Moron Motorists #3

jasonc
Posts: 9736
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:40 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby jasonc » Fri Jun 29, 2018 8:54 am

bychosis wrote:I don’t as why it’s so hard. They’ve been around for decades. Indicate as if it were a crossroads when you approach, indicate left to exit. Approach in a lane that is marked for your direction. Give way to those already on the roundabout. Just goes to show the driver training we have in this country is woeful.

This
Image

malnar
Posts: 341
Joined: Tue May 18, 2010 2:46 pm
Location: Melb - Werribee - City

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby malnar » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:28 am

On my commute, proceeding straight on a suburban road that's a bit of a rat run. Approach an intersection which has stop signs for the intersecting street. I see a big silver van (with business name painted on the side) on my right. Driver's wanting to turn right onto the road I'm on. He slows to about 10 kph at the stop sign then accelerates right as I'm going past. I was on the right wheel track so had room to swerve left. It took two loud 'hey!!!s' from me to get him to stop (by this time fully on the road I was on). Fly6 running so have rear footage.

Newcastle Dave
Posts: 164
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:17 pm

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby Newcastle Dave » Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:50 am

bychosis wrote:I don’t as why it’s so hard. They’ve been around for decades. Indicate as if it were a crossroads when you approach, indicate left to exit. Approach in a lane that is marked for your direction. Give way to those already on the roundabout. Just goes to show the driver training we have in this country is woeful.

I don't have a problem indicating going left or right when approaching a roundabout, but how are you meant to indicate when leaving at some of the "mini" roundabouts many councils have installed, especially when going straight through

When going straight you need to wait until you have passed the left turn before indicating (left) that you are leaving the roundabout, problem is that at any kind of speed the blinker has time to flash between 0 and 1 times before you have started to exit

This isn't a problem at larger (especially multi lane) roundabouts, just the ones where councils seem to have concreted a circle in the middle of what was a normal cross junction

User avatar
bychosis
Posts: 5610
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: Lake Macquarie

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby bychosis » Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:12 am

Newcastle Dave wrote:
bychosis wrote:I don’t as why it’s so hard. They’ve been around for decades. Indicate as if it were a crossroads when you approach, indicate left to exit. Approach in a lane that is marked for your direction. Give way to those already on the roundabout. Just goes to show the driver training we have in this country is woeful.

I don't have a problem indicating going left or right when approaching a roundabout, but how are you meant to indicate when leaving at some of the "mini" roundabouts many councils have installed, especially when going straight through

When going straight you need to wait until you have passed the left turn before indicating (left) that you are leaving the roundabout, problem is that at any kind of speed the blinker has time to flash between 0 and 1 times before you have started to exit

This isn't a problem at larger (especially multi lane) roundabouts, just the ones where councils seem to have concreted a circle in the middle of what was a normal cross junction

Indicating to exit isnt required on small roundabouts, ie when impractical.
bychosis (bahy-koh-sis): A mental disorder of delusions indicating impaired contact with a reality of no bicycles.

AdelaidePeter
Posts: 343
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:13 am

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby AdelaidePeter » Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:25 am

Newcastle Dave wrote:
bychosis wrote:I don’t as why it’s so hard. They’ve been around for decades. Indicate as if it were a crossroads when you approach, indicate left to exit. Approach in a lane that is marked for your direction. Give way to those already on the roundabout. Just goes to show the driver training we have in this country is woeful.



Not only "indicate... as you approach": if turning right, you should leave your right indicator on until just before the exit. This is important for the case below...

Newcastle Dave wrote:I don't have a problem indicating going left or right when approaching a roundabout, but how are you meant to indicate when leaving at some of the "mini" roundabouts many councils have installed, especially when going straight through

When going straight you need to wait until you have passed the left turn before indicating (left) that you are leaving the roundabout, problem is that at any kind of speed the blinker has time to flash between 0 and 1 times before you have started to exit

This isn't a problem at larger (especially multi lane) roundabouts, just the ones where councils seem to have concreted a circle in the middle of what was a normal cross junction


The road rule is "if practicable", so there's no need to indicate left if it's not practicable. Also, it's implied that you're going straight ahead by the fact that your right indicator isn't on.

