How bright is to bright?

open topic, for anything cycling related.

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby foo on patrol » Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:02 am

Part of the problem on Bribie Island is, you get all the old farts walking on the bloody road and not just the side of the road but the middle also! :shock: This place has a very good system of paths for them too walk on but that's not good enough. :roll:

From my perspective I want a light that throws a good beam out for 30mtrs or more and just don't understand why, the sellers of bike lights can't have a beam photo so we can see if this or that light is appropriate for our needs. :?

The best way for all to see if their light is not aimed properly is, get off your bloody bike and walk up the road and have a look at the light beam, it's not rocket science is it. :idea: :roll:

Foo
User avatar
foo on patrol
 
Posts: 4320
Joined: Sat Dec 19, 2009 10:12 am
Location: Sanstone Point QLD

by BNA » Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:37 am

BNA
 

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby warthog1 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:37 am

Lukeyboy wrote:All I will say is that at 35-50kph in darkness (no street/ambient lighting) a 300lumen light simply does not cut it.

Philips safe ride 80 here. 270 measured lumen with a controlled beam pattern. Yes it does cut it. Better than the supposed 1000 lumen magic shine it replaced. Well apart from the apalling mount it comes with that is.
User avatar
warthog1
 
Posts: 2728
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:40 pm

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby Nobody » Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:57 am

warthog1 wrote:Philips safe ride 80 here. 270 measured lumen with a controlled beam pattern. Yes it does cut it. Better than the supposed 1000 lumen magic shine it replaced. Well apart from the apalling mount it comes with that is.
How's the mount going? Did you try the tube or did you end up having to go to adhesive grip tape? Is there any way to bolt it on with another clamp?
Nobody
 
Posts: 6626
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby il padrone » Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:17 am

Comedian wrote:
Lukeyboy wrote:All I will say is that at 35-50kph in darkness (no street/ambient lighting) a 300lumen light simply does not cut it.

A lady I know commutes and she just wanted to be lit up like a football stadium for personal safety. :shock:

Lots of little LED 'Christmas lights' will achieve that very well. You don't need a 2200 lumens searchlight. She has vision confused with conspiquity.


I have frequently ridden through pitch dark night (eg. Audax rides, Oppy 24 hr ride, ACE250, night riding on tour in various locations) using 350 lumens B&M iQ Cyo or Supernova E3 and been perfectly happy riding at speeds of 20-50kmh.
User avatar
il padrone
 
Posts: 18183
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:57 pm
Location: Heading for home.

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby MattyK » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:11 am

warthog1 wrote:
Lukeyboy wrote:All I will say is that at 35-50kph in darkness (no street/ambient lighting) a 300lumen light simply does not cut it.

Philips safe ride 80 here. 270 measured lumen with a controlled beam pattern. Yes it does cut it. Better than the supposed 1000 lumen magic shine it replaced.

This.
Well apart from the appalling mount it comes with that is.

After a season, mine started slipping.

Remember the accessory strip they give you for different bar sizes?

(My) 25.4mm bar seems to fall in a gap between being too small to clamp without the strip, and too big to clamp with it.
Image
:roll:
I solved this by cutting the strip in half and covering up one of the nubs only. Has worked fine since.
MattyK
 
Posts: 1323
Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:07 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby Pushy » Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:16 am

MattyK wrote:
warthog1 wrote:
Lukeyboy wrote:All I will say is that at 35-50kph in darkness (no street/ambient lighting) a 300lumen light simply does not cut it.

Philips safe ride 80 here. 270 measured lumen with a controlled beam pattern. Yes it does cut it. Better than the supposed 1000 lumen magic shine it replaced.

This.
Well apart from the appalling mount it comes with that is.

After a season, mine started slipping.

Remember the accessory strip they give you for different bar sizes?

(My) 25.4mm bar seems to fall in a gap between being too small to clamp without the strip, and too big to clamp with it.
Image
:roll:
I solved this by cutting the strip in half and covering up one of the nubs only. Has worked fine since.

Here's another use for that old inner tube.
Pushy
 
Posts: 994
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 1:02 am
Location: Freo WA

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby eeksll » Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:17 am

il padrone wrote:
eeksll wrote:But isn't this the cause of the misunderstanding? Your acceptance that a brick or rock will knock you off cause you didnt see it is someone elses (mine included) version of not bright enough.

