on-bike navigation options

User avatar
jules21
Posts: 10365
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:14 pm
Location: deep in the pain cave

on-bike navigation options

Postby jules21 » Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:54 pm

does anyone have advice on a good navigation option for on-bike use? before you answer, read on..

I broke my Garmin 510, which had breadcrumb navigation. This was pretty useful actually, so I might replace it.

In the meantime, I'm relying on my smartphone. This is proving less than satisfying. I am using Google Maps, which is very annoying:
a. I build maps in Google's MyMaps function (google.com/mymaps), which is good.
b. I am not only navigating regional routes, but primarily I am navigating city routes - i.e. finding a safe route through urban areas.
c. I am navigating with Google Maps, into which you can upload your MyMaps route.

Unfortunately, Google Maps is balls. The reason starts and ends with - it won't adhere to waypoints. So if you put in a 100km loop with 20 waypoints, Google Maps will ignore the way points and navigate you to the finish - using my example of a loop: "You have arrived". I haven't even started yet!

Are there any other non-subscription Android apps. into which you can program a route with waypoints, and which adheres to the route you've planned? i.e. navigates a route between each waypoint

The solution I've got with Google Maps is to navigate between interim waypoints, i.e. split your journey into numerous journeys, forcing it to take you from waypoint to waypoint. But in the city, this means pulling over every few minutes and programming in the next 'journey', which is balls.

Any ideas?

User avatar
familyguy
Posts: 5767
Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2008 2:30 pm
Location: Cremorne, NSW

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby familyguy » Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:29 pm

I've used Maps.Me, which seemed to have done reasonably well guiding me around the back ways and non-road paths to a couple of places. Might be worth a look.

https://maps.me/download/

Jim

LateStarter
Posts: 74
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:10 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby LateStarter » Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:33 pm

I replaced my 510 with a 520 and it has everything I need. My typical use is for following a downloaded RWGPS route of 100-300km on Audax rides and the 520 works perfectly for this. The breadcrumb overlays a reasonable OSM map. The non-touch interface (ie buttons) is why better than the 510 touch interface or the endless problems reported with the more expensive models. The 520 can use open street maps but the limited space means you have to use one of the extract sites that allows selection of "tiles" or an area boundary so the map file is kept small.

A recent (more expensive) 520 Plus is also available that has lots more free space and more on-device navigation routing but I don't need this.

g-boaf
Posts: 9655
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby g-boaf » Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:22 pm

jules21 wrote:does anyone have advice on a good navigation option for on-bike use? before you answer, read on..

I broke my Garmin 510, which had breadcrumb navigation. This was pretty useful actually, so I might replace it.

In the meantime, I'm relying on my smartphone. This is proving less than satisfying. I am using Google Maps, which is very annoying:
a. I build maps in Google's MyMaps function (google.com/mymaps), which is good.
b. I am not only navigating regional routes, but primarily I am navigating city routes - i.e. finding a safe route through urban areas.
c. I am navigating with Google Maps, into which you can upload your MyMaps route.

Unfortunately, Google Maps is balls. The reason starts and ends with - it won't adhere to waypoints. So if you put in a 100km loop with 20 waypoints, Google Maps will ignore the way points and navigate you to the finish - using my example of a loop: "You have arrived". I haven't even started yet!

Are there any other non-subscription Android apps. into which you can program a route with waypoints, and which adheres to the route you've planned? i.e. navigates a route between each waypoint

The solution I've got with Google Maps is to navigate between interim waypoints, i.e. split your journey into numerous journeys, forcing it to take you from waypoint to waypoint. But in the city, this means pulling over every few minutes and programming in the next 'journey', which is balls.

Any ideas?


A Garmin 520 might work. However, the 520 doesn't have touch screen and that is very irritating for me. Also I find the screen very difficult to read in strong light with the fairly flat angle it sits at on my bike. The whole display looks dark and the graphics on screen cannot be read easily.

