do your entire ride in the top gear, you won't be missing out on the fitness side of things.

imo choose your bike with regards to the condition of the route you have to ride. look at what other commuters are using, you'll be surprised what road bikes can handle.
funsta13
 
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2009 10:43 am

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby Dial » Sat May 02, 2009 5:46 pm

The main problem with most MTB's on the road is top gear in too low. You're basically in top gear riding the flats. A road bike has better gear ratios for riding the road.

It's always handy to have 2 bikes when commuting. even if the second bike you only ride in wet whether. I prefer a flat bar for commuting but there are times when riding into a strong head wind I wish I had a proper road bike.
Dial
 
Posts: 263
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:19 pm
Location: St Ives

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby gdt » Sun May 03, 2009 3:11 am

A consideration is mounting points for racks. If you live in a hot state then having to wear a backpack on a 45C day just sucks. I ended up riding with the work clothes and essentials in my jersey pockets, which was hardly ideal and I doubt could be done with women's work clothing.

Road bikes have a poorer head position for traffic awareness. This isn't a showstopper, but something to be aware of. I'd certainly install a mirror in the commuting scenario.

If you select a road bike, make sure the model you are interested in lets you be comfortable with your hands on the horns (the jacket of the brakes). This is the "commuting in traffic" position on a road bike, as it is the compromise between good vision and hands near brake levers.

Some manufacturers are trying to offer the best of both worlds -- road bikes with flats (and thus a more upright position) and mountings. I expect these will become the commuter bike of choice. An example is the Orbea Aneto, but most manufacturers have a "city" or "fitness" range.

I looked at these but ended up going with a road bike as my commute has a 20Km freeway stage with no protection from the wind, so the lower position on the road bike is useful for that head-wind stretch.

You also shouldn't overlook the potential for using your commuting bike for weekend fun. For example, BikeSA has a few annual events such as a >100Km ride to the seaside. A road bike is more suited to weekend fun, at least until you need to tow kids.

The horrible truth is that most cyclists end up owning both styles of bike. You should certainly keep your old bike as the "popping around to the shops" bike.

Finally, when you get a new bike you're going to spend more time fixing it. That's a bit of a shock, but when you've just dropped $2k on a bike you're going to take an interest in the cleanliness of the gears and chain.
gdt
 
Posts: 605
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 8:36 pm
Location: Adelaide

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby drubie » Sun May 03, 2009 9:55 pm

simonn wrote:
Nobody wrote:I think the position is the significant difference. Most of the total resistance by far is wind resistance and most of that is the rider.


~30km/h+ sure, but not at ~10-20km/h going up hill on mtb when you do the same hills at 15-25km/h on a roadie with hands on the middle of the bar, so similar position.


Might depend a bit on the bike. Even when on the top of the bars on my road bikes, I'm relatively hunched over and not upright MTB style at all.

An old (ahem, classic) steel roadie might fit the bill - heavy but supremely comfortable over long distances. That or one of those Surly long haul truckers.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.
User avatar
drubie
 
Posts: 4617
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:12 am
Location: New England

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby casual_cyclist » Mon May 04, 2009 12:05 am

drubie wrote:An old (ahem, classic) steel roadie might fit the bill - heavy but supremely comfortable over long distances.

That is what I ride and it is very comfortable. I have bought a secondhand beer can but I don't think I will ever love it like my steelie.
<removed by request>
User avatar
casual_cyclist
 
Posts: 7323
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2009 10:41 am
Location: Kewdale

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby tommygunn » Wed Sep 16, 2009 7:04 pm

casual_cyclist wrote:
drubie wrote:An old (ahem, classic) steel roadie might fit the bill - heavy but supremely comfortable over long distances.

That is what I ride and it is very comfortable. I have bought a secondhand beer can but I don't think I will ever love it like my steelie.



It's interesting reading all of this thread - not sure if the OP is still interested in people's responses - my guess is she's bought a new bike by now anyway...but i have an old steel frame roadie (repco superlite) that I love. I've needed to put in some work to get it to a stage that is ride-able again, but, apart from wanting to get the whole STI levers for smooth gear changes - when it's in a gear I need and I'm going places I think it's just as good as a $1500 merida cyclocross i bought...

I actually weighed the 2 and they weigh the same - 12 kgs. Admittedly the CX feels better balanced for some reason...but I only notice that when I'm lifting it up...

on the road I think I prefer the ride of the steel, but love the gear changes of the new cx...

i put some randonneur tyres on the cx too for commuting rather than proper cx riding...and it's a great commuter too...

but...i think the repco is faster down hills and on flats due to the slick tyres ( thou they're still quite wide at 700x28), and i find the randonneurs - even with the little amount of tread they do have and at 85psi max does offer more rolling resistance than the 110 road tyre...i'm not that fit and I definitely notice me working harder on flats on the cx...

but i love them both...the old steelie is faster on flats though coz of the tyres, the cx faster up hills coz of the easy gear changes (no wobbles like i get on the steelie when changing gears on the down-tube gear knobby things)...

