fly12 first impressions

def
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fly12 first impressions

Postby def » Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:19 pm

My fly12 arrived yesterday. Today was my first ride with it. I must confess to having jumped on board with this without thinking about it too much. I've been pretty impressed with the fly6 so it seemed a natural progression. Anyway, a few initial thoughts on fly12 after this mornings ride.

It's pretty bulky. I've got it mounted under the bars - I think it would be too bulky sitting on top.

Despite the apparent weight of it in my hand I didn't feel that it affected the handling of the bike at all.

I like the range of light options all though cycling through them all when you turn it on is a tiny bit of a pain.

Getting it on and off the bike is OK but not as easy as the fly6

Mounted under the bars as I have makes it tricky to get to the buttons as the gear and brake cables get in the way.

Mounted under bars also means the indicator leds cannot be seen while riding.

Video quality: not as good as I expected - it seems very grainy. Don't know if this is due to MP4 coding or what but even with good sunlight it strikes me as poor. Need to take gopro out at same time to compare.

Light beam is much narrower than video so in the dark there is a bright spot in the middle of frame and darkness around it.

The unit turned itself off without me realising after about 20 minutes. I didn't notice for about 40 minutes. It was fine once I turned in back on. No idea why that happened - perhaps cables pushed against on/off button?

Have had a bit of a play with the iPhone app and that seems pretty good - easier than the gopro app I think (at least so far).

That'll do for now.

Anyone else got one?

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Comedian
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Comedian » Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:30 pm

I found the unit pretty easy to install. I too found getting it to work with the cables was fiddly. First try it substantially blocked movement one way. I did find somewhere that doesn't impede movement. I also put a little clear film on the unit so it doesn't get marked by the cables.

I was a little disappointed that the doco is very sparse at the moment. It doesn't go into any great detail about turning it on and operating. I think the people involved probably didn't even think about that - but if you've never seen one before it took a little while.

The app seems to be ok. I'd like a way to see the stills on the app.

While at coffee the alarm went off saying "your fly12 is moving!". But it was stationary. Then we couldn't work out how to turn it off - I think the way is on the phone with the alarm off. Another example of some basic operating instructions would be handy.

I do appreciate that it's early days and hope that all these issues will be sorted in time.

I haven't had a chance to look at the video quality yet. The 16gb card they ship is appreciated but it's a tease as it's just too small.

stretts
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby stretts » Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:49 pm

Anyone have suggestions for odd shaped handlebar mounting? I have very little space that is 31.8 on my bullhorns to mount using the supplied piece, as the space is taken up by the brake calipers. I probably could but need longer fixing screws.

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Bunged Knee
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Bunged Knee » Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:41 pm

stretts wrote:Anyone have suggestions for odd shaped handlebar mounting? I have very little space that is 31.8 on my bullhorns to mount using the supplied piece, as the space is taken up by the brake calipers. I probably could but need longer fixing screws.


To fit 31.8 bars, use the Go BigGoPro mount. http://www.pushys.com.au/k-edge-go-biggopro-handlebar-mount-pro.html

Or get the Aero Combo mount if you want the GPS and camera. http://www.pushys.com.au/k-edge-garmin-camera-aero-combo-mount-black.html for up to 510 or get the XL Aero Combo mount.
ID please? What ID? My seat tube ID is 27.2mm or 31.6mm depending on what bikes I ride today.thanks...

Cyclorider
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Cyclorider » Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:27 pm

Anyone in Canberra received theirs yet? From another thread on this board, it seems Brisbanites are the lucky ones (and a smattering of Perth people)?

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Rockford
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Rockford » Fri Apr 22, 2016 11:10 pm

def wrote:Video quality: not as good as I expected - it seems very grainy. Don't know if this is due to MP4 coding or what but even with good sunlight it strikes me as poor. Need to take gopro out at same time to compare.


I had that issue on my dashcam, couldn't understand why the picture quality was a bit ordinary and realised the protective film was still on the lens :oops:

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Drizt
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Drizt » Sun Apr 24, 2016 8:34 pm

Disappointed about the video quality comments. I have 2x units on route... sigh.

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AUbicycles
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby AUbicycles » Mon Apr 25, 2016 12:44 am

On the video quality - my views is that the Fly12 isn't positioned to compete against the top end GoPro action cam. if the goal is to capture brilliant riding footage, mounting on the bike is usually not the best option - so even top end camera will be challenged by road vibration, mount vibration and rapidly changing light conditions.

The better the conditions, the better the footage. I did some filming with the prototype in conditions that you could describe as excellent and the quality was also really good - some examples are below - click through to Youtube and make sure HD is selected (the gear cog in the bottom right).

Fly12 - Coober Pedy


Fly 12 - To Ayres Rock



The GoBig mount is, for me a necessity, not the least because it gives the Fly12 clearance when mounted under the bars. Combination mounts give you clearance, but I don't recommend plastic ones as the movement will give you vibration.

