Tailights

open topic, for anything cycling related.

Re: Tailights

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:36 am

No problems with water and Radbots in Melbs so far. Dual seatstay mount: 500L and 1000R. The RZ4 goes onto the seatpost.
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by BNA » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:12 pm

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Re: Tailights

Postby Coolabah » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:12 pm

il padrone wrote:Ah! Well it is the correct word to use in the case of tail-lights. Most people talk about visibility but that is your ability to see, most relevant for head-lights. With a tail-light you want others to be able to see you ie. you want to be conspicuous.

Note - also why the term high-visibility jacket is an oxymoron. The jacket doesn't give you better vision :P
[end pedant]


Can't say the Oxford dictionary, or more importantly to my troubled psyche....my old high school Latin teacher.... agrees with your definition , but maybe you use the Macquarie dictionary or somesuch ? :
Definition of visibility
noun
[mass noun]

the state of being able to see or be seen:a reduction in police presence and visibility on the streets
the distance one can see as determined by light and weather conditions:visibility was down to 15 yards
the degree to which something has attracted general attention; prominence:the issue began to lose its visibility

Origin:

late Middle English: from French visibilite or late Latin visibilitas, from Latin visibilis (see visible)
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Re: Tailights

Postby Coolabah » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:21 pm

il padrone wrote:Niteflux's Redzone 4 and 8 both have exceptional conspicuity, more than 180 degrees of spread.


Yes , I agree ! They are indeed highly visible . Love my RZ 8 but am still using the RZ4 on one of my bikes and this is still pretty good IMHO ( but some reports from other users say otherwise eg reliability ) . I am going to look at some easy method of eg mounting RZ8 to a small tube which somehow attaches to , for example, a backpack or bike rack etc etc ...
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Re: Tailights

Postby Comedian » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:47 pm

Only problem I've had with radbots is the contacts between the electronics and the battery eventually wear out, and they start turning off. This happened after maybe .. 15,000k. You could possibly replace the contacts with wires with a little delicate soldering. Or maybe it was just my light.
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Re: Tailights

Postby Coolabah » Wed Mar 20, 2013 5:01 pm

Mulger bill wrote:
What is the "correct" method (as in: the RTFM installation)? Still can't find anything about the RZ8 on the Nightflux site :roll:
I didn't like the supplied RZ4 mount so I MacGyvered some sheet metal so it fits onto a standard PBSF/Radbot type of mount. Kinda ugly but functional.
Between us we should be able to sort Pete out. :wink:


My RZ8 lights each came with a velcro strap with buckle ie you clinch it down tight to your seat post. Works 100% brilliantly "as designed", it absolutely will NOT budge. The problem ( as detailed in this thread ) appears when you do NOT want to mount it on your seat post .... what to do now ??? !!!!
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Re: Tailights

Postby il padrone » Wed Mar 20, 2013 5:02 pm

Comedian wrote:Only problem I've had with radbots is the contacts between the electronics and the battery eventually wear out, and they start turning off.

Ah, the great value of a hard-wired dynamo light system ;)
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Re: Tailights

Postby Coolabah » Wed Mar 20, 2013 5:27 pm

il padrone wrote:
Comedian wrote:Only problem I've had with radbots is the contacts between the electronics and the battery eventually wear out, and they start turning off.

Ah, the great value of a hard-wired dynamo light system ;)


Maybe. Any electrical contact subject to the environmental conditions experienced during bike riding ( vibration , moisture, dirt etc ) is/are prone to problems - even soldered joints can fail but certainly any mechanical joint is more subject to possible problems particularly due to corrosion or physical loss of electrical contact - think bent/loose connection.... We would need to see some hard data on the different products - IP , are you able to research that ? You are much better than I am at this sort of thing !! I'm sure we would all appreciate your efforts, but I can of course only speak for myself. So , which is better from a reliability viewpoint - dynamo or battery lights ???

hmmm....
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Re: Tailights

Postby il padrone » Wed Mar 20, 2013 6:05 pm

Coolabah wrote: Any electrical contact subject to the environmental conditions experienced during bike riding ( vibration , moisture, dirt etc ) is/are prone to problems - even soldered joints can fail but certainly any mechanical joint is more subject to possible problems particularly due to corrosion or physical loss of electrical contact - think bent/loose connection.... We would need to see some hard data on the different products - IP , are you able to research that ? You are much better than I am at this sort of thing !! I'm sure we would all appreciate your efforts, but I can of course only speak for myself. So , which is better from a reliability viewpoint - dynamo or battery lights ???

