Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby warthog1 » Thu Dec 21, 2017 7:05 pm

CKinnard wrote:Older drivers spend a hell of a lot less time in their cars, and drive correspondingly less km's.
Further, they are not generally on the road at night, or early in the morning.



That is further reason for compulsory retesting. They recognize their age based physiological impairment has reduced their ability and limit driving to times when it is less challenging. It doesn't make them more able to react appropriately, safely and with adequate speed when the unexpected happens.
I don't drive when I'm intoxicated at all because apart from it being illegal I recognize that I'm impaired.
The same argument to my mind.
There is a minmum standard of competence for safe operation of a motor vehicle. If that is not met, for whatever reason, then the driver should not be in control of what amounts into a lethal weapon.

I agree with the family of the deceased. The independence of those unfit to drive due to physiological impairment is placed higher than the safety of other road users.
It is an unacceptable situation as it stands with respect to the licensing requirements for all and particularly elderly drivers.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby warthog1 » Thu Dec 21, 2017 7:11 pm

AdelaidePeter wrote:Except for the very old, the statistics are that older drivers are safer than younger ones (like under 25, especially males), by quite a margin. Testing for over 80 or over 85? Maybe. Testing for over 65, like that article suggests? Unwarranted.


They are safer than younger ones true. The younger ones are improving however.
Older people per distance traveled crash at over twice the rate of the median and they are getting worse with age.
ie their ability is in decline.
They are significantly worse than the median and getting worse still.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby CKinnard » Thu Dec 21, 2017 7:51 pm

warthog1 wrote:I agree with the family of the deceased. The independence of those unfit to drive due to physiological impairment is placed higher than the safety of other road users.
It is an unacceptable situation as it stands with respect to the licensing requirements for all and particularly elderly drivers.


I'm not against testing the elderly regularly and those over 75 in Qld have to get a medical certificate every year.

But I think if testing is to increase beyond this, it should also be increased for anyone who breaks traffic rules, and that people have their licenses suspended more often than currently, and $ fines increased dramatically for repeat offenders.

As many say, too many people take driving as a right, rather than a cooperative privilege granted by society.
If people want to disrespect the community by not abiding by the road rules, then they should be concretely reminded.

But if we are going to go down this road, we should also be banning imports of automotive after market performance parts, and speed limiting cars, and demanding all new cars come with black boxes and rear and front cameras.

If we're serious about road safety, then let's deal with all causes, seriously.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby warthog1 » Thu Dec 21, 2017 9:44 pm

CKinnard wrote:
warthog1 wrote:I agree with the family of the deceased. The independence of those unfit to drive due to physiological impairment is placed higher than the safety of other road users.
It is an unacceptable situation as it stands with respect to the licensing requirements for all and particularly elderly drivers.


I'm not against testing the elderly regularly and those over 75 in Qld have to get a medical certificate every year.

But I think if testing is to increase beyond this, it should also be increased for anyone who breaks traffic rules, and that people have their licenses suspended more often than currently, and $ fines increased dramatically for repeat offenders.

As many say, too many people take driving as a right, rather than a cooperative privilege granted by society.
If people want to disrespect the community by not abiding by the road rules, then they should be concretely reminded.

But if we are going to go down this road, we should also be banning imports of automotive after market performance parts, and speed limiting cars, and demanding all new cars come with black boxes and rear and front cameras.

If we're serious about road safety, then let's deal with all causes, seriously.


No problem with most of that. The discussion originated around elderly drivers so that is what I'm focused on.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby silentC » Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:52 am

I think these are separate issues. The impairments that people begin to suffer from as they move into old age are not really any different to other physical/mental impairments. They affect your default standard of driving. For example a person who suffers from fits needs to demonstrate they have it under control before they are allowed a licence, regardless of their age.

The onset of these things varies with the individual and some sort of standardised test for reaction times or something could be added to the eye sight test. Quite easy to implement these days with computer game technology. We have something in our lounge room that can test your reaction times and balance in a matter of minutes. Fail to obtain a minimum Wii Fit age and you're out :)

On the other hand, people who are just idiots on the road may well test satisfactorily but still do stupid things. I agree we are waaay too lenient on that. People who continue to drive while suspended or unlicensed should be receiving criminal charges and punished accordingly.
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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby AdelaidePeter » Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:37 am

warthog1 wrote:
AdelaidePeter wrote:Except for the very old, the statistics are that older drivers are safer than younger ones (like under 25, especially males), by quite a margin. Testing for over 80 or over 85? Maybe. Testing for over 65, like that article suggests? Unwarranted.


