Australian Cycling Forums - Bicycles Network Australia

Cyclist admits causing 71-year-old's death.

This could so easily have been a car driver, a bus driver or a truck driver. I'm sure we've all be on the receiving end of road-rage in one form or another.

The law will hopefully deal with this guy in the appropriate manner. We need to set a good example to others - that is not a good example. Sadly, this will probably give other people the opinion that we are all like him.

Have to hand it to the police for finding that guy.

Why are they calling him a cyclist, when he is clearly an a-hole.

g-boaf wrote:This could so easily have been a car driver, a bus driver or a truck driver. I'm sure we've all be on the receiving end of road-rage in one form or another.

The law will hopefully deal with this guy in the appropriate manner. We need to set a good example to others - that is not a good example. Sadly, this will probably give other people the opinion that we are all like him.

Well said. Time for every one to "slow down and enjoy the ride."

Andrew

rkelsen wrote:Why are they calling him a cyclist, when he is clearly an a-hole.

+1

rkelsen wrote:Why are they calling him a cyclist, when he is clearly an a-hole.

from the linked article.

Wood was riding along Gardeners Road at Eastlakes when he became involved in a heated argument with Ms Touma.
He got off his bike and pushed her.

No argument on the a-hole but he is also clearly a cyclist.

rkelsen wrote:Why are they calling him a cyclist, when he is clearly an a-hole.

Ahh because he was riding a bicycle.

Andrew

This is just awful - its makes my 'smack' pale into insignificance but road rage is so prevalent - we all need to be calm and try to be thoughtful about our actions - talking to myself......

Yes let's let the state set an example like they have nearly every other time. After all it works so well.
Lock him up and no one will dare do something like this again.

Let's not look at the underlying cause of violence in society.
Let's give the police more power and money and impose harsher sentences.
Then they can protect us all from the bad people.
I'm sure if they let this guy go he will be running down old ladies before the end of the week.
Damn' let's bring back crucifixion.

flow.rider wrote: Let's not look at the underlying cause of violence in society.

What do you understand this to be and how do we fix it?

Mike

flow.rider wrote:Yes let's let the state set an example like they have nearly every other time. After all it works so well.
Lock him up and no one will dare do something like this again.

Let's not look at the underlying cause of violence in society.
Let's give the police more power and money and impose harsher sentences.
Then they can protect us all from the bad people.
I'm sure if they let this guy go he will be running down old ladies before the end of the week.
Damn' let's bring back crucifixion.

The guy shoved an elderly lady out of HIS way..........yeah lets give him a group hug..........tell him we love him.........and give him a bunch of flowers.

flow.rider wrote:Yes let's let the state set an example like they have nearly every other time. After all it works so well.
Lock him up and no one will dare do something like this again.

Let's not look at the underlying cause of violence in society.
Let's give the police more power and money and impose harsher sentences.
Then they can protect us all from the bad people.
I'm sure if they let this guy go he will be running down old ladies before the end of the week.
Damn' let's bring back crucifixion.

I think this violence was caused by free public housing, given the location of the incident (yes, I know the area well). Clearly, when the taxpayer provides you with free housing, this must lead to a build up of resentment, which is understandably expressed in violence. How can we blame the poor, down-trodden man? See, I can be sarcastic as well!

A creep is a creep is a creep. The fact that he was a cyclist is incidental, he pushed an old lady and she died. Lets hope he gets a very long jail term.

there is no excuse for pushing anyone in this circumstance. He needs anger management counselling IMO. How hard would it be to ignore the old biddy and ride on? Anyone can push an old lady down, he is no hero for doing that. Do the crime, do the time.

I personally think it is a great tragedy, for all concerned. One stupid moment of conflict, a rush of blood to the head, a rash action, and someone's granny is dead Really pathetic, a great loss, and all for what? Yet I could well imagine that, in my younger less mature days, I myself could have given someone a shove in a moment of impatience and provocation. But for the grace of god....




Much like a lot of stupid actions by many, many drivers on a regular basis. But somehow the drivers seem to get to walk free from the court, or with a token punishment. What's the bet this guy does not?

il padrone wrote:I personally think it is a great tragedy, for all concerned. One stupid moment of conflict, a rush of blood to the head, a rash action, and someone's granny is dead Really pathetic, a great loss, and all for what? Yet I could well imagine that, in my younger less mature days, I myself could have given someone a shove in a moment of impatience and provocation. But for the grace of god....

