Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

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Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Mon Jan 04, 2016 5:13 pm

This is a new thread to follow-on from a thread on a McCarrs Creek Road tragic collision and discussion on routes and safety. This thread expands to the whole northern beaches to cover cycling in the whole area (and beyond).

This isn't just a road safety thread, though I am starting off with this.


I have news to report, as of today regarding Pittwater Road in Bayview and Church Point. Some time ago Sydney Water dug up sections of the westbound lane which was temporarily filled. The local Pittwater Council had requested that it be restored to the original condition (i.e. complete lane resurface) and there was uncertainty after the temporary fix...was that it? A few phone calls and emails - now with more people back to work a community relations staff member at Sydney Water has earmarked the restoration of this section of the road for early March (or thereabouts). Since the temporary fix - which is a nuisance for bike riders and drivers (I have driven it myself as well), Sydney water have requested quotes from contractors and are now reviewing these and will communicate with the council to ensure that all are in agreement.


Otherwise, Pittwater Road and McCarrs Creek Road in the council jurisdiction (i.e. residential) is suffering from deteriorating road surface conditions. On a bike, there are a lot of obstacles to dodge and in doing so, it provides fewer overtaking opportunities for motorists. I am continuing to address this to the Pittwater council and encourage others to do so as well.

On the ride to Palm Beach, on Barrenjoey Road, north of Newport Beach, the debris and also gradual deterioration of the road surface edges is building so would be good to get the council to take a look and have more regular trips from street cleaners.


Also had a very rare trip from Terry Hills along Mona Vale road (east) to Ingleside and it reminded me how much I hate riding that short stretch. I really look forward to the 2017 planned widening of Mona Vale Road which will see two lanes in each way plus generous breakdown / cycle lane as well as a second more leisurely 'back' route between Terry Hills and Ingleside.


Christopher

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Wed Jan 20, 2016 10:04 pm

For some silly reason, my last few rides have include rides along Mona Vale road between Terry Hills and Ingleside. Each time I ride I am reminded how dangerous it is - • Fast moving traffic (I feel the speed limit is fair for the stretch, though the stretch of road doesn't accommodate for bike riders)
• Lots of debris - I rode over 15 branches / twigs heading west on the last trip
• Narrow shoulder - perhaps better described as non-existent as the section heading to Kimbricki (travelling west) is so narrow and has so much debris that there is no alternative that to ride on the white line or in the lane of traffic.


In 2017 the plan is to widen the road with two lanes in each direction and wide shoulders to suit bike riders (plus an alternative route).

--

I am meeting with the Pittwater council this week to view the progress in their bike plan and also to address a few bike transport topics in the council area.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby Mjainoz » Thu Jan 21, 2016 6:11 am

Good luck at the meeting.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby sir_camel » Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:36 am

Thanks for your representation
2011 Scott CR1
2013 Kona Paddywagon

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Sun Jan 24, 2016 5:56 pm

I will report, the council staff are cycling positive and there was Manly Warringah CC rep, a fellow from Bicycle Network Victoria and 3 staff.

Good discussions, mostly concentrating on McCarrs creek road and solution to make it safer and also harmonious as there is a strong residents group - small but influential with the local MP who are livid at cyclists talking when they ride and that they ride and it us hard to pass.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby skydance » Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:20 pm

I wonder if there is any chance to ask for Akuna Bay resurface as well...

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby Addictr3 » Thu Jan 28, 2016 1:48 pm

I like the bumps on Akuna, I think the road is good.
If you can't explain it simply, then you don't understand it well enough.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Fri Jan 29, 2016 12:43 am

The RMS look after that road, actually very good condition still compared to other RMS roads.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Fri Jan 29, 2016 2:47 pm

As promised - here are some more details:

The main discussion point was McCarrs Creek Road (both council and RMS area of responsibility)
- Strong resident group opposed to cyclists full-stop. They have political influence over Rob Stokes.
- Residents are opposed to cyclists and motorcyclists because of their noise and because it is hard to overtake.
- The council suggested that the residents have a sense of entitlement.

Discussed solutions for improving cycling safety and improve co-use
- Improving current road surface is difficult as they don't have money (and it is not see as a priority).
- Likewise for cycling infrastructure - there are limited funds and space plus it is not seen as a priority (i.e. no strong demand).
- Speed Camera are difficult as there are virtually no locations that allow proper line-of-sight
- Electronic Speed Monitor and kmh display, "you are travelling X km" is an interesting option.
- Visual Road markings to encourage motorists to slow around corners and pinch zones. Similarly to suggest appropriate overtaking locations and discourage overtaking in other areas.
- Introduce Cycling Events to that cycling is accessible and normal.
- Reducing speed limits is strongly opposed by resident groups and MP Rob Stokes.

