Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

human909
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Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby human909 » Sun Dec 10, 2017 12:14 pm

Is it really an accident when it was predicted outcome?

TODAY:
Cyclist fighting for life after crash at Macedon

An update:

Unfortunately the cyclist has died. :cry:
Cyclist dead after being hit by car in Macedon



Earlier this year:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/bike- ... wpuxa.html
Last edited by human909 on Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:06 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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redsonic
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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby redsonic » Sun Dec 10, 2017 12:48 pm

Fixed the link for you. The damage to that car is horrific. In both collisions you linked to, the cars are damaged centrally. Riders claiming the lane and being mown down with no evasive action from the drivers?

human909 wrote:Is it really an accident when it was predicted outcome?

TODAY:
Cyclist fighting for life after crash at Macedon


Earlier this year:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/bike- ... wpuxa.html

human909
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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby human909 » Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:06 pm

redsonic wrote:Fixed the link for you.

Whoops, Thanks!

redsonic wrote:In both collisions you linked to, the cars are damaged centrally. Riders claiming the lane and being mown down with no evasive action from the drivers?

Hard to say. Though there are indications to that as you point out.

I haven't ridden there myself. I have driven that road and other narrower ones in the area. Nothing about the area makes it particularly dangerous for cyclists apart from the inattention of motorists. Hills and trees in the area are the attraction for cyclists and it isn't exactly busy with cars.

I would love to see drivers and those responsible for the removable of the cycling lane to be held responsible for their actions.

**(Not entirely clear at this stage that the motorist was at fault, but you know....)

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby uart » Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:28 pm

redsonic wrote:Fixed the link for you. The damage to that car is horrific. In both collisions you linked to, the cars are damaged centrally. Riders claiming the lane and being mown down with no evasive action from the drivers?

Yes that was my hunch too redsonic. It looks like there's no usable shoulder so you'd be forced to take a lane. There are two lanes and not a lot of traffic so you wouldn't think it would be a problem, but it obviously is.

There was some speculation after the previous tragedy on that road (good weather and visibility - long straight stretch) that the driver was following another car, with the other car changing lanes to go around the cyclists and the car behind going straight ahead into them. So no matter how good the visibility, no matter how long and straight the road, this can still happen. :cry:
Last edited by uart on Sun Dec 10, 2017 10:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby ausrandoman » Sun Dec 10, 2017 6:03 pm

uart wrote:
redsonic wrote:Fixed the link for you. The damage to that car is horrific. In both collisions you linked to, the cars are damaged centrally. Riders claiming the lane and being mown down with no evasive action from the drivers?

Yes that was my hunch too redsonic. It looks like there no usable shoulder so you'd be forced to take a lane. There are two lanes and not a lot of traffic so you wouldn't think it would be a problem, but it obviously is.

There was some speculation after the previous tragedy on that road (good weather and visibility - long straight stretch) that the driver was following another car, with the other car changing lanes to go around the cyclists and the car behind going straight ahead into them. So no matter how good the visibility, no matter how long and straight the road, this can still happen. :cry:



So no matter how good the visibility, no matter how long and straight the road, this can still happen is likely if you tailgate. :cry:

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby uart » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:48 pm

ausrandoman wrote:So no matter how good the visibility, no matter how long and straight the road, this can still happen is likely if you tailgate. :cry:


Agreed. Tailgating drivers are some of the most dangerous drivers on the road in my opinion.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby human909 » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:58 pm

uart wrote:Agreed. Tailgating drivers are some of the most dangerous drivers on the road in my opinion.

Yet it seems acceptable and even encouraged behaviour amongst a very significant minority. In fact people not only do it but feel righteous in doing it if somebody isn't travelling the speed limit.


As an aside. It is one of the biggest differences I found when driving in the US. Their speed limits are more fuzzy line that a strict limit. The result was more variation in the speed people chose to drive on the highways. I found this meant that people were more ready to deal with those travelling slower than them. (AKA passing when appropriate, rather that acting indignant)

I ended up driving above the speed limit over there too when conditions were safe. I figured that if 10%-20% of traffic was still passing me then I was safe from the law enforcement.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby human909 » Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:02 pm

An update:

Unfortunately the cyclist has died. :cry:
Cyclist dead after being hit by car in Macedon

Notably:
"A Victoria Police spokeswoman said the driver of the car, a 23-year-old Gisborne woman, was in custody."

From my limited understanding 'custody' is abnormal unless there are clearly aggravating factors or the person is a flight risk. Wouldn't surprise me if it was drugs.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby Mububban » Sun Dec 10, 2017 11:04 pm

Hit from behind, on what looks like a road bike, on a flat road - say he's doing 30kph? Check out the impact damage :cry:

Image
When you are driving your car, you are not stuck IN traffic - you ARE the traffic!!!

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby find_bruce » Mon Dec 11, 2017 5:51 am

The level of damage to the vehicle suggests that it was not a collision caused by tailgating. Looks to me like a high speed impact causing the cyclist to fly in the air before falling heavily onto the windscreen & roof.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby fat and old » Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:50 am

find_bruce wrote:The level of damage to the vehicle suggests that it was not a collision caused by tailgating. Looks to me like a high speed impact causing the cyclist to fly in the air before falling heavily onto the windscreen & roof.


Agree on that. That's a high speed road, for everybody.