And the lighting arms-race goes on....... :roll:


you can call it an arms-race ... but it simply isn't. Its about getting a light which I feel is bright enough to light my way.

I now commute 50-50 bike path/road with a dynamo headlight (Busch + Müller Lumotec IQ Cyo Senso Plus) which is good for the road but lacking on the bike path. The main problem with the light is when the bike path gets windy I can no longer see the path, this is where the ayup helmet mounted fills in the gap. AND I don't ride fast ...

Add in walkers/dogs who dont carry lights, I really want something with a bit of throw and helmet mounted. I do turn the ayups off when I get back on to the road ... but roads don't get that windy so the low mounted dynamo works really well there.

I have a suggestion for people who have really bright lights and dont want to dazzle drivers, avoid helmet mount and mount them low as you can, ie just above the wheel or even lower and add a blinky up higher. Not without other issues though...
eeksll
 
Posts: 1276
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:36 pm

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby warthog1 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:42 pm

Nobody wrote:
warthog1 wrote:Philips safe ride 80 here. 270 measured lumen with a controlled beam pattern. Yes it does cut it. Better than the supposed 1000 lumen magic shine it replaced. Well apart from the apalling mount it comes with that is.
How's the mount going? Did you try the tube or did you end up having to go to adhesive grip tape? Is there any way to bolt it on with another clamp?


I've been using this mount as it has a better clamp than the one MattyK has;

Image

however the light is quite heavy and the ridiculous little swivel ball and socket keeps moving down over the bumps. I have used two hands to wrench the collar as tight as I can on the ball and no dice, the light is simply too heavy over the bumps.

I'm going back to the one MattyK has and trying a tube on the oversize 32mm carbon bar I have on the Cervelo.

Image

The 2013 light is supplied with the ball and socket mount which has the stronger clamp but is let down by the ball and socket. I ordered an older mount that doesn't have the ball and socket so I had a spare and could quickly swap betwwen two bikes. This mount is superior because it doesnt have the undersized ball and socket, but the plastic is fairly flexible and bends where it clamps when you apply a bit of torque to it :roll:
Last edited by warthog1 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
warthog1
 
Posts: 2728
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:40 pm

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby warthog1 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:47 pm

MattyK wrote:
warthog1 wrote:
Lukeyboy wrote:All I will say is that at 35-50kph in darkness (no street/ambient lighting) a 300lumen light simply does not cut it.

Philips safe ride 80 here. 270 measured lumen with a controlled beam pattern. Yes it does cut it. Better than the supposed 1000 lumen magic shine it replaced.

This.
Well apart from the appalling mount it comes with that is.

After a season, mine started slipping.

Remember the accessory strip they give you for different bar sizes?

(My) 25.4mm bar seems to fall in a gap between being too small to clamp without the strip, and too big to clamp with it.
Image
:roll:
I solved this by cutting the strip in half and covering up one of the nubs only. Has worked fine since.


Thanks, I've only used it on the 25.4 mm bar on the now broken Azzurri, have not yet tried it on the 31.8 mm bar on the Cervelo. I'll try that when I get a new commuter frame for the running gear off the Azzurri :)
In case you were contemplating it, don't bother with the later mount :x
Last edited by warthog1 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 2:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
warthog1
 
Posts: 2728
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:40 pm

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby rjk » Thu Apr 04, 2013 1:41 pm

just a quickie, the new Ayups are rated at 700 lumens, you can do an upgrade of your existing ones to the higher rated ones.

And yes i used to commute on a path that had no lighting, in the wet it was impossible to see the path.

So for me the only problem with to bright lights are the ones aimed at me, i will keep my ayups on my bike.

I just look low and left when i see a bright light coming at me, so i dont run off the side of the path
rjk
 
Posts: 391
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:11 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby eeksll » Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:06 pm

rjk wrote:... the new Ayups are rated at 700 lumens ...


does anyone know if this is an even newer spec? or where the 40% brighter versions always 700 lumens? I got the 40% brighter version when they first came out with that option and I always thought they where around the 400 lumen mark.