User avatar
mikesbytes
Super Mod
Super Mod
Posts: 18981
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:42 pm
Location: Tempe, Sydney
Contact:

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby mikesbytes » Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:40 am

In my view the indicator rules should be the same as they would be for the same intersection not containing a roundabout. Would mean that everyone understands what to do and what the other road users are going to do
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

jasonc
Posts: 9736
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:40 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby jasonc » Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:13 pm

Image

adam0bmx0
Posts: 191
Joined: Wed Dec 02, 2015 10:38 am
Location: Brisbane

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby adam0bmx0 » Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:45 pm

jasonc wrote:J's vid


Tight! :shock:

I always claim the lane early coming into that right hander, but not had any daft enough to attempt that manoeuvre before.

jasonc
Posts: 9736
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:40 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby jasonc » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:08 pm

adam0bmx0 wrote:
jasonc wrote:J's vid


Tight! :shock:

I always claim the lane early coming into that right hander, but not had any daft enough to attempt that manoeuvre before.

I heard them coming so moved left thinking they would overtake quickly. Sadly a Getz can't go quicker
Image

duncanm
Posts: 487
Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2010 10:42 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby duncanm » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:34 pm

Cognitive dissonance in Fairfax regarding Sydney traffic....
‘It’s way worse’: The new high noon on Sydney’s roads
Every Saturday Lamya and her family criss-cross our roads getting to sport. The weekend offers little relief from traffic - and some roads are even worse than on weekdays.


Can't think of why traffic would be so bad.. (facepalm)

User avatar
bychosis
Posts: 5610
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: Lake Macquarie

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby bychosis » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:40 pm

duncanm wrote:Cognitive dissonance in Fairfax regarding Sydney traffic....
‘It’s way worse’: The new high noon on Sydney’s roads
Every Saturday Lamya and her family criss-cross our roads getting to sport. The weekend offers little relief from traffic - and some roads are even worse than on weekdays.


Can't think of why traffic would be so bad.. (facepalm)


It's obviously because of all the cyclists clogging up the roads. :roll:
bychosis (bahy-koh-sis): A mental disorder of delusions indicating impaired contact with a reality of no bicycles.

User avatar
Ross
Posts: 5303
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 8:53 pm

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby Ross » Sat Jun 30, 2018 7:46 am

Drink-driver films journey on dashcam

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/uk-england- ... on-dashcam

User avatar
Biffidus
Posts: 755
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:20 pm
Location: RADelaide

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby Biffidus » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:57 am

bychosis wrote:I don’t as why it’s so hard. They’ve been around for decades. Indicate as if it were a crossroads when you approach, indicate left to exit. Approach in a lane that is marked for your direction. Give way to those already on the roundabout. Just goes to show the driver training we have in this country is woeful.


I was going to post the same thing. It's really not difficult. This talk of changing lanes worries me... you shouldn't be changing lanes in a roundabout.

User avatar
trailgumby
Posts: 13147
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:30 pm
Location: Northern Beaches, Sydney
Contact:

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby trailgumby » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:28 am

Biffidus wrote:
bychosis wrote:I don’t as why it’s so hard. They’ve been around for decades. Indicate as if it were a crossroads when you approach, indicate left to exit. Approach in a lane that is marked for your direction. Give way to those already on the roundabout. Just goes to show the driver training we have in this country is woeful.


I was going to post the same thing. It's really not difficult. This talk of changing lanes worries me... you shouldn't be changing lanes in a roundabout.

Not much choice if you want to get off a two-lane roundabout and you're in the right hand lane on entry.