They are safer than younger ones true. The younger ones are improving however.
Older people per distance traveled crash at over twice the rate of the median and they are getting worse with age.
ie their ability is in decline.
They are significantly worse than the median and getting worse still.


What is your source for that, and what are the exact numbers and age groups? I had a look the other day and solid data was hard to find.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby warthog1 » Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:24 pm

It is difficult to find recent data yes. There appears to be a bias toward reporting collision rates per driver not per distance traveled. Per driver the stats don't look as bad because many elderly drivers recognize impairment and limit their use.

When I find some time I'll see if I can dig up some us data that reports the incidence as even higher than twice the median, for drivers aged 75 and over.

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=coll ... 66&bih=662

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby trailgumby » Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:38 pm

Elderly drivers and their competence to drive being insufficiently challenged is a real issue. I've had three incidents.

The first was my mum. Dad had been hiding it from me, but he'd been managing mum's worsening dementia for a good 12 months. Then he had to go into hospital for a triple bypass and I discovered my previously wonderfully domestically competent and houseproud mum had been reduced to relying on meals-on-wheels for major meals and sustenance because she could no longer cook for herself while Dad was being treated at John Hunter Hospital. (I'm not proud to say I hadn't been up to see them in person for much too long.)

I was horrified to learn she was still driving. She thought she was perfectly fine. I had to write to her doctor to insist her license was pulled. The prospect of her crashing and injuring or killing someone was something I could not ignore.

The second incident was a slow-driving 87-year old who failed to see me despite my being in plain sight and had the reaction time of the Titanic as she cleaned me up going through a roundabout. She got all truculent and did not want to exchange details, so I called the Police and made plain my concerns about her confusion and competence. Could have been much worse, but fortunately I only had a very slight crush injury where she ran over my foot. My brand new bike escaped having its wheels tacoed. Long story short, she had her license pulled on the spot.

Third was my Dad. Eventually he succumbed to dementia as well, and a driving incident uncovered it. Fortunately it was a single car crash, but it took emergency services a good 10 hours to find him, crashed off a rural road 50km off course from what was supposed to be a shopping trip of just a few hundred metres for the week's groceries. I found out the insurance had lapsed (along with a pile of other unpaid bills that were all opened and not acted upon) so if worse had happened, they'd likely have been wiped out financially. It could easily have involved someone else though.

It meant that I had to put them both in a nursing home. Mum hated it. She just wanted to be at home where Dad could look after her. She checked herself out a few weeks later. :cry:

So yeah, I thoroughly get the terrible impact that the loss of independence of no longer being able to drive imposes. However the awkward consequences of keeping them on the road past their ability to be safe are much worse in my opinion.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby warthog1 » Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:02 am

Thanks for making the effort to write that TG.
I don't think it is uncommon for people not to want to stop driving past the point they are no longer capable of the safe operation of a motor vehicle.
Good on you for being so proactive. Some place the right of their family members to drive higher than the safety of others and aren't willing to act.

It is inevitable we will all lose our faculties at some point, therefore ability needs to be assessed as we age so it is recognized before we become unsafe or have an accident.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby brumby33 » Sat Dec 23, 2017 10:55 am

