Australian Cycling Forums - Bicycles Network Australia

march83 wrote:Westbound: Currently I'm going on the south side of the M4 through Orchard Hills and Glenmore Park then rejoining at Mulgoa Rd. It's adding ~15 minutes. The detour is pretty average - the rolling hills in Orchard Hills from the M4 to Northern Road are slow, there is no shoulder, there is speeding traffic who are mostly rat-running to try to avoid the Northern Rd off ramp traffic jam. I would feel much safer on the M4 shoulder.

Eastbound: I'm getting off the highway at Blaxland and using Mitchell's Pass, Victoria Bridge and then backroads through Penrith towards the hospital. Then Kingswood, around the uni, Caddens Rd and back on the 4. Probably 20 minutes extra there and again it's horrible having to deal with traffic through Penrith, passing lots of parked cars especially around the hospital and I'd rather just be on the M4.

Totally agree - why they can't just budget for a decent cycleway like the M7 has? Providing the GWH as the detour is terrible, added to which they expect cyclists to travel up and down Mamre Rd? Prospect Hwy? Look at the 2 right hand turns necessary to access the GWH from the M4 westbound a Prospect Highway! Ridiculous! And the GWH has no bike lane, few sections with shoulders, lots of light and hills and trucks and other traffic. Disgusting.

FWIW, I have ~15yrs of rolling up and down the M4 for work in my legs and I'm definitely anything but accepting of this sort of stuff!

Yeah, it's BS, isn't it? How hard can it be, there is plenty of room for such a facility.

march83 wrote: Totally agree - why they can't just budget for a decent cycleway like the M7 has? Providing the GWH as the detour is terrible, added to which they expect cyclists to travel up and down Mamre Rd? Prospect Hwy? Look at the 2 right hand turns necessary to access the GWH from the M4 westbound a Prospect Highway! Ridiculous! And the GWH has no bike lane, few sections with shoulders, lots of light and hills and trucks and other traffic. Disgusting.

Well, I believe safety audits and discussions with Bicycle NSW were undertaken before the first set of detours were settled upon. It's possible that the letter I linked to was premature in its details, and that the reason detour maps haven't appeared on that project's website is because their suggested detour has been knocked back for the reasons you say. Really hope it means they put in something better. So we will see.

It's not too late to write to the RMS and the construction company, for anyone that is interested in the issue, whether you currently ride the M4 or not. Here's the RMS email address for the project: m4sm@rms.nsw.gov.au
This is the construction company one: M4SM-Stage1@fultonhogan.com.au . Safety is a hot-button issue with these companies.

While a cycleway would have been a great idea, it would add 10-20% to the project costs (based on the M7 cycleway) and that's a hard sell. The easiest solution they can implement right now is some sort of ramp crossing option as you described earlier, at each affected site, even if it means widening the top of the ramps or something. No doubt there will be times when the ramp is closed completely and a convoluted detour is required, just as it is for cars, but they are generally doing those closures in the middle of the night when no one is riding anyway.

march83 wrote: The fastest option IMO is to just ride the shoulder to the northern road exits, ride up the exit ramp and then cross the northern road at the top directly onto the on ramp. I'm pretty sure this can be done at the moment without forcing you into the motorway lanes.

I suspect there are other locations where the barriers don't actually need to be right up to the fogline. If there is any space, even 1-2m, they could install two sets of barriers, with cyclists riding in between. Modern bolted down steel barriers require very little deflection space.

Hergest wrote:

march83 wrote:they're doing landscaping and remediation all through that section at the moment. I don't think it can be too far away.

Wouldn't be too bad if they were making a bit of extra effort after the long delay but nothing is being done on the weekends so it's monday to friday, 7 till 3 with probably a skeleton crew judging by the lack of progress.

Well!
"Spank my butt & call me Charlie!"

Rode through here this morning & the fences are gone & the path is open AT LAST!!

Only 12months late ......


after all it's only for cycling.....

you know they don't pay Rego??