User avatar
bychosis
Posts: 5610
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: Lake Macquarie

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby bychosis » Sat Jun 30, 2018 12:43 pm

trailgumby wrote:
Biffidus wrote:
bychosis wrote:I don’t as why it’s so hard. They’ve been around for decades. Indicate as if it were a crossroads when you approach, indicate left to exit. Approach in a lane that is marked for your direction. Give way to those already on the roundabout. Just goes to show the driver training we have in this country is woeful.


I was going to post the same thing. It's really not difficult. This talk of changing lanes worries me... you shouldn't be changing lanes in a roundabout.

Not much choice if you want to get off a two-lane roundabout and you're in the right hand lane on entry.


There aren’t many where you need to change lanes mid roundabout, more than a few where you exit from the ‘right’ lane and into the right of two lanes. I can think of 3 within a few kms, the design is such that you don’t need to change lanes mid roundabout. Exit from the lane you enter in, but cross the other lane as you exit rather than change into the other lane then exit from it.
bychosis (bahy-koh-sis): A mental disorder of delusions indicating impaired contact with a reality of no bicycles.

jasonc
Posts: 9736
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:40 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby jasonc » Sat Jun 30, 2018 1:34 pm

trailgumby wrote:
Biffidus wrote:
bychosis wrote:I don’t as why it’s so hard. They’ve been around for decades. Indicate as if it were a crossroads when you approach, indicate left to exit. Approach in a lane that is marked for your direction. Give way to those already on the roundabout. Just goes to show the driver training we have in this country is woeful.


I was going to post the same thing. It's really not difficult. This talk of changing lanes worries me... you shouldn't be changing lanes in a roundabout.

Not much choice if you want to get off a two-lane roundabout and you're in the right hand lane on entry.

It's illegal to change lanes through an intersection. All multi lane round abouts I've encountered allow the lanes to exit based on the arrows. I've never had to change lanes
Image

kenwstr
Posts: 488
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:21 pm

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby kenwstr » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:45 pm

trailgumby wrote:
Biffidus wrote:
bychosis wrote:I don’t as why it’s so hard. They’ve been around for decades. Indicate as if it were a crossroads when you approach, indicate left to exit. Approach in a lane that is marked for your direction. Give way to those already on the roundabout. Just goes to show the driver training we have in this country is woeful.


I was going to post the same thing. It's really not difficult. This talk of changing lanes worries me... you shouldn't be changing lanes in a roundabout.

Not much choice if you want to get off a two-lane roundabout and you're in the right hand lane on entry.


While England has some horror roundabouts, they do have a system there that really impressed me as the easiest and safest I've seen. I think we should adopt it here too. The roundabout lanes all spiral out from the centre and the left most lane is the off ramp to the 1st exit road so the 2nd left lane is now the most left most lane and is the off ramp to the next exit road and so on.
This means that on entering, the left lane will take you to the 1st exit, 2nd from left will take you to the 2nd exit, 3rd from left will take you to the 3rd exit and so on. If there are 3 lanes entering and you want the 4th exit, you simply enter the 3rd lane and when the 4th opens from the centre, you simply drive into this new empty 4th lane to the 4th exit from where you entered, too easy. Each lane simply all takes you where you want to go and never any need to change lanes. Of course, this can be modified with multi lane exits to cater for different traffic volumes on the different exits with appropriate signage to get you into the correct entering lane.

It sure as heck beats those stupid Canberra roundabouts that also have traffic lights. The whole point of a roundabout is you don't need lights. Whatamess!

Ken

User avatar
pj
Posts: 47
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:36 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby pj » Sat Jun 30, 2018 5:15 pm

Today's moron, tailgating then squeezing past at refuge island.


User avatar
biker jk
Posts: 6137
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby biker jk » Sat Jun 30, 2018 5:44 pm

pj wrote:Today's moron, tailgating then squeezing past at refuge island.



You should be taking the lane ahead of squeeze points. Riding to the left is an invitation to the moron motorists.

User avatar
pj
Posts: 47
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:36 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby pj » Sat Jun 30, 2018 5:51 pm

biker jk wrote:
pj wrote:Today's moron, tailgating then squeezing past at refuge island.