On my visit to Mum up at Grafton last May, she picked me up from the airport about 15 kms out from town and on the way back to home, I was quite nervous on her concentration behind the wheel.
She is 82 and has mobility issues (uses a walker frame to get around) but her mind seems to be still very much intact with no signs of dementia at this stage.
She doesn't drive much anymore, just into town to do her shopping once a fortnight and see doctors, that's it and I feel her competence has suffered due to this lack of driving. She has always been a pretty good driver but on the way back from the airport, she pointed out a house and was veering towards a steep ditch on the side of the road, I quickly grabbed the steering wheel to steer away and ended up in a heated discussion with her denying what could have happened, not long after, she was approaching the rear of a parked truck and she was way too close to it....as a professional driver, my nerves were shattered by the time we got home....I allowed her to drive me back to the airport after my visit and she drove ok...might've been an off day for her but still I had to wonder on how long she can keep this up before she had an accident. She has been accident free for well over 40 years, but I don't want to lose her due to one.
I'd been trying to get her to sell up and to move back to Newcastle when I lived there but she declined as she feels too comfy where she is and doesn't want the stress of moving and she likes it up there in Grafton but she lives 10 kms out of town and I'm afraid that if she loses her right to drive, she's going to be totally housebound.
I've even tried to ask her to perhaps move into town and at least when that time came, she could get a mobility scooter to get around but nope...she refuses to budge!!

I hope to get up there in Mid January and I'll keep my eye on her ability to drive.....not sure how to act on this as I now live in Sydney and only see her once a year.

Elderly people can be very stubborn and even though they know their end is near, they don't want to stop what they're doing until they drop as they fear once they do, their life is over.

I'm just afraid that if I do notice her abilities on the road have deteriorated to the point of being dangerous, I'll have no option to seek Police help to determine the outcome...they can do it if they pull someone over for something but will have to seek a court order I think to make it happen. I don't know who her main doctor is.

Cheers

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Sat Dec 23, 2017 11:58 am

It's an age old theme. And I have certainly noticed a recent spike in media reports of people crashing into houses where the driver is old.

But I don't see any attempt to explain why the reports are more common now than they were. Likely it is just a current theme of the media. In this case the less than lazy ABC at least has come up with some substance behind the call.

But I seldom see any numbers in the media treatment. And probably not by the unfortunate family here either. ANd while I am not ATM going to chase these numbers myself I'm sure that others will.

On the other hand I note that driver who killed a cyclist from behind bein greported on this morning was 20yo. And I'm pretty sure that is the driver who incomprehensibly and blindly drove straight over the cyclist in Safety bay Road recently was aged the media woudl have reported so. (http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/dashcam-footage-captures-moment-perth-cyclist-is-thrown-from-bike-20171212-h037nn.html

And I can't recall the last time I saw a road-rage driving incident on TV featuring an angry senior citizen.

But I do know that over the years insurance stats tend to support older drovers as being of less concern than others. And especially the under 30's.

And I could go on about the age of drunk drivers. inattentive drivers and so forth.

I do agree that there is some sensible checking - for example eyesight as we age. But this has a sniff of another knee jerk reaction.

(For the record I have needed glasses since about age 45 and have been wearing them at all times since about 55. I think it is fair to say that most people's eyesight goes well before old age but I don't seen calls for compulsory eye tests for over 50's. And as a result my drivers license does nto require me to wear the essential glasses.)
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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby fat and old » Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:16 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:
And I can't recall the last time I saw a road-rage driving incident on TV featuring an angry senior citizen.



I did once. Big fella went after the old bloke with a baseball bat, in the middle of the street. Old fella stepped in and knocked him out, one punch :lol: It was very satisfying to watch.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:20 pm

fat and old wrote:
ColinOldnCranky wrote:
And I can't recall the last time I saw a road-rage driving incident on TV featuring an angry senior citizen.



I did once. Big fella went after the old bloke with a baseball bat, in the middle of the street. Old fella stepped in and knocked him out, one punch :lol: It was very satisfying to watch.

If you can point to link I wouldn't mind filing that one away for my own satisfaction. :mrgreen:
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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby trailgumby » Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:29 pm

brumby33 wrote:I'm just afraid that if I do notice her abilities on the road have deteriorated to the point of being dangerous, I'll have no option to seek Police help to determine the outcome...they can do it if they pull someone over for something but will have to seek a court order I think to make it happen. I don't know who her main doctor is.

Cheers

brumby33

I'm in NSW. I wrote to my mum's doctor via registered mail. Had she crashed and hurt either herself or someone else, he'd have been on the hook. Sending the letter registered made the point that I was completely serious without having to say directly that I would hold him accountable for any inaction.

I'm not sure how he did it, but he made it happen.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby bychosis » Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:31 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:I don't seen calls for compulsory eye tests for over 50's. And as a result my drivers license does nto require me to wear the essential glasses.)

