Floating Walkway being removed

Floating Walkway being removed

Postby beauyboy » Thu Apr 14, 2011 8:38 pm

I have noticed that the New Farm Floating walkway is being removed currently. That is to say what was left after the floods.

http://bayjournal.com.au/joomla/bayjour ... pears.html

The above link confirms that the walkway is being dismountled.

Now the Big Question is when will the new Link Start to be constructed?

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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby notwal » Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:55 pm

I seem to recall it was given a low priority. The inference was that it may not be replaced at all.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby nitramluap » Fri Apr 15, 2011 4:03 pm

notwal wrote:I seem to recall it was given a low priority. The inference was that it may not be replaced at all.


Not true, apparently. This from a recent interview with Julian Simmonds by this user on Twitter:
https://twitter.com/#!/taezar/status/57582248970555392

@Taezar
"Best news from this morning's meeting? #riverwalk up (sic - typo 'to') be under construction before year's end. #citycycle"

I'd suggest everyone writes a letter to Mr Simmonds to clarify...
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby master6 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 6:28 pm

beauyboy wrote:Now the Big Question is when will the new Link Start to be constructed?



My BCC rates notice hopes this thing is never replaced. The constant repair costs were a joke. A very expensive joke.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby nitramluap » Wed Apr 20, 2011 6:35 pm

master6 wrote:
beauyboy wrote:Now the Big Question is when will the new Link Start to be constructed?



My BCC rates notice hopes this thing is never replaced. The constant repair costs were a joke. A very expensive joke.


You do realise that it can be replaced by a much more sensible NON floating bikeway don't you? Something similar to what connects North Quay to Bicentennial Bikeway.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby master6 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 7:04 pm

nitramluap wrote:
master6 wrote:
beauyboy wrote:Now the Big Question is when will the new Link Start to be constructed?



My BCC rates notice hopes this thing is never replaced. The constant repair costs were a joke. A very expensive joke.


You do realise that it can be replaced by a much more sensible NON floating bikeway don't you? Something similar to what connects North Quay to Bicentennial Bikeway.


With belt tightening required all around Australia, including areas of very essential services, this is an item I can live without. Happy to ride over Story Bridge and around the streets with bike lanes to get from western suburbs to Nundah.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby nitramluap » Wed Apr 20, 2011 7:15 pm

master6 wrote:With belt tightening required all around Australia, including areas of very essential services, this is an item I can live without. Happy to ride over Story Bridge and around the streets with bike lanes to get from western suburbs to Nundah.


I know plenty of people who live in the CBD & New Farm/Teneriffe/Newstead who think that it is a very important piece of infrastructure. CityCycle use has dropped dramatically since the loss of Riverwalk, as have many cycle & walking trips to to/from the CBD.

When they stop expanding freeways and digging tunnels then I'm happy for them to take money from public & active transport infrastructure. Given that they are not, I think it is disgusting they're saving money by canning small, yet significant, projects while the big, expensive white elephants lumber onwards....
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby master6 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 9:00 pm

nitramluap wrote:
When they stop expanding freeways and digging tunnels then I'm happy for them to take money from public & active transport infrastructure. Given that they are not, I think it is disgusting they're saving money by canning small, yet significant, projects while the big, expensive white elephants lumber onwards....


There is already a cycle safe alternative route to the destinations that were also served by this money eating engineering disaster. Having it wash away in a flood is probably a blessing.
It was not a white elephant, but it was a very hungry elephant.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby nitramluap » Thu Apr 21, 2011 6:24 am

master6 wrote:
nitramluap wrote:
When they stop expanding freeways and digging tunnels then I'm happy for them to take money from public & active transport infrastructure. Given that they are not, I think it is disgusting they're saving money by canning small, yet significant, projects while the big, expensive white elephants lumber onwards....


There is already a cycle safe alternative route to the destinations that were also served by this money eating engineering disaster. Having it wash away in a flood is probably a blessing.
It was not a white elephant, but it was a very hungry elephant.


I'm not arguing that it wasn't a money pit - I agree that a floating walk/bikeway is and was a complete waste of money. The raised bikeway that joins North Quay and the Bicentennial Bikeway is a different beast. It was submerged in the floods and wasn't damaged at all. In terms of return on investment, it dwarfs a road tunnel.

Many people are not willing to ride on the roads with the cars on the alternate route - I don't blame them, nor are they happy with some of the hills (particularly Ivory St). If the route is not safe enough for an unaccompanied 8 year old or an old person to ride a bicycle, it's not good enough. Cycling isn't just about middle aged males on carbon road bikes who are 'brave'... (despite actually fitting into that category myself, I see the bigger picture).

I'm far more interested in doing everything we can to make cycling a popular form of transport given that 50% of car trips in Brisbane are less than 5km and 70% less than 10km. Anything which gives the impression that Government doesn't care for cycling as a form of transport - like failing to rebuild/replace damaged infrastructure - is a slap in the face for this.

