Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

twowheels
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Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby twowheels » Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:45 am

Interesting, relates to several recent threads
https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/ext ... 4zigf.html

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby find_bruce » Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:19 am

I like the fact that trolls post their extremist views on which their identities are traceable - they are blissfully unaware of the number of cases in which social media posts have been used to identify or proved the lie of their expressions of remorse

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby human909 » Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:49 am

I find the stark difference between police statements to the media and their actual actions deeply concerning.

"A NSW Police spokesman said police will continue to "take the appropriate action against anyone who breaks road rules".

...

"We urge anyone with information or anyone with dashcam or other footage of traffic offences to come forward. Any matters reported to police will be investigated," the police spokesman said."


Either the NSWs police command doesn't know what actually happens in their stations or they are deliberately telling porkies. Either way it isn't good.

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby find_bruce » Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:59 am

human909 wrote:Either the NSWs police command doesn't know what actually happens in their stations or they are deliberately telling porkies. Either way it isn't good.
Please don't try making this a stave v state thing - with faking breath tests & describing red light running as accidental, not so squeaky clean there. Similar issues in other states as well

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby human909 » Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:18 pm

find_bruce wrote:Please don't try making this a stave v state thing - with faking breath tests & describing red light running as accidental, not so squeaky clean there. Similar issues in other states as well

:shock: :roll:

I'm not making it a state vs state thing. You are the first to do that. I was just quoting the article which happened have a quote from the NSW police command.

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby queequeg » Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:36 pm

find_bruce wrote:
human909 wrote:Either the NSWs police command doesn't know what actually happens in their stations or they are deliberately telling porkies. Either way it isn't good.
Please don't try making this a stave v state thing - with faking breath tests & describing red light running as accidental, not so squeaky clean there. Similar issues in other states as well


The article refers to a FOI Request made to NSW Police, and the responses received by NSW Police.

Based on my own experience with submitting video to NSW Police of driving behaviour that endangered me, their reaction was in stark contrast to the article, which was the police did everything they could to avoid fining the driver, and wanted me to jump through so many hoops that it wasted hours of my time. So, NSW police can say all they want, but their actions are what counts.
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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby human909 » Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:59 pm

Exactly the context I was replying to which is why I was and still am so confused by find_bruce's objection.

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby find_bruce » Mon Jun 04, 2018 2:24 pm

queequeg wrote:Based on my own experience with submitting video to NSW Police of driving behaviour that endangered me, their reaction was in stark contrast to the article, which was the police did everything they could to avoid fining the driver, and wanted me to jump through so many hoops that it wasted hours of my time. So, NSW police can say all they want, but their actions are what counts.
I agree with you - what I am suggesting is that your experience mirrors my own & that of cyclists in every state that has introduced safe passing laws - ie all except Victoria & Northern Territory. That there have been any fines issued is due to the persistence of the cyclist

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby human909 » Mon Jun 04, 2018 2:42 pm

So why you objection? You are the only person here making interstate comparisons and the only person objecting against it. :?:

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby queequeg » Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:41 pm

Just noticed on the linked article, there is a little "chatbot" that goes through all the usual arguments, dispelling myths etc.

It's kind of cool - scroll down to just before the comments section.
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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby AUbicycles » Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:48 pm

Worth pushing for a petty argument? Probably not so I will move this along.

Can also echo that the real experience reporting contrasts with the statement by the police spokesperson and the reason why many dangerous / illegal passes were simple not reported despite video evidence.

A minor note, in the article it mentions 60 infringement notices issued and we know from members here, how long it took and how much work and persistence was necessary to get a result.may not be the case for all, but certainly us for the incidents I know of.

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby g-boaf » Mon Jun 04, 2018 5:31 pm

AUbicycles wrote:Worth pushing for a petty argument? Probably not so I will move this along.

Can also echo that the real experience reporting contrasts with the statement by the police spokesperson and the reason why many dangerous / illegal passes were simple not reported despite video evidence.

A minor note, in the article it mentions 60 infringement notices issued and we know from members here, how long it took and how much work and persistence was necessary to get a result.may not be the case for all, but certainly us for the incidents I know of.


Might be worth getting in touch with SMH on this, they might be interested in following up on that. They've always loved catching out bureaucrats ever since the days of Matthew Moore (the former FOI editor).

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby Discodan » Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:17 pm

I've often wondered of the claimed number of drivers fined, how many of them were due to riders pushing it through with police. It would be nice to get a running tally
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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby Zippy7 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:48 pm

queequeg wrote:Based on my own experience with submitting video to NSW Police of driving behaviour that endangered me, their reaction was in stark contrast to the article, which was the police did everything they could to avoid fining the driver, and wanted me to jump through so many hoops that it wasted hours of my time. So, NSW police can say all they want, but their actions are what counts.