In NSW at least you need to view the ‘chart on the back wall’ to get your licence renewed. No a full eyesight test, but an indication if you can see or not. I’ve had a low prescription for distance viewing for 20yrs but haven’t failed the test yet. Can still see fine, but can’t read street name signs until I’m driving past. Safety signs are a bigger font and I can read them fine.
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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby brumby33 » Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:35 pm

trailgumby wrote:
brumby33 wrote:I'm just afraid that if I do notice her abilities on the road have deteriorated to the point of being dangerous, I'll have no option to seek Police help to determine the outcome...they can do it if they pull someone over for something but will have to seek a court order I think to make it happen. I don't know who her main doctor is.

Cheers

brumby33

I'm in NSW. I wrote to my mum's doctor via registered mail. Had she crashed and hurt either herself or someone else, he'd have been on the hook. Sending the letter registered made the point that I was completely serious without having to say directly that I would hold him accountable for any inaction.

I'm not sure how he did it, but he made it happen.


Did your Mum find out you wrote that letter and what was her reaction? Was she cheesed off that you did such a thing? Is she still speaking with you lol ?
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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby trailgumby » Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:43 pm

I don't think she did find out. I asked the doctor not to mention my involvement. Her short term memory was only good for about 6 minutes so even if she did, she didn't remember. :?

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby warthog1 » Sat Dec 23, 2017 2:11 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:It's an age old theme. And I have certainly noticed a recent spike in media reports of people crashing into houses where the driver is old.

But I don't see any attempt to explain why the reports are more common now than they were. Likely it is just a current theme of the media. In this case the less than lazy ABC at least has come up with some substance behind the call.

But I seldom see any numbers in the media treatment. And probably not by the unfortunate family here either. ANd while I am not ATM going to chase these numbers myself I'm sure that others will.

On the other hand I note that driver who killed a cyclist from behind bein greported on this morning was 20yo. And I'm pretty sure that is the driver who incomprehensibly and blindly drove straight over the cyclist in Safety bay Road recently was aged the media woudl have reported so. (http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/dashcam-footage-captures-moment-perth-cyclist-is-thrown-from-bike-20171212-h037nn.html

And I can't recall the last time I saw a road-rage driving incident on TV featuring an angry senior citizen.

But I do know that over the years insurance stats tend to support older drovers as being of less concern than others. And especially the under 30's.

And I could go on about the age of drunk drivers. inattentive drivers and so forth.

I do agree that there is some sensible checking - for example eyesight as we age. But this has a sniff of another knee jerk reaction.

(For the record I have needed glasses since about age 45 and have been wearing them at all times since about 55. I think it is fair to say that most people's eyesight goes well before old age but I don't seen calls for compulsory eye tests for over 50's. And as a result my drivers license does nto require me to wear the essential glasses.)


When collision incidence per distance travelled is plotted on a graph as the vertical axis and age as the horizontal axis, it is a U shaped curve.
Yes, young drivers have the highest incidence, but at the other end of the age scale elderly people are also highly over represented.
Young drivers are already heavily scrutinized. I am not against more scrutiny and more comprehensive licence testing.
At the other end of the scale older drivers are not being scrutinized. This despite abilities deteriorating.
Aged based degenerative changes, in cognition, reflex, multitasking ability and coordination all decline with age.
In Victoria, where I am from, they are not tested at all;

Victoria has no regular testing, whether medical or on-road.
Victoria’s policy is based on the functional ability to drive, such that Victorians can drive
to any age as long as they are safe to do so. The system operates on community referrals
of at-risk drivers to the licensing authority, VicRoads. Most referrals are made by Police,
with the remainder from health professionals, concerned family members and friends, and
other members of the public.


ie they don't come under scrutiny until after an event has occurred in many cases.
Too bad if you are the person run down and killed as per the OP article.

This situation is ludicrous given the continued decline in abilities that are requisite for safe driving.
As a vulnerable road user, I feel my safety is compromised by the current system.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby bychosis » Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:31 pm

Sounds like victorians need to make more reports based on rego of vehicle and ‘older driver’ to help the licensing authority get the picture.
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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby uart » Sat Dec 23, 2017 4:37 pm

The family of a young man killed by an elderly driver is calling for political courage to restrict older drivers before more lives are lost.
Sue Jenkins' 22-year-old son, Dann, was killed while riding a motorbike in northern NSW in October last year.