My thoughts exactly. If has any sort of compassion, he will be much harder on himself than anyone else could be

il padrone wrote:Much like a lot of stupid actions by many, many drivers on a regular basis. But somehow the drivers seem to get to walk free from the court, or with a token punishment. What's the bet this guy does not?

Your comment above about empathy - there but for the grace of god etc probably comes into play here. Most magistrates etc know what it is like to be a driver. Probably not that many would be able to empathise with a cyclist.

I do not think that "there but for the grace of dog" does apply here.

The cyclist dismounted and then pushed the woman. And then told a witness "The bitch got in my way."

"There but for the grace..." would apply if he had caused her death by riding close to her, intending to give her a scare, but causing her to fall etc.

The numb nuts dismounted his bike, and still didn't calm down enough to not manhandle her. And having pushed her over was still fired up enough to complain that "the bitch got in my way".

We don't need to draw parallels with what motorists do - it's irrelevant and just promotes "us and them" thinking. A foul deed should receive an appropriate punishment.

JustJames wrote:We don't need to draw parallels with what motorists do - it's irrelevant and just promotes "us and them" thinking.

I don't agree here.

JustJames wrote:A foul deed should receive an appropriate punishment.

Yes.


http://www.smh.com.au/national/reflecti ... 1nzd7.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The driver who opened her door onto James Cross' bike was neither prosecuted nor fined, a decision that sparked outrage from cycling groups, particularly Bicycle Network Victoria's Garry Brennan.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/reflecti ... z2DPAIYpDB" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The question that's never been answered - why not??

How does a temporary loss of attention that costs someone their life become equal to a deliberate violent act that costs someone their life?

greyhoundtom wrote:How does a temporary loss of attention that costs someone their life become equal to a deliberate violent act that costs someone their life?

Opening a car door into the path of a cyclist is pretty damn violent too. In neither case was the offenders intent one of deliberate harm. One was committed in a frame of anger towards somebody and one was committed in reckless negligence. In both cases the foreseeability of death of the action (pushing somebody vs opening a door) was very small. Such actions occur everyday, in both cases somebody's luck ran out.

For preventative and punitive reasons both perpetrators should be firmly but not excessively punished. (My opinion would be a short sentence ~6months possibly suspended depending on the remorse and past history of the offender.)

If the guy didn't have a bike, we wouldn't even be talking about it. Seriously... it's messed up. The guy is going to jail for a long time. If he doesn't, it makes a mockery of our alleged justice system.

greyhoundtom wrote:How does a temporary loss of attention that costs someone their life become equal to a deliberate violent act that costs someone their life?

Two offenders were negligent. Two people were killed. In my opinion the consequences should be pretty similar - some dispensation for the lady who was just totally thoughtless, rather than aggressive - however one person has been let off with not even a fine, not even a case prosecuted.

human909 wrote:

greyhoundtom wrote:How does a temporary loss of attention that costs someone their life become equal to a deliberate violent act that costs someone their life?

Opening a car door into the path of a cyclist is pretty damn violent too. In neither case was the offenders intent one of deliberate harm. One was committed in a frame of anger towards somebody and one was committed in reckless negligence. In both cases the foreseeability of death of the action (pushing somebody vs opening a door) was very small. Such actions occur everyday, in both cases somebody's luck ran out.

For preventative and punitive reasons both perpetrators should be firmly but not excessively punished. (My opinion would be a short sentence ~6months possibly suspended depending on the remorse and past history of the offender.)

+1. Good heavens i agree with human on something .

il padrone wrote:

greyhoundtom wrote:How does a temporary loss of attention that costs someone their life become equal to a deliberate violent act that costs someone their life?

Two offenders were negligent. Two people were killed. In my opinion the consequences should be pretty similar - some dispensation for the lady who was just totally thoughtless, rather than aggressive - however one person has been let off with not even a fine, not even a case prosecuted.

This guy was not negligent.
He committed a deliberate act of violence against an old lady, he may not have intended to kill her or even to cause her serious harm but he did intend to push her.