5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

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RonK
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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby RonK » Thu Mar 01, 2018 2:47 pm

queequeg wrote:
RonK wrote:
queequeg wrote:For the frameset I have coming, I was going to be paying GST & Customs processing anyway. I have done this before for a complete bike, but in that case the duty was waived because of the FTA with the USA, not because of the concession.
In this case, if I have to pay the Duty, it changes the calculation slightly in that you pay a tax on top of the tax.


Perhaps, but you may also win the customs inspection lottery and like myself (and others here) pay nothing at all.


Highly unlikely, as the frameset will be sent via something like DHL Express, who will perform the customs clearance. If it comes in as regular post without the correct import paperwork it would go into the customs lottery, but the sight of a large framebox would trigger an inspection.

Not at all unlikely. I have imported three framesets from Europe in the past few years, all sent by courier and have won the customs inspection lottery twice.

I also know another forum member who imported a complete bike from Germany and also won the customs inspection lottery.
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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby queequeg » Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:58 pm

RonK wrote:
queequeg wrote:
RonK wrote:
Perhaps, but you may also win the customs inspection lottery and like myself (and others here) pay nothing at all.


Highly unlikely, as the frameset will be sent via something like DHL Express, who will perform the customs clearance. If it comes in as regular post without the correct import paperwork it would go into the customs lottery, but the sight of a large framebox would trigger an inspection.

Not at all unlikely. I have imported three framesets from Europe in the past few years, all sent by courier and have won the customs inspection lottery twice.

I also know another forum member who imported a complete bike from Germany and also won the customs inspection lottery.


Any pointers on how to get it in tax free? It’s coming from Italy via the UK :-)
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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby RonK » Thu Mar 01, 2018 6:46 pm

queequeg wrote:
RonK wrote:
queequeg wrote:
Highly unlikely, as the frameset will be sent via something like DHL Express, who will perform the customs clearance. If it comes in as regular post without the correct import paperwork it would go into the customs lottery, but the sight of a large framebox would trigger an inspection.

Not at all unlikely. I have imported three framesets from Europe in the past few years, all sent by courier and have won the customs inspection lottery twice.

I also know another forum member who imported a complete bike from Germany and also won the customs inspection lottery.


Any pointers on how to get it in tax free? It’s coming from Italy via the UK :-)

Sorry, no pointers. It's purely down to luck. I suspect that due to the volume of incoming parcels, customs cannot possibly inspect every single parcel, so inspections done at random.
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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby eeksll » Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:31 pm

stealth bikes

bottom of the line range has a limited top speed of 25kmph (in AUS) and 45kmph top speed "off road" starting at a price of $7k

all other bikes have a top speed of 80kmph.

does this even have the same customer base as cycling?

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby AUbicycles » Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:56 pm

Stealth bikes is an interesting one. I am speculating that they felt threatened by the growing competition their segment (high power offroad ebikes) and did not consider or did not care about the affect on the other segments.

But to get to the answer - an article / press release presents it as a win for Australian Manufacturing and Innovation:

http://www.medianet.com.au/releases/154885/

In a coup for Australian manufacturers, the Federal Department of Home Affairs has approved Stealth Electric Bikes objection to the duty free import of Electric Power Assisted Bicycles into Australia. The concession has been in place since 2010 and allowed foreign made Electric Bicycles to be brought into Australia duty free, providing an instant 5% discount to all importers.

The Bicycle Industry of Australia has reacted with force, using their political relationships, to raise the matter in Senate estimates and pursue further action through political channels. Stealth Founder, John Karambalis is disappointed at their reaction. "The decision of the Department was made with the intention to protect Australian industry. Given the current focus of the Federal Government is on Australian innovation and jobs, there's no better case study to point to than Stealth."



Stealth are confident that the affected importers who have had their time in the sunshine care about their customers and will adjust their prices accordingly.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby queequeg » Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:36 pm

AUbicycles wrote:Stealth bikes is an interesting one. I am speculating that they felt threatened by the growing competition their segment (high power offroad ebikes) and did not consider or did not care about the affect on the other segments.

But to get to the answer - an article / press release presents it as a win for Australian Manufacturing and Innovation:

http://www.medianet.com.au/releases/154885/

In a coup for Australian manufacturers, the Federal Department of Home Affairs has approved Stealth Electric Bikes objection to the duty free import of Electric Power Assisted Bicycles into Australia. The concession has been in place since 2010 and allowed foreign made Electric Bicycles to be brought into Australia duty free, providing an instant 5% discount to all importers.

The Bicycle Industry of Australia has reacted with force, using their political relationships, to raise the matter in Senate estimates and pursue further action through political channels. Stealth Founder, John Karambalis is disappointed at their reaction. "The decision of the Department was made with the intention to protect Australian industry. Given the current focus of the Federal Government is on Australian innovation and jobs, there's no better case study to point to than Stealth."