I have a review from using the prototype and from 1:18 include mixed footage (Sydney Habour Bridge, Sydney Urban, Mixed Light, Rain)

Fly12 Review


Get yourself a fast 64 GB card - it is worth the money (watch out for cheap slow micro SD cards which can't handle the video speed).
Remember to read up on the accident protection (where it turns off) and the functionality that turns it off if the bike is stationary.

Kliac
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Kliac » Tue Apr 26, 2016 12:50 pm

First of all hi everyone! Yeah, my first post.

def wrote:
Light beam is much narrower than video so in the dark there is a bright spot in the middle of frame and darkness around it.



I think it is quite necessary, you can't just ride with 400lumens wide torch and blind other people.. I saw few samples in the dark and I think angle of the light is reasonable.

def
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby def » Wed Apr 27, 2016 10:30 pm

@AUbicycles.

I had a look at those videos at HD on youtube and even though they are at a lower resolution than the videos directly from the fly12 I can see some of the same effects. The first thing I noticed is that the road surface is very "sparkly". I'm not a video compression expert but it looks like there is some weird oscillations going on in certain regions of the image. Two other effects I've seen in my videos (and I can't really see them in yours) is that nearly monochromatic regions have a visible tiling - again something to do with the compression? The other thing I see on my videos is that sharp edges seem a bit hairy - they're not as sharp as they could be.

I did run a test today with both my GoPro Hero3+ and Fly12 mounted together. I recorded just over an hour of video from pre-dawn to full sun. Comparing the results has made me a bit less disappointed than I was - the GoPro wasn't as much better than I expected. Although when I got home I discovered that the GoPro wasn't at full resolution (doh!) - so some more testing to do!

And I have upgraded to a 64GB card so I can store about 4 hours worth.

def

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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby AUbicycles » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:06 pm

def wrote: had a look at those videos at HD on youtube


I use pretty good settings to export the video however youtube compress substantially which affects the quality in HD as well.


def wrote:but it looks like there is some weird oscillations going on in certain regions of the image


The wavy effect is called shutter roll (aka jello) and is the effect of the vibration going to the camera. The camera creates a frame but scanning it line by line. If the camera is moving while the frame is being scanned, then it creates this distortion.

Some cameras have inbuilt or optional functionality to reduce vibration (shake) and the result is that you can lose some of the crisp detail.

The best solution is to get the camera off the bike and onto your body (helmet or chest) however this is not practical or convenient in many instances. A plastic camera mount will reducing jittery footage (as the mount flexes) but introduced more movement and shutter roll. On smoother road surfaces, the footage will be better.


def wrote:nearly monochromatic regions have a visible tiling - again something to do with the compression?


Yes - these are compression artifacts, the same you will spot in still images. It is balance between file size and image quality. The input video quality and processor also affect the speed and quality.

The video camera also knows that it has to trick the human eye that wants to see moving footage and takes into account the sequential frames and actual change from frame to frame. On a still frame you can usually easily spot the

The following still image is a simple demonstration of the effect of different compression and you can see what happens with sharpness and the artifacts.

Image

def wrote:sharp edges seem a bit hairy - they're not as sharp as they could be


Curved lenses.

def wrote:And I have upgraded to a 64GB card so I can store about 4 hours worth


On the Fly12, you should get far more that 4 hours. Make sure you use the SDformatter software (free) to format it (do the full format).


Cheers
Christopher

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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby PiratePete » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:29 pm

If you haven't already spied it, a full owners manual, plus other instructional videos can be found at:
https://cycliq.freshdesk.com/support/so ... 5000162468

There is a firmware update on this support page which will resolve a few issues too.

def wrote:The unit turned itself off without me realising after about 20 minutes. I didn't notice for about 40 minutes. It was fine once I turned in back on. No idea why that happened - perhaps cables pushed against on/off button?


If you were riding at the time (i.e. the unit was moving), then this could well be an issue that we've been investigating. A resolution is in the pipeline. In the interim, I would suggest enabling the "Recording Alert" tone to remind you that the camera is in operation. Handy too if your camera is inverted (as I have mine mounted), given the activity LED is not visible being on the top, err bottom... Also as a suggestion set the audio level up a bit so that you can hear it over other ambient noises. When the camera shutdown it would have emitted it's shutdown tones, and the battery level tones. Keep an ear on the camera and you will at least be alerted should it occur again.

Cheers, Pete
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21moby21
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby 21moby21 » Thu May 05, 2016 8:25 am

Hi all

Can anyone suggest a handlebar mount that holds a garmin 500 then underneath the fly12? Something like the barfly but then the fly12 mounted under it.

