The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby trailgumby » Sat Aug 24, 2013 11:13 pm

CXCommuter wrote:He was holding the phone in both hands leaning forward on the tri bars

:lol: Darwin Award!
"People have a right to their own opinions, but not their own facts. Evidence must be located, not created, and opinions not backed by evidence cannot be given much weight." -- James W Loewen

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by BNA » Sat Aug 24, 2013 11:27 pm

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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby trailgumby » Sat Aug 24, 2013 11:27 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:Just curious - what is the problem with tri-bars (which I used to use when I was still riding).

Actually tri-bars seem to me to be a bit less common than they used to be.

Brakes. Try getting to them in an emergency when you're on the tri-bars, and see what happens.

It's not unlike like driving a car with brake pedal in the passenger side footwell.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby Percrime » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:49 am

trailgumby wrote:
Percrime wrote:Self entitled plonkers.

Legally they're right. And still plonkers. Probably just as self-entitled and incapable of courtesy when behind the wheel of a car. Scary thought.

But if you get off your bike and start walking and hold your line, you turn the tables on them. ;)


I,ll do exactly that. Running while pushing the bike. Anytime I see em. Cyclecross practice. And I,ll be using all my side of the path thank you. And I should imagine they are as self entitled and incapable of courtesy in every single thing they do.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby jules21 » Sun Aug 25, 2013 6:49 pm

Percrime wrote:It appears I should have completely left the path to allow those people to use it in its entirety as "bicycles must give way to pedestrians' and they were walking alongside each other over the middle of the path and that was their utter right.

dismount and wait with your bike next to you for them to pass, taking up the whole path :mrgreen:

i have very few issues with pedestrians on shared paths (dog walkers aside, who are often terrible), but every now and then you'll find someone..
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby g-boaf » Sun Aug 25, 2013 7:30 pm

Percrime wrote:Very unpleasant woman and hubby... both apparently 65 on the Centennial trail today. I passed them going the other way at marginally over jogging pace... (I could tell cos the joggers I had passed back before burke rd were still in sight behind) on my side.. and completely on my side and a foot or so clear. I passed.. they yelled abuse. I returned to enquire.

It appears I should have completely left the path to allow those people to use it in its entirety as "bicycles must give way to pedestrians' and they were walking alongside each other over the middle of the path and that was their utter right.

Self entitled plonkers.

I suggested to the male that if he was so keen on a fight I was fine with it and the woman suggested I was picking on an old man. Pah.. bigger age difference between my brother and me.

Seriously... its a long while since I have met bigger wastes of oxygen. I,m going to start jogging that bit of path and I wont be moving over an inch for anyone going the other way.


They are right - you have to give way to them as they are vulnerable users of the path.

You should even dismount and walk past them.

Haven't you learned anything from the numerous lectures on BNA with the pedestrians in disguise on here saying all the above? ;)

When I come up against those people I go very slowly past them at no more than their speed and wait until they move to give me enough room.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby VRE » Mon Aug 26, 2013 7:04 am

I don't. I slow down to a reasonable speed (which may still be faster than walking speed), use my bell if necessary (when I'm at least 10 seconds away), and if they move aside for me, I thank them. On the other hand, if they still deliberately obstruct me, then I remind them it's a shared path. If that offends them, so be it.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby higdawg » Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:47 pm

I must the only one but I have never had any issues on shared paths at all. Everyone is happy and says hello back to me when I go past.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby g-boaf » Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:26 pm

Some people just don't want to share. Or rather, they do, but only on their terms. :roll:

Too many angry people around these days.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby CXCommuter » Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:10 pm

trailgumby wrote:
ColinOldnCranky wrote:Just curious - what is the problem with tri-bars (which I used to use when I was still riding).

Actually tri-bars seem to me to be a bit less common than they used to be.

Brakes. Try getting to them in an emergency when you're on the tri-bars, and see what happens.

It's not unlike like driving a car with brake pedal in the passenger side footwell.


Exactly, excellent for long flat sections of road with no one around, on a Shared path they are dangerous but the biggest concern in this case was using them as a resting pad for his arms holding a mobile entertainment device.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby zero » Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:27 pm

g-boaf wrote:Haven't you learned anything from the numerous lectures on BNA with the pedestrians in disguise on here saying all the above? ;)


We've never said that. In the case of people who won't share part of the path at all (which is a far less frequently observable event than poor driving imo), I just stop and make them go round, which forces them to make the space anyway.

