Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

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Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dominicj » Fri Aug 30, 2013 6:46 pm

Apologies if this has been asked before but my searches of the forum didn't turn anything up.

I've seen a fair bit to suggest that it is possible to convert an Ultegra Di2 setup to 11 speed simply by swapping out the RD to the 9070 version (and obviously cassette). The 9070 RD is still $650 but it's a hell of a lot cheaper than buying a full 9070 groupset.

Does anyone have any experience with actually doing this? Are there any issues and is it easy to set up? There is some talk of the front shift not being as nice given that it has a wider cage set up for a 10 speed chain.

Very interested to hear any thoughts.
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by BNA » Fri Aug 30, 2013 8:44 pm

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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Carrots » Fri Aug 30, 2013 8:44 pm

From what I was told in a LBS the other day it'll be a matter of having the Shimano tech computer plugged in and a few buttons pressed, add a 11spd cassette and chain and away you go essentially. No need for a new RD at all.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dale79 » Fri Aug 30, 2013 8:49 pm

Carrots wrote:From what I was told in a LBS the other day it'll be a matter of having the Shimano tech computer plugged in and a few buttons pressed, add a 11spd cassette and chain and away you go essentially. No need for a new RD at all.


incorrect,,

you need to add the 11 speed rear mech, 11 speed cassette and 11 speed chain..
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby warthog1 » Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:12 pm

Not that I have either but how does the 10 s chainset go with the narrower 11 s chain?
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Carrots » Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:15 pm

dale79 wrote:
Carrots wrote:From what I was told in a LBS the other day it'll be a matter of having the Shimano tech computer plugged in and a few buttons pressed, add a 11spd cassette and chain and away you go essentially. No need for a new RD at all.


incorrect,,

you need to add the 11 speed rear mech, 11 speed cassette and 11 speed chain..


Sorry yep - brain fade - the shifters are programmable. My bad!
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Duck! » Sat Aug 31, 2013 12:46 am

warthog1 wrote:Not that I have either but how does the 10 s chainset go with the narrower 11 s chain?

No problems at all.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Duck! » Sat Aug 31, 2013 12:47 am

dale79 wrote:
Carrots wrote:From what I was told in a LBS the other day it'll be a matter of having the Shimano tech computer plugged in and a few buttons pressed, add a 11spd cassette and chain and away you go essentially. No need for a new RD at all.


incorrect,,

you need to add the 11 speed rear mech, 11 speed cassette and 11 speed chain..

Front derailleur as well, due to the auto-trimming calibration.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dale79 » Sat Aug 31, 2013 6:27 am

Front will be fine and dosent need to be changed
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dominicj » Sat Aug 31, 2013 6:42 am

So has anyone actually done this? Seems like a no brainer upgrade for anyone running UDi2...
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby kx315 » Sat Aug 31, 2013 7:25 am

Carrots wrote:From what I was told in a LBS the other day it'll be a matter of having the Shimano tech computer plugged in and a few buttons pressed, add a 11spd cassette and chain and away you go essentially. No need for a new RD at all.


I was told the same by my LBS also........however I was told they where waiting on a software upgrade to be released from Shimano.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Duck! » Sat Aug 31, 2013 10:22 am

dale79 wrote:Front will be fine and dosent need to be changed

That's not what I've been told by Shimano techs. The front auto-trim is controlled by the rear derailleur position, and the shift increments in both are hard-programmed and not tuneable. The 11-sp. front derailleur has different trim points than 10-sp. to allow for the wider cassette. A 10-sp. FD won't talk to an 11-sp. RD.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dale79 » Sat Aug 31, 2013 10:42 am

Will find out.. The rear is 1.3mm different a simple adjust of the limit screw will take care of it
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Duck! » Sat Aug 31, 2013 10:51 am

The limit screw has nothing to do with it.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby warthog1 » Sat Aug 31, 2013 11:09 am

Duck! wrote:
warthog1 wrote:Not that I have either but how does the 10 s chainset go with the narrower 11 s chain?

No problems at all.

Good to know, thanks.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Duck! » Sat Aug 31, 2013 11:16 am

warthog1 wrote:
Duck! wrote:
warthog1 wrote:Not that I have either but how does the 10 s chainset go with the narrower 11 s chain?

No problems at all.

Good to know, thanks.

To further elaborate: I recently fitted a 6650 Ultegra compact crank to a customer's 9000 D-A spec bike for a trip to France, due to unavailable small rings for the 9000 crank. After she returned & swapped the cranks back, I asked her if she noticed any effect of the supposedly incompatible crank. She said it worked perfectly every time, not even the slightest hint that the narrower chain was complaining. :)
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dale79 » Sat Aug 31, 2013 12:57 pm

Duck! wrote:The limit screw has nothing to do with it.


Front limit screw not rear... The rear is 1.8mm wider..meaning the front limit screw will need off the top of my head about 1/4 turn to eliminate the chain rub.the auto tracking will work perfectly fine..
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Cossie Phil » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:11 pm

Im using DA9000 52-36 crankset with a complete Ultegra Di2 10sp setup including CN7901 chain. All works perfectly.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Duck! » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:54 pm

dale79 wrote:
Duck! wrote:The limit screw has nothing to do with it.


Front limit screw not rear... The rear is 1.8mm wider..meaning the front limit screw will need off the top of my head about 1/4 turn to eliminate the chain rub.the auto tracking will work perfectly fine..

Limit screws still have nothing to do with it. The trim shift movement is entirely dictated by the electronics, because once the front derailleur begins to move off its low gear position, it's not on either limit screw. The upper limit only comes into play once you shift to the big ring position (from where exactly the same principle applies in reverse). The trim stroke is longer to allow for the wider cassette.

Which is all a moot point anyway, because the official word is that an 11-sp. RD will not recognise a 10-sp. FD (& vice-versa).
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dale79 » Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:15 pm

do your calculations of 1.8mm at 400mm away and work out how much extra trim is required.. IE sweet FA.. the front chain rings are the same spacing as well so I will put money on it working correctly.. even more so because I know how the shimano comms work.

I will plug a 9000 rear mech into my 6770 bike tomorrow to test it with the 6770 front mech, I bet the trim function works perfectly fine.

shimano will tell you none of it will work etc etc, but they also say that you cant get sprint shifters for 6770 either..
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby danny the boy » Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:52 pm

If I was a betting person I would say the issue of rub will be in the middle of the cassette rather than the limits. From my eyes on top of the bike the auto trim only moves about every 3-4 shift.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dale79 » Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:16 pm

Middle of the cassette is still the middle if the cassette.. Ie chain will be with in a few mm at every point. Ie if it dosent rub with a 10 speed it's not going to rub with 11 speed
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Duck! » Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:33 pm

dale79 wrote:I will plug a 9000 rear mech into my 6770 bike tomorrow to test it with the 6770 front mech, I bet the trim function works perfectly fine.

What do you expect to prove by plugging in a mechanical derailleur? :mrgreen:
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dominicj » Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:39 pm

Hey, RD-9070 = $650, RD-9070 = $250. I'm rooting for the 9000!! :-D
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby Ross » Sun Sep 01, 2013 5:58 pm

How did you go Dale? I have recently purchased some C24 DA 9000 series wheels and am curious if I can make my Ult Di2 into 11 speed with just some software updates.
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Re: Ultegra Di2 to 11 speed conversion

Postby dale79 » Sun Sep 01, 2013 6:20 pm

Ill get to it tomorrow, no software updates you WILL have to purchase a new rear mech and chain.
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