Also it is my experience that my ayups are not bright enough in all conditions (especially wet). And I don't ride faster than 35km/h.
eeksll
 
Posts: 1276
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:36 pm

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby MattyK » Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:19 pm

Nothing is bright enough in wet conditions.
MattyK
 
Posts: 1323
Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:07 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby NhiTrac » Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:10 pm

eeksll wrote:
rjk wrote:... the new Ayups are rated at 700 lumens ...


does anyone know if this is an even newer spec? or where the 40% brighter versions always 700 lumens? I got the 40% brighter version when they first came out with that option and I always thought they where around the 400 lumen mark.

Also it is my experience that my ayups are not bright enough in all conditions (especially wet). And I don't ride faster than 35km/h.


I only just bought another set and didn't notice any different numbers. Trawling through their specs page, it reads as if the 40% have always been at 700 lumens...

I'm not sure anymore. All I know is two sets of Ayups on the front works for me :mrgreen:
NhiTrac
 
Posts: 492
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:58 pm

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby VRE » Fri Apr 05, 2013 6:15 am

I'm wary of manufacturer claims of light output, since they're prone to quoting the maximum light output, instead of the average (except of course they don't mention that it's the maximum) :roll: .
User avatar
VRE
 
Posts: 582
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2012 9:14 am
Location: Ringwood North, VIC, Australia

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby foo on patrol » Fri Apr 05, 2013 6:38 am

Why doesn't everyone here take a shot of their lights at night and post it up along with some marker indicators of distance with the brand of light and then everyone will know if that light is for them. This intern will cut all of the BS from mines bigger than yours crap. :roll:

Then if there are enough of the brands there could be and I'm only suggesting this, it maybe put up as a sticky for those that are looking for lighting. :idea:

Foo
User avatar
foo on patrol
 
Posts: 4320
Joined: Sat Dec 19, 2009 10:12 am
Location: Sanstone Point QLD

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby il padrone » Fri Apr 05, 2013 6:54 am

Different cameras, different exposure settings, different locations all make for unequal photo results that are very poor comparisons. A poor light can be made to look really bright with the right camera exposure.

That's why I have only been posting the very good photos from Peter White Cycles, as he has been very diligent in taking all his photos at the same location with a rigorously identical camera exposure setting. This makes his comparison photos very valuable. Mostly he has concentrated solely on the high quality road lights from German manufacturers and he does not have photos of the ultra high lumens "possum-fryers". Beam shots barely matter for these anyway - just get the highest lumens you can and they're all road-user blinders :|
User avatar
il padrone
 
Posts: 18183
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:57 pm
Location: Heading for home.

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby Comedian » Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:09 am

il padrone wrote:Different cameras, different exposure settings, different locations all make for unequal photo results that are very poor comparisons. A poor light can be made to look really bright with the right camera exposure.

That's why I have only been posting the very good photos from Peter White Cycles, as he has been very diligent in taking all his photos at the same location with a rigorously identical camera exposure setting. This makes his comparison photos very valuable. Mostly he has concentrated solely on the high quality road lights from German manufacturers and he does not have photos of the ultra high lumens "possum-fryers". Beam shots barely matter for these anyway - just get the highest lumens you can and they're all road-user blinders :|


I wonder at what point the government will have to step in to control these lights?

I really do agree with you. Lights need a defined cutoff and solid mounting so they can be properly aimed.

Interestingly, I've got both a magicshine and ayups... The ayups are much more focused than the magicshine. The ms really just sprays light everywhere. Excellent for mtb but I don't think it's possible to use them and not blind oncoming traffic
User avatar
Comedian
 
Posts: 4401
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:35 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby VRE » Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:15 am

If they do step in to regulate vehicle lighting, let's hope it's done for all vehicles, including motor vehicles. I've seen car and truck headlights that could definitely do with some regulation, on both their intensity and their beam angles.
User avatar
VRE
 
Posts: 582
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2012 9:14 am
Location: Ringwood North, VIC, Australia

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby Comedian » Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:56 am

VRE wrote:If they do step in to regulate vehicle lighting, let's hope it's done for all vehicles, including motor vehicles. I've seen car and truck headlights that could definitely do with some regulation, on both their intensity and their beam angles.