If you must say anything to them, tell them its a very bad idea to try make a kid cyclist leave and reenter a path at a shallow angle.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby Thrilloilogy » Tue Aug 27, 2013 11:39 pm

Not sure why you'd ride at night like one guy I saw tonight with no rear or front light and just rely on your hi-viz! Every tradie and his dog wears hi-viz these days!


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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby DavidS » Wed Aug 28, 2013 12:13 am

Hah, shared paths, I had a fair few pedestrians to deal with on the bike path tonight. I just don't understand why they want to use a path at the same time as bikes doing around 30KMh when it is a bike path and the pedestrian path is a few metres away.

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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby eldavo » Wed Aug 28, 2013 1:14 am

trailgumby wrote:
ColinOldnCranky wrote:Just curious - what is the problem with tri-bars (which I used to use when I was still riding).
Actually tri-bars seem to me to be a bit less common than they used to be.

Brakes. Try getting to them in an emergency when you're on the tri-bars, and see what happens.
It's not unlike like driving a car with brake pedal in the passenger side footwell.

What are Fixies without brakes at tri-bike speeds like then? ;)
Does being dressed well in dark colours with a nice overcoat and stylish brimmed hat score higher? Bonus points for no lights, no bell riding a pretty bike?

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Fixie rider cliche in Leederville, no brakes, no lights, dark fashion clothing and hat at speed around a bend with 2 pedestrian entries, an overpass entry, and a crossing from bus/train/PSP access that I'm on.

He locks up fixed rear wheel getting it sideways laying a big black line/arc with a puff of white smoke off the tyre. Very cool and dramatic, but didn't slow down much. Ends up pointing himself towards the oncoming traffic effectively getting around me with just poo in tight burgundy pants (or is that chocolate brown now?), no blood exchanged.

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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby yellagonga » Wed Aug 28, 2013 1:51 am

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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby g-boaf » Wed Aug 28, 2013 12:52 pm

DavidS wrote:Hah, shared paths, I had a fair few pedestrians to deal with on the bike path tonight. I just don't understand why they want to use a path at the same time as bikes doing around 30KMh when it is a bike path and the pedestrian path is a few metres away.

DS


Soon your bike path will be a pedestrian shared path. :lol: :twisted:
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby zero » Wed Aug 28, 2013 1:50 pm

eldavo wrote:.
fixie video
.


The dude didn't just magically appear, and believe it or not, people entering the path on a vehicle (ie you) have to give way to any path users (ie him).

and whats with designer myopia reaching the point where overpasses are built so badly that ground crossings are necessary almost underneath them.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby eldavo » Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:34 pm

fair point, my defense is he does look like a magician though! Where's my wallet gone...
Check the frames of the approach, where's Wally?
I love giving way to people, free bell ringing for all, slowed down and looked around making a good crack at it, but it's a little more difficult to indulge in my passion when:
- you're a knob wearing dark clothes after sunset on a bike without lights and do not slow down for blind bends or other traffic
- you expect that other traffic is arrested by your fashionable good looks and beautiful bike
- you expect that the world revolves around you and is ready to anticipate your magical moves fuelled by the magnificent mojo you are radiantly emitting

You can be pig headed and say you've got right of way so charge through intersections (where incidents occur the most). Doesn't make it right... or legal.
FYI if this were an incident, he'd have been riding a non-compliant bike in an accident without lights after sunset.
You then forfeit any recourse through state motor vehicle 3rd party insurance if you tangle with a registered motor vehicle.
If you seek damages from my 3rd party cycle insurance, they will not admit fault for the same reasons.
Recent local example? Search for bicycle here:
http://www.postnewspapers.com.au/editions/20130622/pdf/paper.pdf
Police said the road traffic code said cyclists had to have lights on their bikes when the Bureau of Meteorology says it is sunset.
Police said the sun had set on that Friday at 5.19pm.
“People should check when sunset happens before they start their travel,” an officer said.
“The woman can make an application for a copy of the witness statement.
“She is entitled to a copy of the crash report.”
An ambulance took the woman to hospital after the incident.
She had cuts and bruises and damaged teeth, bruised ribs and a cracked lower jaw.