I went to my local police and showed them video of a close pass. The senior in charge was aggressive and was intimidating/threatening me. So much so that I didn't want to give them my details and left as quickly as I could. I could not trust the coppers at my local after that incident.
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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby kenwstr » Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:10 pm

human909 wrote:
"We urge anyone with information or anyone with dashcam or other footage of traffic offences to come forward. Any matters reported to police will be investigated," the police spokesman said."


Well, I guess it does specifically state "dashcam" and no mention of helmet cam or handlebar cam.

Ken

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby queequeg » Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:50 pm

Zippy7 wrote:
queequeg wrote:Based on my own experience with submitting video to NSW Police of driving behaviour that endangered me, their reaction was in stark contrast to the article, which was the police did everything they could to avoid fining the driver, and wanted me to jump through so many hoops that it wasted hours of my time. So, NSW police can say all they want, but their actions are what counts.


I went to my local police and showed them video of a close pass. The senior in charge was aggressive and was intimidating/threatening me. So much so that I didn't want to give them my details and left as quickly as I could. I could not trust the coppers at my local after that incident.


The one I went to was friendly and polite, but the end result was still the same. "Nothing we can do. Driver doesn't recall seeing you. Driver can challenge video. Won't stand up in court. Driver spoken to, but we can't issue a fine because he didn't hit you"
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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby queequeg » Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:51 pm

kenwstr wrote:
human909 wrote:
"We urge anyone with information or anyone with dashcam or other footage of traffic offences to come forward. Any matters reported to police will be investigated," the police spokesman said."


Well, I guess it does specifically state "dashcam" and no mention of helmet cam or handlebar cam.

Ken


Wouldn't that fall under "or other footage"?
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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby AUbicycles » Wed Jun 06, 2018 2:07 am

The response that the video footage ‘wont stand up in court’ is wrong.

This is something I have previously shared and was told by a duty officer that only police recorded footage is submissible. Also a snide comment “I don’t know why you even ride on the streets”.

I wrote a letter (not email) to the area commander whether he could confirm this was true and got a response that it was incorrect - of course footage can be used.

As is suggested, there us a theme of disinterest and misinformation with a number if officers and a regular forum member @trailgumby has documented his process. The onus is on the rider... not the culprit, and it takes time, persistence and energy.

Unfortunately it is easier to give-up which is what I have done a number if times even though I have clear footage of drivers acting illegally and aggressively with the result that my safety is in danger.

The NSW government still has an agenda of targeting bike riders and taking a soft and ineffective approach on enforcing safe passing which presents a far greater impact to bike rider safety.

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:42 am

Cycling Australia have a legal sponsor that claims to provide support to members.
Perhaps it's time to put them to the test?
http://membership.cycling.org.au/Legal-Support

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby mikesbytes » Wed Jun 06, 2018 4:03 pm

How many of the 60 booked for close passes were initiated by the police? Surely even though they have not done anything to enforce the law themselves, they must of observed close passes when they were driving around.

Operation Pedro should include all cycle related laws, how long would it take to book a 100 close passes, probably one plain clothes officer for one day riding around with the correct camera and the video is given to Admin
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby chriso_29er » Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:06 pm

Police should give their own calibrated cameras to normal civvy riders. No different to a speed camera operator!
Wouldn't want to endanger a member of the force :)
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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby human909 » Wed Jun 06, 2018 8:24 pm

chriso_29er wrote:Police should give their own calibrated cameras to normal civvy riders.

What is a police calibrate camera?

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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby Zippy7 » Wed Jun 06, 2018 9:47 pm

chriso_29er wrote:Police should give their own calibrated cameras to normal civvy riders. No different to a speed camera operator!
Wouldn't want to endanger a member of the force :)


Nah, they couldn't contemplate doing anything like what the midlands police are doing.
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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:04 pm

find_bruce wrote:I like the fact that trolls post their extremist views on which their identities are traceable - they are blissfully unaware of the number of cases in which social media posts have been used to identify or proved the lie of their expressions of remorse

There's a FB page dedicated to collecting examples of that
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Re: Extremist motorists trolling cyclists - SMH

Postby Thoglette » Thu Jun 07, 2018 4:04 pm

I note with interest a reference to
ABC online wrote:...a Victorian conviction and $2000 fine for knowingly engaging in conduct with the intention of inciting serious contempt for or revulsion of a class of people.
(See here reporting on a "far right" club organiser )

BV should be onto that.
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