Having the Parramatta viaduct back is nice, a few less streets to have to contend with. New smart motorway project is not so nice...

A few new plastic bollards have appeared at a few of the M4 interchanges. This gave me cause to look up the detour maps and they're appalling: http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/documents/pro ... ur-map.pdf

These detours suggest using the Great Western Highway between Mamre Rd and Prospect Hwy in both directions, a route which has long sections of no shoulder, a few patches of shared use paths, a little bit of shoulder, lots of traffic lights and whole lot of heavy traffic. Definitely not suitable for bikes and not something I'm going to do.

So I guess I'll have to send out some emails to the RMS and construction company, contact the local cycling club and see if they can do anything. In the meantime I'm going to be staying on the M4 - as of yesterday there were some changes to the alignment around the M7 interchange but no changes which actually impact upon cyclists.

Considering how long this project is going to continue, IDK, this is basically going to eliminate the possibility of commuting from the west to Parramatta and beyond for the next 3-5 years. Very disappointing.

So the big orange bollards and associated signage for the Prospect Hwy <-> Mamre Rd detours have disappeared. Makes sense, considering the road conditions have basically remained unchanged.


Also, an interesting one this morning, the Church St gate eastbound (ie, on the northern side) was chained and padlocked closed. Seems like a very, very odd thing for someone to do. I'm not bothered by riding down Church St so whatever, but I just seemed really weird for someone to do that on purpose...

march83 wrote:Having the Parramatta viaduct back is nice, a few less streets to have to contend with. New smart motorway project is not so nice...

A few new plastic bollards have appeared at a few of the M4 interchanges. This gave me cause to look up the detour maps and they're appalling: http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/documents/pro ... ur-map.pdf

These detours suggest using the Great Western Highway between Mamre Rd and Prospect Hwy in both directions, a route which has long sections of no shoulder, a few patches of shared use paths, a little bit of shoulder, lots of traffic lights and whole lot of heavy traffic. Definitely not suitable for bikes and not something I'm going to do.

So I guess I'll have to send out some emails to the RMS and construction company, contact the local cycling club and see if they can do anything. In the meantime I'm going to be staying on the M4 - as of yesterday there were some changes to the alignment around the M7 interchange but no changes which actually impact upon cyclists.

Considering how long this project is going to continue, IDK, this is basically going to eliminate the possibility of commuting from the west to Parramatta and beyond for the next 3-5 years. Very disappointing.

You could also try contacting Julie Owens MP (for Parramatta) - she's also one of us. Perhaps organise a meeting with her - suggest getting some detailed documents together that she can work from easily. Julia Finn MP is another one in the area, her office is in Merrylands.

Ausgrid are potentially closing M4 path alongside Duck River temporarily due to installation of overhead wires from Camellia to Lidcome. Construction due to start in early 2018 according to their timeline.

They are asking for community feedback regarding the possible closure and have a survey open until February 2nd 2018.

https://www.ausgrid.com.au/Common/Custo ... oject.aspx

g-boaf wrote:

march83 wrote: Yeah, it's BS, isn't it? How hard can it be, there is plenty of room for such a facility.

A Penrith-Parramatta cycleway was part of the 10-year plan of the previous Labor government, slated for 2019. Unfortunately, they proved to be less than 100% ethical and have been banished to opposition for the forseeable future. Liberal governments are not usually renowned for their cycling infrastructure.

fishwop wrote:A Penrith-Parramatta cycleway was part of the 10-year plan of the previous Labor government, slated for 2019. Unfortunately, they proved to be less than 100% ethical and have been banished to opposition for the forseeable future. Liberal governments are not usually renowned for their cycling infrastructure.

Its a tough choice isn't it - when it comes to cycling infrastructure one mob promise the world, but deliver very little in disconnected dribs & drabs (the M7 path is the only exception). The Penrith-Parramatta cycleway was a good example - promised at a time when the government stank worse than week old fish, & the promise required them to win 2 more elections before work would even commence.