Ironically I found that article referenced from this article, that also had some broken logic lacking any apparent experience in making some points:
https://www.bwa.org.au/bikes-and-riding/718/
For instance taking my example frames/footage, the pedestrian in white shirt is much higher contrast and visibility than anyone else on the other side of crossing. Common sense and experience would tell you that, you don't need to find evidence based research, but the BWA seems to be lacking on both fronts.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby human909 » Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:52 pm

Eldavo, make all the excuses you want. You cut him off. You follow that up by blaming him!? Wow!
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby Wakatuki » Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:12 pm

human909 wrote:Eldavo, make all the excuses you want. You cut him off. You follow that up by blaming him!? Wow!


I wasn't sure of the path rules so didn't comment, Eldavo it looked like you were the SMIDSY instigator in this video. It seems you zombied into the way of a path user. He probably feels you owe him a tyre with the huge flat spot he now has. But he's like whatever chill man, share the love. Not a raging war on Lycra louts.

On a similar tangent, a personal experience. Rode up the local, recently reopened hill, my wife who says hello or morning to everyone :roll: I wish she would concentrate on gears or breathing or something, she got elbow clipped by another rider overtaking so close while going uphill, a meter matters to everyone. Plenty of Zoolander faces out there too, not many even returning a cursory half hand lift (the low 5) She later commented, "wow, even cyclists hate cyclists". I think she might be onto something. Unfortunately... :(
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby zero » Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:33 pm

Eldavo, you'll find that a magistrate in a claims court may not care that much what your insurance company thinks, if an event happens to come to his attention and coppers don't get to choose who is considered to have contributed negligence in a claims scenario either.

There is a general expectation that road vehicles be lit, but there is no expectation that joggers be lit, and he was moving in a place where joggers may be, at a speed not particularly far out of the envelope of a fast runner, and if any vaguely competent lawyer said that in a court of law, you'd probably be found to have contributed negligence in any accident with him on a sharepath under the prevailing lighting conditions if it were determined you failed to give way. I wouldn't count on decisions with fairly dissimilar scenarios acting as some sort of perfect precedent, and particularly when no cars are involved, as that impacts the biases you face dramatically.

I agree, substandard riding and lighting choices on his behalf too, though sweet hat and the real shame of the video, is that its not legal to ride in a hat like that.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby g-boaf » Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:41 pm

I think Eldavo that you should have given way to him. Perhaps dismounted your bike and walked across or waited in the island section of the road for the other cyclist to be on his way.

I'd suggest taking down the video though... ;) or you might have a fixie rider after you for a new tyre.
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby zero » Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:45 pm

g-boaf wrote:I think Eldavo that you should have given way to him. Perhaps dismounted your bike and walked across or waited in the island section of the road for the other cyclist to be on his way.

I'd suggest taking down the video though... ;) or you might have a fixie rider after you for a new tyre.


If it were me, I'd give him a brake lever and a caliper, free of charge :)
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby eldavo » Wed Aug 28, 2013 4:41 pm

I wouldn't be a SMIDSY'ing, I'd be a WTFAUFT'ing, no zombie-ing or failing to look or slow or give due care and attention for the intersection on my part, so happy to meet him and exchange words.

I'm not out there to block his race line, but if you carry speed and don't have brakes or don't want to slow down to adjust your line, you have no lights, dark clothes, and not adjust for a multi-intersection on a bend... That's not sharing the path. Yes it is a shared path of some variety. His speed was well above a jogger, with no ability to slow or stop like a jogger could in that same distance.

Video is happy to stay, I've got no issue pointing out that you can't expect people to give way to you if you flaunt all the rules and don't choose to be seen, choose to share, or choose to ride on a bicycle that is able to slow down when it needs to =)
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby Wakatuki » Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:05 pm

Shoulda gone to specasavers, unless your cam is compensating for low light, its hardly dark.
He is even more visible on your still captures and clearly takes evasive action. I can also see your lights, you are clearly a conscious and law abiding rider, thank you. A pair of blinkys on the fixie may have changed everything or nothing. But from the other rider's opinion I doubt he sees it the same way. To me it's a brush off incident, you have both clearly had a scare, keep calm and carry on. :)
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Re: The Dumb Cyclists and Pedestrians thread...

Postby human909 » Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:12 pm

Oh dear! :shock:

At least a SMIDSY is admitting their mistake in the incident. You seem to oblivious to your own mistake which is worse. (Sure the other rider might be riding fast, have no lights and limited braking. But that does not diminish your responsibilities to ride safely. Cutting somebody off it not riding safely!)
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