Other locations discussed were the Bilgola Bends which are very difficult though an offroad shared bike path is planned (suitable for recreational cyclists). In Church Point a new carpark is being built for Scotland Island residents. This will be built on the 'land' side of the road and speed limit dropped in the area.

Talked about new anti-cycling laws from Duncan Gay. I noted that the council should communicate the safe overtaking space (and that double lines can be crossed) to overtake. Dangerous overtaking occurs when motorists are hesitant when overtaking and have trouble committing - this creates more risk for bike riders. The new law does provide clarity.

Briefly discussed new Belrose MTB park (might be moving forward again). Many of the new bike plans are geared toward the planned B-Line bus service. The Pittwater council will continue and a merger is planned with Warringah council which won't mean that progress is stalled but does mean that changes and integration should be expected.


The council have take the feedback onboard - I don't expect to see dramatic change though it was suggested that I keep writing to the council to ask them to fix the road conditions. The General Manager is Mark Ferguson: pittwater_council@pittwater.nsw.gov.au (9970 1105)

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby march83 » Fri Jan 29, 2016 5:20 pm

AUbicycles wrote:I noted that the council should communicate the safe overtaking space (and that double lines can be crossed) to overtake.



Is that correct? I thought that we couldn't cross double lines to pass under any circumstances.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby biker jk » Fri Jan 29, 2016 6:26 pm

march83 wrote:
AUbicycles wrote:I noted that the council should communicate the safe overtaking space (and that double lines can be crossed) to overtake.



Is that correct? I thought that we couldn't cross double lines to pass under any circumstances.


From March, drivers overtaking cyclists can cross double lines if safe to do so. It's part of the minimum passing distance trial.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Sat Jan 30, 2016 7:07 pm

Thanks biker-jk, that is correct and if the NSW fail to communicate this (and they are failing) then safe cycling misses out on tis safety benefit.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Tue Feb 02, 2016 9:07 am

Just been informed by Pittwater council that funding is allocated in the draft delivery program for 2016/17 to fix up this corner names Dutch Slide between 167 - 171 McCarrs Creek Road.

You will be familiar with it as the second sharp corner (heading west) with all of the bins. The problems are debris on the flanks and a poor road surface in both directions which is degraded. As a result it has caused a number of bicycle accidents.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby trailgumby » Tue Feb 02, 2016 9:42 am

Good to hear. That corner is quite badly degraded.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Wed Feb 03, 2016 11:39 am

Sydney Water have informed me by phone that the resurfacing of the Pittwater Road in the Bayview area (which was dug-up for utilities and temporarily patched) is being fast-tracked and the Pittwater council have the tender. This means that the entire lane will be resurfaced. I am requesting that utility covers are set flush with the road surface (rather than at a lower (original) height which creates the deep holes.

The work is expected to commence in about two weeks from now.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Thu Feb 04, 2016 12:35 pm

Warringah Council are holding a Bike Plan Workshop

Project: Bike Plan Review
Category: Community Engagement
Organisation: Warringah Council
Come along to the Council Chambers for a Community Workshop to further develop ideas and initiatives to improve bike riding in Warringah.

Thursday 11 February 6pm - 8pm

Bookings are essential and should be sent to David Bell by email or 9942 2667 by Tuesday, February 9.

Refreshments will be provided.

Details and bookings: https://www.warringah.nsw.gov.au/get-in ... workshop-0

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Thu Feb 11, 2016 10:44 pm

Back from the Warringah Council Bike Plan workshop - about 50 people attended, a far greater number than I anticipated.

The workshops revolved around discussions. First session had two groups discussing On Road cycling in Warringah and two groups discussing Off Road. A lot of intelligent discussion on safety, issues and also solutions - both short term and achievable as well as long term fantastic visions. The Off Road was not specifically MTB, infact had a lot of cross-over covering shared paths, footpaths (eg. ride to school) and connectability.

The second session again had four groups, two looking at Warringah Road and two looking at Pittwater road, both problems and solutions. Again all the topics that you could imagine were discussed.

The council and staff were great in facilitating and supporting but their objectives were not clear and they were not active in their input or discussing how feedback would be used . I understand that they are compiling as part of their research for developing the new bike plan. It now really needs more structured meetings with stakeholders and bike rider representatives to create better organised and prioritised input.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Sun Feb 21, 2016 6:10 pm

Good news for Pittwaterroad in Bayview, the council has resurfaced the road in the section which Sydney Water opened up and then temporarily patched. It is a nicd surface now that covers the entire lane, so safer, and makes you want the rest of Pittwater road and McCarrs fixed as well.