You should be taking the lane ahead of squeeze points. Riding to the left is an invitation to the moron motorists.


Thanks I am usually better at doing this but by the time I glanced over my shoulder when approaching the pinch point he was right on top of me. Wasn't confident to move out any further at that point in time.

User avatar
biker jk
Posts: 6137
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby biker jk » Sat Jun 30, 2018 6:06 pm

pj wrote:
biker jk wrote:
pj wrote:Today's moron, tailgating then squeezing past at refuge island.



You should be taking the lane ahead of squeeze points. Riding to the left is an invitation to the moron motorists.


Thanks I am usually better at doing this but by the time I glanced over my shoulder when approaching the pinch point he was right on top of me. Wasn't confident to move out any further at that point in time.


That's why I ride with a mirror.

User avatar
mikesbytes
Super Mod
Super Mod
Posts: 18981
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:42 pm
Location: Tempe, Sydney
Contact:

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby mikesbytes » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:08 pm

pj wrote:Today's moron, tailgating then squeezing past at refuge island.



That one is well worth reporting but I'd bet the copper would say "why weren't you using the shared path?" Which means instead of doing 40kph on the road your doing 10kph on the footpath with the dashed centre line
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

User avatar
mikesbytes
Super Mod
Super Mod
Posts: 18981
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:42 pm
Location: Tempe, Sydney
Contact:

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby mikesbytes » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:10 pm

kenwstr wrote:
trailgumby wrote:
Biffidus wrote:
I was going to post the same thing. It's really not difficult. This talk of changing lanes worries me... you shouldn't be changing lanes in a roundabout.

Not much choice if you want to get off a two-lane roundabout and you're in the right hand lane on entry.


While England has some horror roundabouts, they do have a system there that really impressed me as the easiest and safest I've seen. I think we should adopt it here too. The roundabout lanes all spiral out from the centre and the left most lane is the off ramp to the 1st exit road so the 2nd left lane is now the most left most lane and is the off ramp to the next exit road and so on.
This means that on entering, the left lane will take you to the 1st exit, 2nd from left will take you to the 2nd exit, 3rd from left will take you to the 3rd exit and so on. If there are 3 lanes entering and you want the 4th exit, you simply enter the 3rd lane and when the 4th opens from the centre, you simply drive into this new empty 4th lane to the 4th exit from where you entered, too easy. Each lane simply all takes you where you want to go and never any need to change lanes. Of course, this can be modified with multi lane exits to cater for different traffic volumes on the different exits with appropriate signage to get you into the correct entering lane.

It sure as heck beats those stupid Canberra roundabouts that also have traffic lights. The whole point of a roundabout is you don't need lights. Whatamess!

Ken

That's really interesting Ken, is there a diagram you can post?
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

User avatar
mikesbytes
Super Mod
Super Mod
Posts: 18981
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:42 pm
Location: Tempe, Sydney
Contact:

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby mikesbytes » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:09 pm

"Strike Force Puma officers"

Haven't come upon this before, read the following article, it sounds like who to submit videos to

https://www.northerndailyleader.com.au/story/5498682/sydney-woman-charged-after-princes-highway-dash-cam-goes-viral/?cs=7
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

User avatar
pj
Posts: 47
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:36 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Moron Motorists #3

Postby pj » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:39 pm

mikesbytes wrote:
pj wrote:Today's moron, tailgating then squeezing past at refuge island.



That one is well worth reporting but I'd bet the copper would say "why weren't you using the shared path?" Which means instead of doing 40kph on the road your doing 10kph on the footpath with the dashed centre line


Yes I'm thinking about it, close passes like this happen all the time but in this case it was quite intimidating. The driver was so close behind me I couldn't slow down or remove myself from the situation once I hit that rough section of road at the pinch point.

I should be able to go back an measure the distance between the kerb and the refuge. I don't believe there is physically enough space there for the car, my bike and 1m buffer.

Didn't even notice the shared path until after I downloaded the video!

Image

Return to “General Cycling Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users