FWIW. :)
tommygunn
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 8:53 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby martinjs » Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:28 pm

Get the best of both worlds, Flat bar road bike, I've had mine for 15 months and should pass 20000 kilometers on it by the end of September. :D

Martin
Image
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity!
User avatar
martinjs
 
Posts: 3388
Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2008 7:54 pm
Location: Fivebough, Leeton

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby Fletcher » Fri Sep 18, 2009 9:39 pm

martinjs wrote:Get the best of both worlds, Flat bar road bike, I've had mine for 15 months and should pass 20000 kilometers on it by the end of September. :D

Martin


X2
I did the same seven weeks ago. Clocked 1000km on it and look forward to the commute, hills and all. I look for places to ride on the weekend, and my car has a cover on it. I'm having a blast. :D
Fletcher
 
Posts: 1122
Joined: Fri Jul 24, 2009 5:50 pm
Location: Melba, ACT

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby Ozchuck » Thu Jan 07, 2010 12:58 pm

Gotta remember that one of the keys to fitness is repitition.

If the mountain bike cannot provide an easy trip in a reasonable ammount of time, you're going to drive or catch PT.
Understandable, because they are harder to ride, and painfully slow (imo) when you try to take it easy.

I grabbed a cheap old roadie.
Now I go on 6 hour road rides for the enjoyment alone, my heart rate still goes as high as an MTB ride, but its much more enjoyable with the speed to actually get somewhere and see something nice (out to the mountains and back for example)
the MTB did a 52K return trip most days a week.

I end up doing a longer commute 5 days a week on the roadie because I can chill out, have an easy ride, but in the process burn more calories/get more/better exercise than with just the MTB option.
The MTB had 2" Larsen TT's, so I was obviously wasting time with that, but I dont think it would get much nicer even with those mtb slicks a lot of people have.
Image
Ozchuck
 
Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:34 am

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby trailgumby » Fri Jan 08, 2010 7:54 pm

Ozchuck wrote:The MTB had 2" Larsen TT's, so I was obviously wasting time with that, but I dont think it would get much nicer even with those mtb slicks a lot of people have.

:idea: maybe you should ask someone who has tried them before expressing an opinion that turns out to be incorrect.

In fact they do make a significant difference. With a good set such as Conti Sport Contact 1.3's or Serfas Barista 1,25's they re almost as quick as a 700x23c wheelset.

It won't be as quick on the flats or downhill as a nice light road bike, due to the more upright riding position, but the improvement is very noticeable. And you retain the short gearing with its outstanding hill climbing ability.
"People have a right to their own opinions, but not their own facts. Evidence must be located, not created, and opinions not backed by evidence cannot be given much weight." -- James W Loewen

http://www.facebook.com/Drive2WorkDay
User avatar
trailgumby
 
Posts: 10300
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:30 pm
Location: Northern Beaches, Sydney

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby rearviewmirror » Fri Jan 08, 2010 8:45 pm

Own both... and switch it up once in a while. I alternate between my skinny tired fixie and my Racer X MTB commuter once in a while. 99% of the time I ride the fixie, skinny tires with the challenge of a fixie/singlespeed gearing on the hills and headwinds. The MTB is fun when I feel like I could use a break (using the gears) or want to do some urban assault and curb hopping.
User avatar
rearviewmirror
 
Posts: 188
Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:10 am
Location: Williamstown, Victoria

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby Ozchuck » Mon Jan 11, 2010 11:36 am

Who honestly cant survive on less than 3 chainrings?

I've never met a hill that was too much of an issue in a roadies smaller gear.

The granny gear just never feels necessary on the road. dirt for sure, but not on the road.
Is this another thing thats just me?
Image
Ozchuck
 
Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:34 am

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby rimmeraj » Tue Jan 12, 2010 12:27 pm

my experience:
I also recently bought a new bike due to my old communter being stolen from work.
the old bike was a mtb with wide tyres, it was not very heavy but took more effort to ride.
commuting to work, I was always being overtaken and it was a chore on many days, particularly on hills (go figure).

I bought a new road bike and it is the best thing I ever did. it is never a chore and is very easy to ride to work.
It is more comfortable and I now overtake most other people on the way to work.
I ride 12kms round trip mainly on bike paths, which will become 30km when my work moves offices in April.
rimmeraj
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:20 am
Location: Brisbane

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby longshanks » Tue Jan 12, 2010 1:49 pm

i ride a MTB for a 20km round trip commute into the Sydney CBD. i am a pretty heavy guy (abt 110kgs) and like the robustness of my bike as i find some of the roads have some reasonable pot holes etc. i don't find the speed much of an issue..i pass some riders and get passed by riders. i still get a reasonable work out so maybe i cover both the fitness and ease question.

still, the day is nearing when i will get a roadie..
longshanks
 
Posts: 151
Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2008 4:09 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Fitness or Ease??

Postby Ozchuck » Thu Jan 14, 2010 1:19 pm

"It doesn't get easier, you just go faster" - Greg Lemond.
Image
Ozchuck
 
Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:34 am

Previous

Return to General discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: AdsPear, Baalzamon



Popular Bike Shops
Torpedo 7 Torpedo7 AU
Ground Effect Ground Effect NZ
Chain Reaction Cycles CRC UK
Wiggle Wiggle UK
Ebay Ebay AU

“Bicycles BNA Twitter
“Bicycles BNA Facebook
“Google+ BNA Google+
“Bicycles BNA Newsletter

> FREE BNA Stickers
> BNA Cycling Kit