Thanks

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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Comedian » Thu May 05, 2016 1:20 pm

Mine played up on the weekend. Riding along it was beeping etc.. but as the camera is upside down it's difficult to see what the lights are telling. Last night I found I could hold my hand under the camera to see the colours.. breakthrough. I found out it was complaining of an "SD card failure". I think enough people will use the camera upside down that the light should be on both sides, or on the back..

I formatted the card (SD formatter) and it was fine this morning.

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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Bunged Knee » Thu May 05, 2016 1:35 pm

21moby21 wrote:Hi all

Can anyone suggest a handlebar mount that holds a garmin 500 then underneath the fly12? Something like the barfly but then the fly12 mounted under it.

Thanks


You`d need the Garmin Aero combo mount like this from Pushys. But it`s out of stock so find it in google.

http://www.pushys.com.au/k-edge-garmin-camera-aero-combo-mount-black.html
ID please? What ID? My seat tube ID is 27.2mm or 31.6mm depending on what bikes I ride today.thanks...

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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Bunged Knee » Thu May 05, 2016 1:38 pm

Comedian wrote: I think enough people will use the camera upside down that the light should be on both sides, or on the back..


I`d agree of that.
ID please? What ID? My seat tube ID is 27.2mm or 31.6mm depending on what bikes I ride today.thanks...

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21moby21
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby 21moby21 » Thu May 05, 2016 3:18 pm

Bunged Knee wrote:
21moby21 wrote:Hi all

Can anyone suggest a handlebar mount that holds a garmin 500 then underneath the fly12? Something like the barfly but then the fly12 mounted under it.

Thanks


You`d need the Garmin Aero combo mount like this from Pushys. But it`s out of stock so find it in google.

http://www.pushys.com.au/k-edge-garmin-camera-aero-combo-mount-black.html



Many thanks

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Drizt
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Drizt » Thu May 05, 2016 7:54 pm

I have this on 4 of (link below) our bikes and they are pretty nice. I also have the K-Edge dual mounts on two other bikes are they are also fantastic.

http://indigo.lighting/shop/mounts/dual-mount

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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby cp123 » Fri May 06, 2016 1:26 pm

Cyclorider - i'm in canberra and haven't received mine yet. However, i got a card in the door the other day from Toll saying missed delivery so i'm assuming it could by the fly12 as i haven't ordered or bought anything else in yonks. Unfortunately its either get out to qbn between 8.30 and 5 pm on a Monday to Friday (no chance for me in working hours as i'm out 7.30 to 6.30) or relocate distribution to a newsagency. i nominated the canberra house one in the city as they dont delivery to tuggeranong, erindale, woden or the civic GPO alhtough i can't get there till next tuesday. handy..

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Drizt
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Drizt » Fri May 06, 2016 1:30 pm

Got mine today.... in the process of setting it up.

The not being able just to put a blank micro sd in is a pain. Had to use another device to copy the config files onto the sd card then plug it back into the fly12

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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Comedian » Fri May 06, 2016 2:19 pm

Drizt wrote:Got mine today.... in the process of setting it up.

The not being able just to put a blank micro sd in is a pain. Had to use another device to copy the config files onto the sd card then plug it back into the fly12

If you put in a blank formatted one it puts all the directories and files on there itself at first use.

I formatted mine blank as and they were all back on there.

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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby AUbicycles » Fri May 06, 2016 2:59 pm

I recommend for all owners to format the SD cards - do a full (overwrite) format using SD Formatter which is available at no cost to download for Mac and PC from the SD Association.

For larger cards, the Overwrite Format takes longer but properly zeros out any date whereas the quick format essentially adjusts the head / directory information meaning that that actual data is not erased as such.

In short, you want a blank slate. And furthermore - it is worthwhile doing a full format every few months. Sometimes over time, anomalies can creep in, so format is a good way of keeping it fresh.

The camera will automatically initiate a new card and get the right data - though do check any setting and confirm date/time and other preferences are as you would like them.

--

Regarding the recording light, I also had this criticism some time back and would prefer to have a visual confirmation that the camera is recording. A lot of action camera brands don't have a record light, and some only have a front flashing light so would see it with them either - but for cycling it is an advantage or the up-side-down mounting is nicer.

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Drizt
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Drizt » Fri May 06, 2016 4:34 pm

How long does it take to charge the Fly12 ?

Mine has been charging for about 4 hrs now and the light next to the usb port is still red

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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Mububban » Fri May 06, 2016 5:10 pm

Drizt wrote:How long does it take to charge the Fly12 ?

Mine has been charging for about 4 hrs now and the light next to the usb port is still red


My first charge took hours too. I plugged it in around 6pm, went to bed at 10pm and it was still red, so not sure what time it finally got to fully charged.

I think the battery is pretty high capacity for the trickle charge going into it, like charging an iPad from flat, takes ages but then it holds the charge very well
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Drizt
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Re: fly12 first impressions

Postby Drizt » Fri May 06, 2016 5:12 pm

Thank you

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