As for the 'private pontoons'... don't get me started. As far as I'm concerned they can take their 'pleasure craft' by trailer to the nearest boat ramp. So many poorly built pontoons ended up causing lots of damage (and blocking drainage) in the recent floods. Most CityCat terminals by contrast barely budged (despite heavy damage).

The pontoons could be located on the river side of the bikeway with residents having access via the bikeway.

This claiming of public space (ie. river) for private amenity at the expense of everyone else is precisely why there is no similar bikeway along the river between Toowong and the University of Queensland. All the old people in their highrises objected strongly to council for 'security reasons'. The irony is that it would improve security to have a constant flow of bicycles along that route instead of through the hilly, narrow back streets...
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby Comedian » Thu Apr 21, 2011 7:53 am

Well I think it's tragic that it's gone. I don't doubt it's construction method was silly and expensive to maintain - but It needs to be replaced. I could ride with my family all the way from the gardens through to new farm in the kind of safety that you just can't do on on-road bike paths. It's asking for trouble to let young kids use these so dedicated bikeways are the only way to go.

If we want kids to grow up knowing bikes this type of thing needs to be done. If we just want to build ever bigger traffic jams then spending billions after billions on roads and tunnels etc is what we need and thats the way we're going.
Once you can climb hills on a bike it's all downhill. :mrgreen:

Hopefully I'll know what that's like..... one day. :shock: :lol:

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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby nitramluap » Thu Apr 21, 2011 8:21 am

Comedian wrote:Well I think it's tragic that it's gone. I don't doubt it's construction method was silly and expensive to maintain - but It needs to be replaced. I could ride with my family all the way from the gardens through to new farm in the kind of safety that you just can't do on on-road bike paths. It's asking for trouble to let young kids use these so dedicated bikeways are the only way to go.

If we want kids to grow up knowing bikes this type of thing needs to be done. If we just want to build ever bigger traffic jams then spending billions after billions on roads and tunnels etc is what we need and thats the way we're going.


Well said, Comedian.

The people I'm most interested in hearing from are those people that currently don't or rarely cycle. Riverwalk is very important to this group and for that reason it should be replaced - but not with something that floats...
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby Oxford » Thu Apr 21, 2011 8:49 am

nitramluap wrote:
Comedian wrote:Well I think it's tragic that it's gone. I don't doubt it's construction method was silly and expensive to maintain - but It needs to be replaced. I could ride with my family all the way from the gardens through to new farm in the kind of safety that you just can't do on on-road bike paths. It's asking for trouble to let young kids use these so dedicated bikeways are the only way to go.

If we want kids to grow up knowing bikes this type of thing needs to be done. If we just want to build ever bigger traffic jams then spending billions after billions on roads and tunnels etc is what we need and thats the way we're going.


Well said, Comedian.

The people I'm most interested in hearing from are those people that currently don't or rarely cycle. Riverwalk is very important to this group and for that reason it should be replaced - but not with something that floats...

they should build a tunnel, under the water. like underwater world has, without the moving part.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby master6 » Thu Apr 21, 2011 8:51 am

nitramluap wrote:
Many people are not willing to ride on the roads with the cars on the alternate route - I don't blame them, nor are they happy with some of the hills (particularly Ivory St). If the route is not safe enough for an unaccompanied 8 year old or an old person to ride a bicycle, it's not good enough. Cycling isn't just about middle aged males on carbon road bikes who are 'brave'... (despite actually fitting into that category myself, I see the bigger picture).


The Kangaroo Point Cliffs, Story Bridge, Bowen Tce, and Moray St cycling facilities provide a good alternative to the Floating Site, and with much less cost. I dont think that we should have "unaccompanied 8 year old " cyclists out of sight of their own front gate, and I reckon a lot of the "old person" brigade would prefer a bit more emphasis on the Health System.
As a cyclist, I see many more areas where we could get more bang for our bucks than this expensive idea could deliver.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby nitramluap » Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:13 am

master6 wrote:I dont think that we should have "unaccompanied 8 year old " cyclists out of sight of their own front gate


And that is a big part of what's wrong with our society...

We have never been safer. Crime has never been lower. Yet we behave as though the world has never been more dangerous (and we're told so on the news every night). Helicopter parenting; bubble-wrapping everyone with 'safety gear' and so on - none of which have been responsible for the improvement.

I recently road up Bowen Terrace the other day - a journey I would have taken on the Riverwalk - and I was almost T-boned by two cars pulling out of driveways (blinded by all the on-street parking) and I was riding in the MIDDLE of the road. Then I was forced into parked cars by a passing bus... yeah, really safe.