(Tapatalk... Whoops)

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby biker jk » Sun Feb 21, 2016 6:50 pm

Good to hear. Thanks for your efforts.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby AUbicycles » Mon Feb 22, 2016 12:10 pm

Bad news from Warringah Council. Following the really positive community feedback evening - the key staff member responsible is moving on. However the council is not replacing this position and has provided no contact person for bike issues or their Bike Plan.

I received feedback from the council today that the Bike Plan is being shelved because they don't know what is happening with the council merger/changes which are part of Mike Baird (FitForFuture) concept to change all of the council boundaries. The input will still be collated and will then sit and wait until after this - so bad news for cycling safety for this area which really does need a lot of work - and in my view their are a lot of easy victories - low cost and fast fixes which work in the benefit of motor vehicle traffic and bike riders.

Pittwater council are unfazed... in that this shakeup is pending however they are still continuing with their Bike Plan.

----


Pittwater Road around Bayview has now been resurfaced in the area where Sydney Water dug up the road. The resurfacing is nice and now removed the 'safety hazard' temporary fix. That said, the existing potholes and low-sunk utility holes that are found along the rest of Pittwater Road and McCarrs Creek Road still need council attention.

What can you do? Write to the General Manager of Pittwater council - pinpoint potholes and similar as safety hazards. With enough interested and pressure they will need to address and improve.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby biker jk » Sat Mar 12, 2016 12:56 pm

A cyclist crashed at West Head today and was airlifted to hospital with a fractured leg. We were at Bayview having coffee when an ambulance went past and we later heard of the incident on the radio. I don't know the location of the accident but possibly the sharp, tightening, off camber right hand bend just before the lookout. It's certainly caught a few out before.

Earlier we had seen a cyclist down on the sharp right hand, off camber corner heading towards Illawong Bay. Looked like a broken collar bone.

Be careful out there.
Last edited by biker jk on Sat Mar 12, 2016 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby trailgumby » Sat Mar 12, 2016 3:02 pm

That last corner catches a LOT of riders out. I hear more stories than I'd like about that section of road.

The weekend before last my mate encountered a guy down and they stopped to render help. The guy wasn't good, but he said "I'm not as bad as my mate." It was at that point they found a guy on the other side of the fence trying to keep his insides in.

He had cut himself open sliding along on the top of the Armco fencing. :x My mate rendered first aid, keeping him on his back and applying pressure to stem the bleeding. Surprisingly, there wasn;t a lot of blood and the guy was alert and responding, to the point where he insisted on my mate's friend taking a photograph of my mate holding him together! :shock:

Apart from the cut to the abdomen, amazingly no further injury except for a bruised pancreas, apparently. Not at all the way I'd like to win a helicopter ride. :(

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby biker jk » Sun Mar 13, 2016 7:31 pm

I forget to mention that there was an unmarked police 4WD stopped at the scene of the rider's crash heading downhill towards Illawong Bay. The policeman was standing at the prior corner waving to slow riders and warn of the crash. Interesting to know if the unmarked police 4WD was looking for cyclists breaking the law or car/motorcycle hoons?

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby Spaniel » Sun Mar 13, 2016 7:45 pm

trailgumby wrote:That last corner catches a LOT of riders out. I hear more stories than I'd like about that section of road.

The weekend before last my mate encountered a guy down and they stopped to render help. The guy wasn't good, but he said "I'm not as bad as my mate." It was at that point they found a guy on the other side of the fence trying to keep his insides in.

He had cut himself open sliding along on the top of the Armco fencing. :x My mate rendered first aid, keeping him on his back and applying pressure to stem the bleeding. Surprisingly, there wasn;t a lot of blood and the guy was alert and responding, to the point where he insisted on my mate's friend taking a photograph of my mate holding him together! :shock:

Apart from the cut to the abdomen, amazingly no further injury except for a bruised pancreas, apparently. Not at all the way I'd like to win a helicopter ride. :(


Crikey! I've sometimes wondered what coming off onto that common type of fencing might do to me, now I have an extra incentive to stay upright.

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Re: Northern Beaches - Manly, Akuna, Westhead, Palm Beach

Postby Warin » Sun Mar 13, 2016 11:45 pm

Spaniel wrote:
trailgumby wrote:Crikey! I've sometimes wondered what coming off onto that common type of fencing might do to me, now I have an extra incentive to stay upright.


Some motorcycle riders call that wire rope fencing "cheese cutters". All that fence/barricade stuff is for tinned mobile lounge rooms.

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