Wonder if it happened where there used to be cycle lane?

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby Comedian » Mon Dec 11, 2017 7:26 am

This is so sad. Having had a friend hit from behind recently you realise that they are the ones that you really don't have any control over.

The only thing I will say is that it's always easy to jump to conclusions. We had a young lady killed up here under a truck, and we all presumed the worst. Unfortunately though it was a touch of wheel and she fell under the truck so by all reports was doing no wrong. :cry:

Generally if the details are disclosed relatively quickly then it's deemed to be the fault of the cyclists. If it disappears into the abyss it seems that it is the fault of the motorist and it goes to the coroner. In those cases we get the full details.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby redsonic » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:08 am

find_bruce wrote:The level of damage to the vehicle suggests that it was not a collision caused by tailgating. Looks to me like a high speed impact causing the cyclist to fly in the air before falling heavily onto the windscreen & roof.


I think people are speculating that possibly the car was tailgating another in front of it. When the first car overtook the cyclist, the tailgating car was driving too close to react.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby NASHIE » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:07 pm

Sad news, and maybe just another instance of distracted driving ie phone/text. A life lost and young girl with a very heavy burden to carry for the rest of her life, whatever the cause was.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby find_bruce » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:21 pm

find_bruce wrote:The level of damage to the vehicle suggests that it was not a collision caused by tailgating. Looks to me like a high speed impact causing the cyclist to fly in the air before falling heavily onto the windscreen & roof.
redsonic wrote:I think people are speculating
I can agree up to that point

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby trailgumby » Mon Dec 11, 2017 4:13 pm

find_bruce wrote:
find_bruce wrote:The level of damage to the vehicle suggests that it was not a collision caused by tailgating. Looks to me like a high speed impact causing the cyclist to fly in the air before falling heavily onto the windscreen & roof.
redsonic wrote:I think people are speculating
I can agree up to that point

Apparently the police use the height of the impact point of the head with the windscreen to calculate closing speed at point of impact.

On that basis, and looking at the photo, she has hit him at what my late dad used to call "a rate of knots". :shock: :cry:

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby BenGr » Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:22 am

This sort of situation is why I get angry when cars move over at the last moment. The lack of indicator use is another thing that causes problems.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby biker jk » Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:03 am

Macedon cycling death prompts calls for bike lane overhaul along 'frightening' Black Forest Drive

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-12-12/cyclist-death-at-macedon-prompts-calls-for-road-overhaul/9247178

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby uart » Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:03 pm

find_bruce wrote:
redsonic wrote:I think people are speculating
I can agree up to that point

No find_bruce. I was commenting on the previous time (quite recently) that a similar incident happened on this stretch of road and a group of cyclists was struck from behind. People were wondering how a car could drive straight into the back of them on a lightly trafficked road with good visibility.

The news story from that previous incident said that the driver was following another car. The front car moved out to overtake the cyclists and the following car ploughed straight into them. This is where the context of drivers following other drivers too closely came from.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby roberto73 » Mon Apr 30, 2018 7:29 pm

Emma Louise Kent charged with dangerous driving causing death and failing to stay in her lane.
https://www.theherald.com.au/story/5371 ... ourt/?cs=7

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby uart » Mon Apr 30, 2018 7:42 pm

roberto73 wrote:Emma Louise Kent charged with dangerous driving causing death and failing to stay in her lane.
https://www.theherald.com.au/story/5371 ... ourt/?cs=7

I can almost hear them washing that lettuce leaf and getting it nice and wet already. That woman really has it coming I tell you.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby warthog1 » Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:19 pm

uart wrote:
roberto73 wrote:Emma Louise Kent charged with dangerous driving causing death and failing to stay in her lane.
https://www.theherald.com.au/story/5371 ... ourt/?cs=7

I can almost hear them washing that lettuce leaf and getting it nice and wet already. That woman really has it coming I tell you.


Agreed. The tears make that all but inevitable.
There will be no meaningful penalty as she has expressed remorse and is therefore "unlikely" to repeat the same behaviour.
No correction required.
There will continue to be no effective deterrent to other drivers operating their vehicle in the same manner.

Do not claim the lane on rural roads. It is likely to end badly given the prevalence of distracted and impaired drivers. :|

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby warthog1 » Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:21 pm

Still no word of any proceedings against the young lady who killed Jason Lowndes.

https://www.bendigoadvertiser.com.au/st ... lving-car/

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby uart » Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:38 pm

warthog1 wrote:Still no word of any proceedings against the young lady who killed Jason Lowndes.
https://www.bendigoadvertiser.com.au/st ... lving-car/


Yes it's frightening similar the damage to the front of the cars in both of those cases isn't it. It looks like in each case they've hit the cyclist straight on and almost dead centre at very high speed. It seems unlikely that either managed to brake or swerve at all to even try to avoid. :x

I know that there's no evidence, but I'd be surprised if distraction due to mobile device wasn't a factor in one or more of those cases.

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Re: Another failure to act and another serious "accident"

Postby Cyclophiliac » Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:48 pm

Yes, it seems a cyclist's life is worth stuff-all in this country these days. I can't even read any news articles by Australian news sites/papers that have anything to do with cyclists or cycling any more, because I inevitably can't stop myself reading a few of the comments, which is akin to walking into a sewer tunnel...

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