The other mob promise almost nothing & that's what they deliver

find_bruce wrote:

fishwop wrote:A Penrith-Parramatta cycleway was part of the 10-year plan of the previous Labor government, slated for 2019. Unfortunately, they proved to be less than 100% ethical and have been banished to opposition for the forseeable future. Liberal governments are not usually renowned for their cycling infrastructure.

Its a tough choice isn't it - when it comes to cycling infrastructure one mob promise the world, but deliver very little in disconnected dribs & drabs (the M7 path is the only exception). The Penrith-Parramatta cycleway was a good example - promised at a time when the government stank worse than week old fish, & the promise required them to win 2 more elections before work would even commence.

The other mob promise almost nothing & that's what they deliver

They delivered us crackdowns on riders, increased anger from motorists and also ripped up a cycleway (one I never used) if I remember right. Maybe I should deliver get them a bottle of Grange Hermitage for their efforts (which they'll conveniently forget about). Maybe I'll address it to Premier McPremierFace.

As long as they don't rip up the shared pathways and cycleways I'll be using in a few months, then I'll be happy.

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/mot ... 4zba2.html

Motorcyclist dead after collision with kangaroo on M4 motorway near Claremont Meadows. Be careful out there.

Yeah, that's just crazy. There have been a few more roo carcasses on the side of the motorway lately, I have to think it's due to the amount of scrub they've cleared around the M4 what with all of the roadworks.

In the continuing saga of M4 diversions, there's a new addition to my detours on the westbound trip. Homestead Rd has been closed at Northern Rd so I have to go via the big Northern Rd + Glenmore Parkway roundabout which is a pretty messy on a normal day and a plain old disaster on a school day...

Also, the works at Reservoir Rd are ramping up. Looks like that shoulder will disappear soon enough. Afternoon trips westbound will be horrible once I have to get off the M4 at Prospect Hwy and ride the GWH from Reservoir to the M7. I'm moving desks back to Baulkham Hills in June and that just cannot come soon enough...

Between Church Street and Wigram Street Harris Park, someone has been on an epic glass smashing effort. Be careful through there. Unfortunately there is nothing to sweep it away with.

Also be careful with all the left over dirt/silt. It's still there, hasn't been cleaned away.

I've got email from Ausgrid today, the full msg as stated below.

Duck River cycleway - permanent reinstatement

As you may know, Ausgrid's contractor Garde has been working to install new underground electricity cables along the Duck River cycleway. Work to install cables in the cycle way is now complete, with work to restore the cycleway to its original condition starting soon.
Upcoming work between Adderley Street and Duck River Bridge

Work to reinstate the cycle way between the Adderley Street entrance and the bridge will start from Monday 25 February and will take approximately two weeks to complete. During this time, the cycleway will be temporarily closed between Adderley Street and the bridge.
Cyclists will be detoured via Duck Street and Junction street. Please follow signage to be directed on to the detour route.

Once reinstated, this section of the cycleway will be reopened and can be used as normal. The entire cycleway should be reopened and returned to normal within approximately six weeks.

As always, we encourage you to get in touch if you have any concerns or questions.
For more information please visit the project page: http://www.ausgrid.com.au/camelliatolidcombe
Kind regards,
Serene

Serene Hajjar

Community Engagement Officer | Major Projects
1800 604 765

Level 01, 570 George Street, Sydney NSW 2000
majorprojects@ausgrid.com.au

Hi all,

Planning a ride into the mountains and back on Sunday with some mates. Is the M4 from The Northern Road, west bound into the mountains, safe atm? I recall reading somewhere that it wasn't, but that was awhile ago.

Any help appreciated. Thanks.

Hi Dave. I went through there by car a few days ago. The on ramp and maybe 1st kilometre of the motorway heading west from the Northern Rd has concrete barriers up against the left lane so there is no shoulder. After this, there's shoulder all the way west. Personally, I would find an alternative route, but I've seen a few other riders on my strava feed take on these shoulder-less sections in very quiet conditions but personally I think it's ill-advised.