User avatar
kb
Posts: 2438
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 3:22 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby kb » Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:03 pm

What sort of phone? You can usually add stops in Google Maps and even reorder them if you want.
Image

User avatar
kb
Posts: 2438
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 3:22 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby kb » Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:06 pm

Sorry, just reread and saw MyMaps, don’t know that so feel free to ignore above if it makes a difference :-)
Image

madmacca
Posts: 431
Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:13 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby madmacca » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:52 am

ridewithgps as an interim app solution.

Recent releases by Garmin offer some interesting possibilities at lower price points.

The 130 offers breadcrumb routes (but not full mapping).
The 520 Plus is a more fully featured headunit with mapping, but supposedly map rendering is slow and clunky (not sure whether this will be fixed with a FW update).
The new Edge Explore offers mapping and a good touchscreen, but without power meter support.
Last edited by madmacca on Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
RonK
Posts: 10244
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: Brisbane, Queensland
Contact:

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby RonK » Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:04 am

madmacca wrote:The new Edge Touring offers mapping and a good touchscreen, but without power meter support.

Shock, horror. I wouldn’t dream of going touring without a power meter.
Cycle touring blog and tour journals: whispering wheels...

User avatar
RonK
Posts: 10244
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: Brisbane, Queensland
Contact:

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby RonK » Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:06 am

Viewranger is an excellent smartphone navigation app. Check it out.
Cycle touring blog and tour journals: whispering wheels...

g-boaf
Posts: 9655
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby g-boaf » Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:08 am

RonK wrote:
madmacca wrote:The new Edge Touring offers mapping and a good touchscreen, but without power meter support.

Shock, horror. I wouldn’t dream of going touring without a power meter.


Shock horror, what's the point of dropping power meter support when it has been there for ages? Why don't they also make a colour screen optional too. Perhaps even remove the display of speed and distance too - or make it an option you pay extra for? Or perhaps even have a surcharge if your route has more than a certain number of waypoints?

It's a rip off. USD$300 (from Garmin in the USA) for cut back functionality? Might as well just use a Smart Phone app instead of paying that much money.

I must say I've never much liked the navigation features on any Garmin I've tried to be honest.

Dave_C
Posts: 125
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:40 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby Dave_C » Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:55 am

I believe the NEW Garmin 520 Plus has full map directions like their bigger models. You would just have to be sure it is the Plus model. Unsure if there is a price diifference
Dave
Image

User avatar
RonK
Posts: 10244
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: Brisbane, Queensland
Contact:

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby RonK » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:24 am

Serious contenders about to enter the market are the new Lezyne Mega XL and Lezyne Mega C, particularly if they live up to the claimed battery life of up to 48 hours for the Mega XL and 32 hours for the colour model. And it is listed at a very attractive price point to boot.

Lezyne Mega GPS

Another very promising new entry is the SIGMA ROX 12.0. It is rated highly by Ray Maker. Way back I had a Sigma Rox 9.0 and it was one of the best bike computers I've ever owned.

Either of these could tempt me away from my Wahoo unless they deliver re-routable navigation for the Elemnt.
Cycle touring blog and tour journals: whispering wheels...

Velt
Posts: 111
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2016 6:52 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby Velt » Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:18 am

SIGMA ROX 12.0 looks pretty good, I've been considering it myself

User avatar
MichaelB
Posts: 9007
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:29 am
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby MichaelB » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:36 pm

Dave_C wrote:I believe the NEW Garmin 520 Plus has full map directions like their bigger models. You would just have to be sure it is the Plus model. Unsure if there is a price diifference


It does.

I have one on test at the moment for BNA with the writeup coming soon. Also have the Varia 510 as well.

Nav capability is same as 1030 as far as I have found out. There are some small features missing, but so far so good. Usual annoying Garmin issues, but I rate it better than the 1030 (I HATE that touch screen).