First off let me remind everyone that this was in NSW, and we already have BOTH regular medial testing and driving testing for elderly drivers, and they must do these things to retain their license here!

ColinOldnCranky wrote:It's an age old theme. And I have certainly noticed a recent spike in media reports of people crashing into houses where the driver is old.

But I don't see any attempt to explain why the reports are more common now than they were. Likely it is just a current theme of the media. In this case the less than lazy ABC at least has come up with some substance behind the call.

But I seldom see any numbers in the media treatment. And probably not by the unfortunate family here either. ANd while I am not ATM going to chase these numbers myself I'm sure that others will.

On the other hand I note that driver who killed a cyclist from behind bein greported on this morning was 20yo. And I'm pretty sure that is the driver who incomprehensibly and blindly drove straight over the cyclist in Safety bay Road recently was aged the media woudl have reported so. (http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/dashcam-footage-captures-moment-perth-cyclist-is-thrown-from-bike-20171212-h037nn.html


Yes, to over emphasize the elderly driver connection here is to totally miss the point. And that point would be that this is in no way a problem that is exclusively one of elderly drivers, it's much more widespread than that. Yes I totally agree that elderly drivers are way over-represented in pedal confusion incidents, and I suspect that is the primary reason that the media spotlight has been on them more than ever lately (and indeed that particular issue has become more common over time due to the ever increasing usage of automatic transmission cars these day.)

However the above is is separate issue. On the issue at hand, I have not noticed any significant over-representation of elderly drivers in killing cyclists. Indeed, as with Colin, most of the recent incidents that come to mind have not involved elderly drivers, perhaps they are even under represented here. Let's look at some recent incidents involving cyclists where the driver turned directly across their path causing serious injury or death.
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/mohamed-fagee ... zlw5k.html
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-25/c ... ne/8841322
Both relatively young drivers.

For me the real story here (and so far everyone else has missed it) is that this time it happened to a road user who wasn't a pedal cyclist, so this time it's actually a serious issue. Notice the difference, no jail time in any of the above cyclist related incidents, but 9 months jail for this driver because he killed someone who wasn't a pedal cyclist. Sure he didn't end up having to serve the time because of his age, but the sentence is still relevant in my opinion. Look at the difference in attitudes to this incident compared to previous similar incidents involving cyclist. Why is nobody saying, "yeah he had a helmet and wasn't speeding, but should he really have been out on his motorbike at that time? " "That motorist probably just had the sun in his eyes, and now he has to (pretend) to live with the guilt of what happened". You know the story, a strong subtext in the reporting that the cyclist was really to blame, and the motorist almost a victim! But not this time - weird or what.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby trailgumby » Sat Dec 23, 2017 4:59 pm

They're overrepresented in the 4 collisions I've had (none of which were my fault according to Police) - two of them.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby uart » Sat Dec 23, 2017 5:11 pm

trailgumby wrote:They're overrepresented in the 4 collisions I've had (none of which were my fault according to Police) - two of them.

And they are under represented in people who have failed to give way to me, causing either accidents or near accidents. So where does that leave us? That one persons anecdotes don't necessarily tell the whole story.

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Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby warthog1 » Sat Dec 23, 2017 5:26 pm

uart wrote:
The family of a young man killed by an elderly driver is calling for political courage to restrict older drivers before more lives are lost.
Sue Jenkins' 22-year-old son, Dann, was killed while riding a motorbike in northern NSW in October last year.

First off let me remind everyone that this was in NSW, and we already have BOTH regular medial testing and driving testing for elderly drivers, and they must do these things to retain their license here!

ColinOldnCranky wrote:It's an age old theme. And I have certainly noticed a recent spike in media reports of people crashing into houses where the driver is old.

But I don't see any attempt to explain why the reports are more common now than they were. Likely it is just a current theme of the media. In this case the less than lazy ABC at least has come up with some substance behind the call.

But I seldom see any numbers in the media treatment. And probably not by the unfortunate family here either. ANd while I am not ATM going to chase these numbers myself I'm sure that others will.