Depending on which way you're travelling, I'd suggest taking an alternative route west into the mountains.

The new Yandai crossing bridge is a nice way to cross the river and it's pretty easily accessed from either Penrith CBD, or from the river bank trail from the north or south. Going up the mountains there are lots of backstreets and cyclepaths through Emu Plains to keep you off the highway and motorway that can take you up the Old Great Western highway and into Lapstone, along Governors and Explorers and into Glenbrook.

Currently the RMS Cycleways Finder https://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/maps/cycleway_finder
shows the M4 between Gipps/Kent Rd and Mulgoa Rd as "no cycling allowed" in both directions. Otherwise the whole length has become very unpleasant in recent years especially at every entry/exit ramp with motors doing their best F1 impressions

Thanks march83 and LateStarter

Glad I asked. We're now thinking of getting off The Northern Rd at Littlefields Rd and going up Mulgoa Rd to then get on the Highway. Not sure of backstreets and cyclepaths to the Mountains.

Mulgoa Rd into Penrith isn't great. There's very little shoulder from Mulgoa into Penrith, it's an 80 zone.

If I were coming from the south I'd do something like this: https://goo.gl/maps/T1QjsywdQXKaghux9

Going through Glenmore Park is squiggly, but you're in 50 zones so it's much safer.

Agreed re Mulgoa Rd, have a look at the appropriate bits of this route (from Audax route repository) https://ridewithgps.com/routes/18723826, the highway west of the Nepean is generally ok these days all the way to Katoomba, mostly good shoulder except towards the top of Lapston opposite the air force base and at Falconbridge. Coming back is great, (40k down hill!) use Mitchells Pass Blaxland to Emu Plains and then the nice new bridge over Nepean (mentioned above).

Continuous cycling routes west of M7 to Nepean are a problem and generally not pleasant, GWH is doable but busy, Elizabeth Drive likewise, train to Penrith avoids the unpleasant bits and allows you to push further up the mountains, Katoomba etc

Some of this (except M4) might help https://ridewithgps.com/routes/26820317 or this if you are very keen https://ridewithgps.com/routes/26820350

LateStarter wrote:Agreed re Mulgoa Rd, have a look at the appropriate bits of this route (from Audax route repository) https://ridewithgps.com/routes/18723826, the highway west of the Nepean is generally ok these days all the way to Katoomba, mostly good shoulder except towards the top of Lapston opposite the air force base and at Falconbridge. Coming back is great, (40k down hill!) use Mitchells Pass Blaxland to Emu Plains and then the nice new bridge over Nepean (mentioned above).

Continuous cycling routes west of M7 to Nepean are a problem and generally not pleasant, GWH is doable but busy, Elizabeth Drive likewise, train to Penrith avoids the unpleasant bits and allows you to push further up the mountains, Katoomba etc

Some of this (except M4) might help https://ridewithgps.com/routes/26820317 or this if you are very keen https://ridewithgps.com/routes/26820350

I've done that Audax ride a few times. The section I've encountered problems with motorists has been on Park Rd. It seems to attract the local bogans.

biker jk wrote:I've done that Audax ride a few times. The section I've encountered problems with motorists has been on Park Rd. It seems to attract the local bogans.

Yes, Park Rd's straightness of 4 kms exceeds their attention span, pity as early morning on the preceding Bents Basin Rd can bring out the Kangaroos and is very pleasant, peaceful.

Thanks everyone! Great information.

In the past, I've just gone The Northern Rd and turned left onto the M4 and followed that until Katoomba etc. It's always been no problem. Road works have changed that.

LateStarter wrote:Penrith avoids the unpleasant bits

But The Northen rd is a great ride. Well used to be. Some roadworks now has detracted from that, but still good.

LateStarter wrote:or this if you are very keen https://ridewithgps.com/routes/26820350

I've only done the 200km (version a few times). Probably my favourite Audax course.

There is glass on the path around Harris Park (again).