I still stand by what I say. I'm not interested in 'cyclists' per se, I'm interested in people using bicycles to get from A to B safely and those that would like to but don't - as they don't feel safe. The popularity of the separated bikeways are obvious - look at how much busier they are compared to the alternative routes. People WANT to ride far from motorised traffic.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby elantra » Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:18 am

nitramluap wrote:This claiming of public space (ie. river) for private amenity at the expense of everyone else is precisely why there is no similar bikeway along the river between Toowong and the University of Queensland. All the old people in their highrises objected strongly to council for 'security reasons'. The irony is that it would improve security to have a constant flow of bicycles along that route instead of through the hilly, narrow back streets...


The so-called bicycle "route" from Toowong to St Lucia campus is a total dog's breakfast.

It is a poor reflection on local government and also on the University of Queensland, which should have been negotiating with council to have a decent bicycle route to this campus.

What amazes me is why Council have spent so much money on CityCycle when there is little decent infrastructure to support it. :cry:
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby master6 » Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:25 am

nitramluap wrote: those that would like to but don't - as they don't feel safe.


The people who would like to, but dont, probably dont feel safe in their own back yard. Just because one or other area does not meet an individuals safety requirements does not wash as a reason for not cycling in the magnificent cycling facilities of Brisbane.
These people will always have an excuse...............................excuses are a dime a dozen. If you want to ride, ride where you do feel safe.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby nitramluap » Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:43 am

elantra wrote:The so-called bicycle "route" from Toowong to St Lucia campus is a total dog's breakfast.


Totally agree. It is one of many reasons why not many students cycle to the University. From the end of the Bicentennial Bikeway at the Regatta, all the way to Macquarie Street, it is a joke - particularly around the junction of Toowong & St Lucia.

elantra wrote:It is a poor reflection on local government and also on the University of Queensland, which should have been negotiating with council to have a decent bicycle route to this campus.


My guess is that the University makes a LOT of money from providing car parking. A great shame. They should be leading the way, not falling into the same traps. Sir Fred Schonell drive is full most mornings with single occupant cars heading to the University... many of them P platers.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby elantra » Thu Apr 21, 2011 11:56 am

nitramluap wrote:
elantra wrote:The so-called bicycle "route" from Toowong to St Lucia campus is a total dog's breakfast.


Totally agree. It is one of many reasons why not many students cycle to the University. From the end of the Bicentennial Bikeway at the Regatta, all the way to Macquarie Street, it is a joke - particularly around the junction of Toowong & St Lucia.

elantra wrote:It is a poor reflection on local government and also on the University of Queensland, which should have been negotiating with council to have a decent bicycle route to this campus.


My guess is that the University makes a LOT of money from providing car parking. A great shame. They should be leading the way, not falling into the same traps. Sir Fred Schonell drive is full most mornings with single occupant cars heading to the University... many of them P platers.


Not sure if UQ really does make any profit from their car-parking, those parking stations would be expensive to build and operate.

But the parking stations are really ugly and it is a great shame that not many of those pimply-faced teenagers commute by bicycle.
Back in the good ol days they hitched lifts and travelled on bikes and in overloaded old cars.
Now they think they are too precious and important to ride a mere bicycle.

That will have to wait till later in life when the reality dawns that cars and traffic jams is boring.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby beauyboy » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:09 am

OK it amazes me that we are debating weather or not a new link should be built along the river to replace the Floating Walkway. As a Architectural Drafter even I could se that the Floating idea was a stupid one, That is why in any thing and I mean anything I have only said link when it comes to replacing the link.

I have lived in New Farm for over 5 years and I have worked (now my part time job) in New Farm for close to 8 years. In that time car usage has dropped, and with that bicycle and PT usage has gone up. This is due the introduction of 199BUZ (soon to be complemented with the 196BUZ), Citcats now running every 12.5 minutes during the daylight hours and the Floating Walkway.

What did the Floating Walkway Offer. A safe & fast Link between the New Farm in that time I saw very group of person riding along it from 5 year olds up to 70 year olds. The older people of new Farm really did use it on there 'Townie" bikes for one simple reason they were safe. Lets Face Facts when you are near 70 or over bones get brittle and the potential of breaking one is very dangerous. Ladies used the Floating Walkway to ride between the City and New Farm. If there is generally one difference it's the uneven number of boys compared with girls on bikes, this did generally not exist with the floating walkway in existance. Now the one that matters the Most my spouse has point blank refused to ride to the city now because he does not feel safe riding up Moray, Bowen or any of the other roads to get to the city. Also lets not forget the number of pedestrians that used this link to get to and from the city. In the last censis 5% of New Farm people road to work more than any other suburb (if memory serves me rigth)

The decline since it closed/ washed away. Since it was washed away in the floods I have sean a marked decline in the number of bicycles and pedestrians going to and from the city. First of all, all those groups that we generally don't include as cyclist have stopped riding. There are idiots out there that run stop signs or put out from driveways without looking. The inclines of Bowen terrace and Ivory Lane scare all but the bravest cyclist from riding to and from.