Stealth are confident that the affected importers who have had their time in the sunshine care about their customers and will adjust their prices accordingly.


Stealth have actually gone after both market segments. They can't make up their mind whether they are making motorbikes or e-bikes. From their website, you'd have to say that their bikes are primarily powered by the motor, and are assisted by the rider (when the battery goes flat). Their P-7 model has a 750W motor, and even with a switch to restrict it to 250W it is still not legal.

Image

Image

There was no need for them to use the "e-bike" category, as they do not make any street legal bikes that fall into the category.
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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby Kronos » Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:43 pm

Is there any reason for this? I suppose those in Canberra want us to ride a Malvern Star? Considering any bike I would like to ride is already in Australia it wont affect me for the foreseeable future, but its ridiculous none the less. Protectionism never stopped GM and Ford leaving Australia (and it was their choice) even after all the bogans who want to drive a V8 Torana bought into it and tried to force it on the rest of us.

This kind of protectionism will never work without the strong manufacturing base to support it and with the price of labor in Australia we had better get used to the fact that we will never have a strong manufacturing base.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby AUbicycles » Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:51 pm

Kronos, read the article linked in the first post and also read the article I posted (a few posts previously) and you will get all of the background info.


It was suggested that if the second duty free concession on bikes and frames is removed, then Stealth would then be liable for the 5% duty on the import of their frames which are manufactured overseas.

In this case they have essentially gained nothing except a lot of other unhappy industry colleagues and a poorer retail trade situation in the entire cycling industry. When retailers are already complaining that they can't be competitive ... this isn't helping and I feel it is realistic that this can affect the livelihood of other Australians.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby John Lewis » Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:44 am


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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby AUbicycles » Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:59 am

I saw that BN article. The author is obviously even more emotionally torn than I am. It seems that they were almost in tears as they tried to somehow piece together the frustration and shock to form the words and sentences.

While it is fairly one-dimensional coverage, it still represents a frustration among the cycling industry and keen observers who recognise that the implications are far disastrous to Australian business and consumers that the benefits which this single company may reap.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby Kronos » Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:39 am

AUbicycles wrote:Kronos, read the article linked in the first post and also read the article I posted (a few posts previously) and you will get all of the background info.


It was suggested that if the second duty free concession on bikes and frames is removed, then Stealth would then be liable for the 5% duty on the import of their frames which are manufactured overseas.

In this case they have essentially gained nothing except a lot of other unhappy industry colleagues and a poorer retail trade situation in the entire cycling industry. When retailers are already complaining that they can't be competitive ... this isn't helping and I feel it is realistic that this can affect the livelihood of other Australians.


Of course, the tariffs on imports have always been bollocks and after the collapse of the car industry anyway, after all the money poured in also, you would think the government would learn a lesson about it. As with the costs of cars, the 5% tariff will be passed onto the consumer anyhow and we will all be worse off because of it.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby Tim » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:20 am

Has there been any word from are fearless bicycle advocacy groups yet?
Or are the just rolling over to in their usual manner.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby AUbicycles » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:38 am

BN published the article linked by John Lewis above.

The thing is, this isn't a bicycle advocacy topic as advocacy is primarily about bike riding and not the retail and industry side.

Bicycles Industries Australia (which have their consumer facing 'We Ride Australia') were quotes in the original CyclingTips article as saying it is a disappointing. I had contact with them today and they also see that it will hurt the industry and retail.

That said, BIA are supporting the removal of the GST Threshold - this side with local industry who see that this affects their ability to compete on a level playing fieId. don't agree with that and the success of Pushys and BikeBug, shops via BikeExchange and the numerous other online retailers in Australia are proof that you can be successfully competitive. In anycase, the threshold is a disadvantage to consumers and many retailers such as Wiggle will be forced to register with the ATO if they want to sell to Australia, they have to collect the GST on behalf of the ATO. Smaller companies have a problem... though this is a different topic to the duty free concession.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby fat and old » Fri Mar 02, 2018 7:48 am

As far as I can see, Stealth gains absolutely nothing by this. So why do it? Somebody in the bike industry p'd them off, royally. Stealth gains payback. I think that rather than blaming them out of hand the causes should be looked into. There has to be a reason for this, especially if Stealth ends up paying more for components.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby MichaelB » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:43 am

Now I know what the contraption is that I see a guy riding near my home. It's one of those Stealth ones and it FLIES along !!

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby baabaa » Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:16 pm

RonK wrote:
queequeg wrote:
RonK wrote:Not at all unlikely. I have imported three framesets from Europe in the past few years, all sent by courier and have won the customs inspection lottery twice.

I also know another forum member who imported a complete bike from Germany and also won the customs inspection lottery.