On the other hand I note that driver who killed a cyclist from behind bein greported on this morning was 20yo. And I'm pretty sure that is the driver who incomprehensibly and blindly drove straight over the cyclist in Safety bay Road recently was aged the media woudl have reported so. (http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/dashcam-footage-captures-moment-perth-cyclist-is-thrown-from-bike-20171212-h037nn.html


Yes, to over emphasize the elderly driver connection here is to totally miss the point. And that point would be that this is in no way a problem that is exclusively one of elderly drivers, it's much more widespread than that. Yes I totally agree that elderly drivers are way over-represented in pedal confusion incidents, and I suspect that is the primary reason that the media spotlight has been on them more than ever lately (and indeed that particular issue has become more common over time due to the ever increasing usage of automatic transmission cars these day.)

However the above is is separate issue. On the issue at hand, I have not noticed any significant over-representation of elderly drivers in killing cyclists. Indeed, as with Colin, most of the recent incidents that come to mind have not involved elderly drivers, perhaps they are even under represented here. Let's look at some recent incidents involving cyclists where the driver turned directly across their path causing serious injury or death.
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/mohamed-fagee ... zlw5k.html
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-25/c ... ne/8841322
Both relatively young drivers.

For me the real story here (and so far everyone else has missed it) is that this time it happened to a road user who wasn't a pedal cyclist, so this time it's actually a serious issue. Notice the difference, no jail time in any of the above cyclist related incidents, but 9 months jail for this driver because he killed someone who wasn't a pedal cyclist. Sure he didn't end up having to serve the time because of his age, but the sentence is still relevant in my opinion. Look at the difference in attitudes to this incident compared to previous similar incidents involving cyclist. Why is nobody saying, "yeah he had a helmet and wasn't speeding, but should he really have been out on his motorbike at that time? " "That motorist probably just had the sun in his eyes, and now he has to (pretend) to live with the guilt of what happened". You know the story, a strong subtext in the reporting that the cyclist was really to blame, and the motorist almost a victim! But not this time - weird or what.



Nobody denies there are issues with our licensing requirements generally.
However, per distance travelled elderly drivers are over represented.
The medical requirement you have in NSW is unlikely to specifically target the skills as required to operate a vehicle safely.
Is the medical able to be filled out by the local GP.
Can you Dr shop to find a lenient one?
Is the family GP you have been seeing likely to objectively test an individual?
I don't have any specifics for NSW but given people don't age any differently than the rest of us age based degenerative decline is still going to apply there.

When accident rates are calculated per mile driven, elevated rates are
observed among the youngest and oldest dnvers. For example, drivers 16-19 had 3.0
times the overall risk of fatal involvement, and drivers 75 and over had 3.8 times the
overall risk in 1990. Considering all police-reported accidents, teenage drivers had
3.3 times the overall risk, and the oldest drivers had 2.0 times the overall risk per
mile.


https://deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bitstrea ... sequence=2

There are graphs in there for you to peruse.
As the age increases the accident rate per distance at the end of the age spectrum increases sharply, reflecting the age based degenerative changes.
Sorry as a road user I don't subscribe to the practice that a driver incapable of reacting in an unexpected situation should be able to continue driving because they seek to limit the chance of a collision by limiting vehicle use.
You are either competent or not and if you are not you have no place in charge of what amounts to a deadly weapon.
Last edited by warthog1 on Sat Dec 23, 2017 6:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

fat and old
Posts: 2984
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Location: Mill Park

Re: Elderly drivers: Grieving family calls for greater political courage to deal with 'growing deadly problem'

Postby fat and old » Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:41 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:
fat and old wrote:
ColinOldnCranky wrote:
And I can't recall the last time I saw a road-rage driving incident on TV featuring an angry senior citizen.



I did once. Big fella went after the old bloke with a baseball bat, in the middle of the street. Old fella stepped in and knocked him out, one punch :lol: It was very satisfying to watch.

If you can point to link I wouldn't mind filing that one away for my own satisfaction. :mrgreen:


No TV Colin, I actually saw it happen. I thought the old bloke was gone. Then pop, big guy goes down. Too much swagger, not enough action :lol:

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