Financial. There is no doubt that the Floating walkway was a finacial drain on BCC and was poorly designed and constructed. Honestly a Shared Path on what was to basicly an ACTIVE TRANSPORT ARTIRIAL. That said it was carring around 2000 pedestrian and bicycle movements a day (including weekends) that is equal to about 50 bus services. Now if I have my figures correct the even if all those buses were completely full the service would only break even. so
2000 x $3.11 (2 zone travel) = $6220
$6220 x 365 = $2 270 300
So that is roughtly over $2 million dollars in savings to the New Farm public and the Government in direct transport savings a year.

The NEW LINK. I honetly think the new link should be just like the Bicentenial Bikeway Viaduct with it being wide and segragated. Floating is just asking for maintance and other issues

IN Short
* Floating walkway helped change the travel Habits of New Farm people
* The Floating Walkway was a Transport corridor not a toy as some people like to make out
* On road faclities are no replacement for it with only the steriotype cyclist continuing to ride.
* The fiancial side does point to a replacement being viable

What really disappoints me is that I would never agrue against anyother suburb recieving a high quality active corridor just because of cost.

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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby nitramluap » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:36 am

Donald,

Thank you!

I agree with every word you say - much of it is what I've said in recent posts. I'm not a New Farm resident; I occasionally used Riverwalk but when I did I noticed everything you have - young & old, more women, slower cycling, happy cycling... I'm also 'brave' enough to be able to cycle on the alternate road route without much problem... but it is not about "me" at all; most people don't understand that.

I see it as a vital link which needs replacing - but clearly not with a floating version - as fun as that was when CityCats when past :mrgreen:

I'm happy to go into bat for any suburb that is in dire need of decent bicycle infrastructure (next stop, northern suburbs? :wink: ).

Cheers,

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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby beauyboy » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:06 am

Yes thankyou for your pass supporting posts. I have just asked my spouse about the number of people traveling on bowen terrace where the park is and he says there has been no increase. Therefore people must be not using active transport that use to use the Floating Walkway

Oh yes the Northside is a whole can of worms that needs it's own thread.

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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby ZepinAtor » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:27 am

beauyboy wrote:


A safe & fast Link between the New Farm in that time I saw very group of person riding along it from 5 year olds up to 70 year olds. The older people of new Farm really did use it on there 'Townie" bikes for one simple reason they were safe.

That said it was carring around 2000 pedestrian and bicycle movements a day (including weekends)

Donald


Good statistics, thanks Donald. I wouldn't have had any idea of actual numbers, but it's interesting to see the facts. (or at least a ball park figure). I'm guessing there would have been a number of "clip board people" counting away at some time or one of those secret hidden electronic boxes with a built in sensor which I've noticed chained to a tree in Brisbane Forest Park. (yes seriously)

A good friend owns & runs Bushranger bicycle tours which has a varied cliental from serious MTB enthusiasts participating in 10 day tours of NZ to 60 + beginner groups. John often used the New Farm link (floating pathway) to escort total beginners of all ages to Southbank for a coffee or visit the Goma art gallery. This has obviously since declined due to the floating pathway----well floating away.

Such a pity. Lets hope for a sensible replacement. Maybe good old "Can Do Campbell" will instigate something if the votes go in his favour. But please not a tunnel as you could imagine having issues not from vehicle exhaust fumes, but human exhaust.

The few times I've used the pathway I noticed it had a huge pedestrian population of all ages including joggers who to be quite honest would prefer a nice flat, wide pathway than a twisting hilly road any day.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby Zynster » Fri Apr 22, 2011 9:05 am

beauyboy wrote: Therefore people must be not using active transport that use to use the Floating Walkway


I guess I'm a case here. After years of commuting on my bicycle from West End to the city, I recently changed jobs and now work in the Valley. My first few attempts to commute there on bicycle were so scary, I now commute on my motorbike.
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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby Comedian » Fri Apr 22, 2011 9:13 am

Well said Donald!
Once you can climb hills on a bike it's all downhill. :mrgreen:

Hopefully I'll know what that's like..... one day. :shock: :lol:

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Re: Floating Walkway being removed

Postby master6 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 1:01 pm

There seems to be a wide spread desire for "flat" facilities in many of the posts here. I dont understand this, as the earth is not flat, and Brisbane is far from flat. Today people have bicycles with more gears than a Mack truck, and low gears that would enable them to consider towing a Mack truck. Are we encouraging the development of a group of limp wristed people who want exercise without sweat, effort, or the occasional deep breathing? Golly, I dont want to spoil my makeup! :D :D
Apart from the exercise benefit of some uphill work, there is the reward and thrill of the resulting descent.
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