Car headlights are regulated now... in some cases such as xenon lights quite heavily (must have washers and self levelling). However I've never seen police ever pull someone for a poorly aligned headlight.

I guess there is my answer.. even if it were regulated it wouldn't be enforced anyway, so why bother?
User avatar
Comedian
 
Posts: 4401
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:35 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:26 am

VRE wrote:If they do step in to regulate vehicle lighting, let's hope it's done for all vehicles, including motor vehicles. I've seen car and truck headlights that could definitely do with some regulation, on both their intensity and their beam angles.

Regardless, I seldom experience people using any wildly excessive lights in motor vheicles. On the other hand I experience it every day that I ride in the dark.

Which leads me to conclude that cyclists, in this regard, can be less considerate than motorists.
User avatar
ColinOldnCranky
 
Posts: 4637
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 3:58 pm

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby MattyK » Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:32 am

The difference is: cars are sold with lights. These lights are compliant. Only a small minority add/modify their lights, and most are competent at using them correctly (eg not running high beams in people's faces nor aiming them too high). Bikes are not sold with lights, they must be fitted by the user who has little or no idea about what they are doing.
MattyK
 
Posts: 1323
Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:07 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby rangersac » Fri Apr 05, 2013 9:03 am

VRE wrote:I've seen car and truck headlights that could definitely do with some regulation, on both their intensity and their beam angles.


I agree with this wholeheartedly. When driving, the newer range of xenon headlights I often find horribly dazzling when coming around a corner, or having one behind me shining in the rear vision mirror. I find the worst culprits the new breed of tank like SUVs that are driven by an increasing number of environmentally inconsiderate morons who clearly have an inferiority complex and degenerative driving skills (in case you haven't guessed they are my pet road hate). Given the height that these lights are mounted at, one of these at low beam I find the equivalent of looking at a high beam halogen
User avatar
rangersac
 
Posts: 808
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 11:01 am
Location: Snug, Tasmania

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby Red Rider » Wed Apr 17, 2013 10:52 pm

Does anyone have a Supernova Airstream or found a quality review? It looks like the best all-in-one unit I can find (put off the Philips by the mount).
Image
User avatar
Red Rider
 
Posts: 640
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:44 pm
Location: Dianella, WA

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby Lukeyboy » Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:20 am

rangersac wrote:
VRE wrote:I've seen car and truck headlights that could definitely do with some regulation, on both their intensity and their beam angles.


I agree with this wholeheartedly. When driving, the newer range of xenon headlights I often find horribly dazzling when coming around a corner, or having one behind me shining in the rear vision mirror. I find the worst culprits the new breed of tank like SUVs that are driven by an increasing number of environmentally inconsiderate morons who clearly have an inferiority complex and degenerative driving skills (in case you haven't guessed they are my pet road hate). Given the height that these lights are mounted at, one of these at low beam I find the equivalent of looking at a high beam halogen


The people that annoy me more are those idiots that modify normal headlights with the DIY halogen kits. So instead of having the light focused etc the headlights just throw the light everywhere. I've been known on a few ocassions to flip off oncoming cars that have done it :P
Image
User avatar
Lukeyboy
 
Posts: 2124
Joined: Tue May 29, 2012 2:38 am
Location: Brisbane

Re: How bright is to bright?

Postby eightsixboy » Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:08 am

Has anyone else had problems with other cyclists having there lights way to bright?

I went for a ride last night and the amount of guys that have insanely powerfull lights is rediculous, dont they realise there blinding other riders?
eightsixboy
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Sun Mar 17, 2013 3:10 pm

PreviousNext

Return to General discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: andylo, Aushiker, Bing [Bot], jc2153, kyap



Popular Bike Shops
Torpedo 7 Torpedo7 AU
Ground Effect Ground Effect NZ
Chain Reaction Cycles CRC UK
Wiggle Wiggle UK
Ebay Ebay AU



InTouch with BNA
“Bicycles BNA Twitter
“Bicycles BNA Facebook
“Google+ BNA Google+
“Bicycles BNA Newsletter