If you have any questions re the 520+, feel free to ask

User avatar
hamishm
Posts: 559
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2009 11:31 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby hamishm » Wed Jul 11, 2018 3:58 pm

g-boaf wrote:Shock horror, what's the point of dropping power meter support when it has been there for ages?

Edge Touring has no ANT+ so no HRM, power, cadence. Actually it's obsolete anyway so I don't know why it was mentioned.

Same deal with the Edge Explore though which seems to be the current equivalent.

madmacca
Posts: 431
Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:13 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby madmacca » Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:42 pm

hamishm wrote:
g-boaf wrote:Shock horror, what's the point of dropping power meter support when it has been there for ages?

Edge Touring has no ANT+ so no HRM, power, cadence. Actually it's obsolete anyway so I don't know why it was mentioned.

Same deal with the Edge Explore though which seems to be the current equivalent.


My bad - I did mean the new Edge Explore rather than the Touring. I've edited my post.

Explore does offer HRM, etc over ANT+, just not power.

g-boaf
Posts: 9655
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby g-boaf » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:03 pm

hamishm wrote:
g-boaf wrote:Shock horror, what's the point of dropping power meter support when it has been there for ages?

Edge Touring has no ANT+ so no HRM, power, cadence. Actually it's obsolete anyway so I don't know why it was mentioned.

Same deal with the Edge Explore though which seems to be the current equivalent.


Even more obsolete Garmin devices have all of these and navigation and a reasonable touch screen. Touring or explore seems like a farcical marketing ploy and grab for money. Sell a fairly bare bones device at a fairly extravagant price with a name they hope will make it appeal to touring only riders.

Velt
Posts: 111
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2016 6:52 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby Velt » Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:11 am

Is the new Edge explore even coming to Aus? I don't think the previous ones did

User avatar
RonK
Posts: 10244
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: Brisbane, Queensland
Contact:

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby RonK » Thu Jul 12, 2018 12:41 pm

g-boaf wrote:
RonK wrote:
madmacca wrote:The new Edge Touring offers mapping and a good touchscreen, but without power meter support.

Shock, horror. I wouldn’t dream of going touring without a power meter.


Shock horror, what's the point of dropping power meter support when it has been there for ages? Why don't they also make a colour screen optional too. Perhaps even remove the display of speed and distance too - or make it an option you pay extra for? Or perhaps even have a surcharge if your route has more than a certain number of waypoints?

It's a rip off. USD$300 (from Garmin in the USA) for cut back functionality? Might as well just use a Smart Phone app instead of paying that much money.

I must say I've never much liked the navigation features on any Garmin I've tried to be honest.

I couldn't really care less what Garmin do. I will never buy another Garmin device, one experience was enough.

But power meter and even hrm support on a touring computer is about as useful and desirable as tits on a bull.
Cycle touring blog and tour journals: whispering wheels...

g-boaf
Posts: 9655
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm

Re: on-bike navigation options

Postby g-boaf » Thu Jul 12, 2018 1:16 pm

RonK wrote:
g-boaf wrote:
RonK wrote:Shock, horror. I wouldn’t dream of going touring without a power meter.


Shock horror, what's the point of dropping power meter support when it has been there for ages? Why don't they also make a colour screen optional too. Perhaps even remove the display of speed and distance too - or make it an option you pay extra for? Or perhaps even have a surcharge if your route has more than a certain number of waypoints?

It's a rip off. USD$300 (from Garmin in the USA) for cut back functionality? Might as well just use a Smart Phone app instead of paying that much money.

I must say I've never much liked the navigation features on any Garmin I've tried to be honest.

I couldn't really care less what Garmin do. I will never buy another Garmin device, one experience was enough.

But power meter and even hrm support on a touring computer is about as useful and desirable as tits on a bull.


Why do you even need a touring version of a bike computer at all? Just do a fully featured bike computer at a reasonable price that suits all purposes. More people might buy them too.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Eug1, piledhigher, TheWall