I can speak subjectively from my experience - ~10 years with various B&M lights double-wired to dynamos and dynohub, and 2 years with the Supernova E3 f&r lights wired to a dynohub. Dynohubs just go on and on and on..... The only time I have had my Supernoova lights not work was when the hub contact had got knocked off - happened twice and picked up as I wheeIed the bike along. Just reconnected it and am about to play around to enlarge the wiring loop to prevent this. The wiring is a complete loom to both lights with just the one joint, a very neatly finished one when done. It is two small alloy tubes that you crimp each end of the dipole cable into, then each connector has heatshrink over it, followed by larger heatshrink over the lot. Alternately you can facilitate removal by purchasing the (not cheap) gold connectors, like these:

Image

The old B&M system gave me equally few problems for about 10 years. I did burn out one dynamo, but it was covered under their very fine 3 year warranty. The replacement is still running on our tandem about 7 years later. I progressed through three different headlights as upgrades and one of them did fail when in use by my son - something has come loose inside, but I have not got around to pulling it apart (these lights are not designed to be user serviceable, rather "not needing service") My son did also manage to burn out the circuitry of his Seculite tail-light. These are fairly cheap to replace and I had a couple spare.

So overall the incidence of on-road failures has been very low - in 10 years one dynamo burned out on a daylight mountain descent, one headlight and one tail-light failure - amongst lights that are running on three regularly used bikes and two others less well-used.

Some more information about others' experiences here:

http://www.ecovelo.info/2011/11/01/batt ... mo-lights/
http://mattjon.es/blog/2011/12/bicycle-lighting/
http://veloweb.ca/randonneuring/bicycle-lighting/
http://www.gravelbike.com/?p=350
http://www.longleafbicycles.com/product ... -lighting/
http://bicycling.about.com/od/bikeequip ... o_hubs.htm

And after daily use of this lighting system for six months, I can tell you that the dynohub set-up on my normal commuter bike, an Xtracycle, is awesome. I leave the light on all the time as I can tell zero difference in rolling resitance and it'a BRIGHT. It certainly can't hurt (and I imagine it helps) people in cars notice me.

Very much my experience as well.

Batteries-shmatteries! My dynohub-pwered lights are simply "always there". The LED lights have such huge lifespans (>100,000hrs) that I am happy to run them all the time, even all day on long tours. They make drivers stop for me in daylight because they mistake me (with the panniers on) for a motorbike 8). I commute with panniers so this effect works there as well.

Dynohub front wheels (Shimano) can be had for between $80-130 (fully built-up) from http://www.xxcycles.com in France.
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Re: Tailights

Postby Coolabah » Wed Mar 20, 2013 6:40 pm

well.. I am immediately feeling much better with my recent choice... just ordered a new bike with SON dynamo & led lights... thought long & hard as my last dynamo was in 1972 and one only put it on ( manual on/off engage lever ) when you absolutely had to ..... chewed your tyres , chewed your energy up the hills, and the light power generated down the very steepest hill was , I'm sure, maximum 0.0000000002 watts !!!!
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Re: Tailights

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Mar 20, 2013 6:57 pm

Coolabah wrote:
Mulger bill wrote:
What is the "correct" method (as in: the RTFM installation)? Still can't find anything about the RZ8 on the Nightflux site :roll:
I didn't like the supplied RZ4 mount so I MacGyvered some sheet metal so it fits onto a standard PBSF/Radbot type of mount. Kinda ugly but functional.
Between us we should be able to sort Pete out. :wink:


My RZ8 lights each came with a velcro strap with buckle ie you clinch it down tight to your seat post. Works 100% brilliantly "as designed", it absolutely will NOT budge. The problem ( as detailed in this thread ) appears when you do NOT want to mount it on your seat post .... what to do now ??? !!!!


Thanks for that. What's the overall length of the RZ8 please.

Pete, What's the C-C spacing of the mount holes for the E3?

Shaun
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Re: Tailights

Postby Coolabah » Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:10 pm

Mulger bill wrote:
Thanks for that. What's the overall length of the RZ8 please.

Shaun


... pretty much 90 mm , measured with my old high school ruler ... so , +/- 2 mm or so I guess !!!
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Re: Tailights

Postby il padrone » Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:23 pm

The E3 tail light is on a standard Euro 50mm mount, and it sits out 15mm from the rack on spacers.

- except mine doesn't have any centre hole for the lead to go through

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Re: Tailights

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:33 pm

Thanks again.
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Re: Tailights

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:43 pm

Pete, could a thin metal plate fit comfortably between the head unit and the spacers?
What's the available 3D space like directly above this hypothetical plate?
Thanks.