Any pointers on how to get it in tax free? It’s coming from Italy via the UK :-)

Sorry, no pointers. It's purely down to luck. I suspect that due to the volume of incoming parcels, customs cannot possibly inspect every single parcel, so inspections done at random.

Luck?? Not true.
If you are a fine, upstanding member of the community who is kind to friends and relatives, likes animals and especially dogs, smiles to other bikers, does one best to avoid MHL discussions and yet does not tolerate fools on BNA you will have no issues....
(my frame-set from Germany worth $1500 aud/ 1000 Euro just lobbed in tax-free today (the total shipment was $1750 AUD ) this is my second frame/fork from Germany in two years that has come in without any extras....Lucky this last frame will be my very last that I ever need as I am now 100% totally N+ don't be bloody silly)

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby Howzat » Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:28 pm

MichaelB wrote:Now I know what the contraption is that I see a guy riding near my home. It's one of those Stealth ones and it FLIES along !!


On the bike path, of course, as you can't ride unregistered motorbikes on the road.

I can't see 5% being any kind of "disaster", but if the government is going to apply tariffs to imports, would be nice if they did it for products that are legal to use.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby MichaelB » Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:36 pm

Howzat wrote:
MichaelB wrote:Now I know what the contraption is that I see a guy riding near my home. It's one of those Stealth ones and it FLIES along !!


On the bike path, of course, as you can't ride unregistered motorbikes on the road.

....


Nope, ridden on footpath and road.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby Duck! » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:04 pm

You can't legally ride an unregistered mototbike on paths either.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby Jmuzz » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:10 pm

queequeg wrote:Their P-7 model has a 750W motor, and even with a switch to restrict it to 250W it is still not legal.


My understanding is that the motor size of a Pedelec isn't important, what is important is that it has the official certification of being tested to comply with the EN15194 standard. The electronics must obey the 250W (with averaging, it allows for some surging).

The actual requirements are a bit complex, but in the end it is like AS certified helmets, either the design went through the lab testing and got the EN15194 certification, or it didn't and is not legal.

When they talk about their off-road model it sounds like that is an actual model version not just a mode?
To get the certification as Pedelec it can't just be trivial to bypass the computers restrictions and any bike caught with a bypass device is non compliant.

I don't see any mention of the EN15194 on their site so not sure what the case is there?
I'm sure an angry bicycle industry will be checking though.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby queequeg » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:51 pm

Jmuzz wrote:
queequeg wrote:Their P-7 model has a 750W motor, and even with a switch to restrict it to 250W it is still not legal.


My understanding is that the motor size of a Pedelec isn't important, what is important is that it has the official certification of being tested to comply with the EN15194 standard. The electronics must obey the 250W (with averaging, it allows for some surging).

The actual requirements are a bit complex, but in the end it is like AS certified helmets, either the design went through the lab testing and got the EN15194 certification, or it didn't and is not legal.

When they talk about their off-road model it sounds like that is an actual model version not just a mode?
To get the certification as Pedelec it can't just be trivial to bypass the computers restrictions and any bike caught with a bypass device is non compliant.

I don't see any mention of the EN15194 on their site so not sure what the case is there?
I'm sure an angry bicycle industry will be checking though.


If the bike ships with a 250W rated motor, they are in the clear, However, their bikes don't seem to have EN15194 certification, and without that, under NSW Road Rules, it makes them a Moped

See http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/documents/.../vsi-27-mopeds-power-assisted-pedal-cycles.pdf
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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby Aussie Bruce » Fri Mar 02, 2018 4:25 pm

I dont post much but i know the manufacturer of stealth bikes
I know how many people he employs
I say well done for the government to actually step in and protect a small

Australian Manufacturer of Electric Bicycles

(with a factory actually making things)

Regards

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby bychosis » Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:09 pm

Whilst I applaud a local business, Why should the govt protect one small manufacturer? Protecting a whole industry is a different idea though - but one can argue that if we have a collective of businesses that make up an industry, then they should be competitive enough to profit without protectionism.
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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby CKinnard » Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:23 pm

I haven't got a problem with tariffs as soon as

- govt and the private sector stop shifting jobs offshore.
I know for a fact the Australian govt uses Filipino labour offshore, en masse.

- govt stops supporting and encouraging the import of excessive unskilled and skilled labour, and the unemployable.

- govt stops imposing administrative and employee overhead.

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Re: 5% tarif on bike imports - a disaster for Aus bike industry

Postby eeksll » Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:36 pm

Aussie Bruce wrote:I dont post much but i know the manufacturer of stealth bikes
I know how many people he employs
I say well done for the government to actually step in and protect a small

Australian Manufacturer of Electric Bicycles

(with a factory actually making things)

Regards


except it does not help stealth bikes what so ever and probably pisses off a bunch of other people. Stealth bikes are not selling the same product.

Where is it possible to even ride the stealth bike? can I legally ride one in MTB park / MTB trail?

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