Wonder how much they weigh??? Hmmm, Google...
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Re: Tailights

Postby il padrone » Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:53 pm

Such a plate could possibly be fitted. Probably best at the rear(front) of the rack-mounting bar as there is the light cable in between the light and the rack. Also there's not really enough length in the mounting bolts, I'd need to find longer substitutes (they are very neat bolts that are the exact length to go into a couple of small nyloc nuts). The space above depends on the load carried - unloaded there's as much as you like, normally the rackbag strapped with ocker straps limits it realistically to about 50-100mm I'd guess.

I've got to thank you for putting such thought into my issue MB, but it's really not a huge worry. I am pretty happy with the conspicuity provided by the E3 and the Fenderbot, together with the really brilliant reflectives of the Ortlieb rear patches. I've been asked by motorists - "What are those two bright lights you have on the back of your bike - you know down on your bags ??" :P Your lights shining back at you bud :twisted:
Last edited by il padrone on Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tailights

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:06 pm

No worries Pete, thanks for the mental exercise.
Thing weighs 92g, my idea's out the window anyway.

Cheers
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Re: Tailights

Postby il padrone » Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:32 pm

Now you've got me thinking...... 'cos the rear plate has two holes outboard of the E3, about 70mm apart. Could use those :?
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Re: Tailights

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:50 pm

Might be easier.

Still not sure about the engineering of this under riding conditions but I'm thinking of a 90 mm length of old cf seatpost slit down one side and a suitably shaped and drilled bracket of thick enough sheetmetal epoxied into it. Add some sort of caps to the tube to tidy it up and a squirt of black paint on the metalwork.

Open to other approaches...
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Re: Tailights

Postby il padrone » Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:58 pm

Hmm....

Or a suitably shaped piece of 3-4mm thick aluminium plate (sort of T-shaped) with two seat-post sized half rounds of timber, or alloy section if it's made, bolted onto this to form an upright post.
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Re: Tailights

Postby Mulger bill » Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:04 am

Now you're thinking. Can you make it fit the available space with a full load?
Time to scrounge the metalwork room and have a yarn with the carpenter :wink:
I'd like to see some pics when you're done. :D
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Re: Tailights

Postby Mulger bill » Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:05 am

Oh yeah, the timber mouldings... Brass rivets. :P
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Re: Tailights

Postby il padrone » Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:35 am

Mulger bill wrote:I'd like to see some pics when you're done. :D

Hmm... all a bit of an intellectual exercise at the mo, what with the recovering (still painful in use) broken collar-bone (rhs), and the ensuing three month tour of Italy & Corsica, I kinda have other priorities pressing. Number one being getting back on the bike :| Messing around with cutting tools is not going to be likely.
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Re: Tailights

Postby Aushiker » Sun Mar 31, 2013 8:04 pm

Anyone for a bit of plumbing out the back :)

Image

I am not quite sure what the point is of this design shape but it is the new [url]http://www.exposurelights.com/product/2/000102/blaze-mk1-(new)/]Exposure Blaze Mk 1[/url] which is rated at 80 lumens. apparently . There is a bit of write-up on it at BikeRadar.com as well.

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Re: Tailights

Postby Comedian » Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:46 am

Aushiker wrote:Anyone for a bit of plumbing out the back :)

Image

I am not quite sure what the point is of this design shape but it is the new [url]http://www.exposurelights.com/product/2/000102/blaze-mk1-(new)/]Exposure Blaze Mk 1[/url] which is rated at 80 lumens. apparently . There is a bit of write-up on it at BikeRadar.com as well.

Andrew

Very good! Would be interesting to see one in the flesh.

Very happy with the radbots but I wish they had a rechargeable version.
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Re: Tailights

Postby rangersac » Tue Apr 02, 2013 1:45 pm

Another one to throw into the mix, the Serfas Thunderbolt. Whilst it doesn't have the possum frying capabilities of a RZ8, I picked up one of these from the LBS are being impressed after a demo from the shop owner.

Image

The strip LED is highly non-directional so has excellent side visibility. It has two flash power modes, with the bright flash being easily daylight visible. The two strap, removeable at both ends system means you can cinch to just about any tube diameter, from seatpost right down to pannier rack tubing. I've mounted it at the back of my pannier rack on a cut to size piece of wooden dowel, which is cable-tied to the rack through the reflector mount points.
Last edited by rangersac on Wed Apr 03, 2013 11:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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