Doublegee and Blue Goo

Inspectorgadget
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Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Inspectorgadget » Thu Dec 21, 2017 4:02 pm

I found a couple of references to doublegee in the search but I thought there should be more. It seems to be a West Australian problem and imported from South Africa.

I had an electric Fatbike that got a puncture from a doublegee the first time I rode it. I then put in the blue stuff and 450k and six months later no more punctures in spite of pulling out a few dozen doublegee from it. Once I pulled one out and I could see it ooze then seal.

Now I just bought myself a nice Scott eAspect 720 mountain bike. I had it for one hour on Sunday when I was riding through Yellagonga and yup, doublegee puncture.

A word for BikeForce in Woodvale. Travis the owner picked me and the bike up, fixed the puncture without charge. They are ordering thorn resistant tubes with the goo already in them as they use those Presta valves. Wonderful service anyway.

Strangely enough he was just demonstrating to me puncturing a road tyre with a drawing pin full of the blue goo, no air lost, instant seal.

Not everyone is convinced it is the way to go.

What do you guys think of this solution?

I'm green as grass really but I do love this Bosch drive bike. Very efficient too.

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Grev » Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:51 am

There are two species which look very similar to the untrained eye. One is doublegee (with a wide range of alternative names) the other is caltrop. The Main Roads or the local shire should (are required by law?) to spray for caltrop is notified. Caltrop season is however Jan/Feb. I have always found it easiest to remove the small plants myself before they develop barbs.

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Aushiker » Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:00 pm

I have tried goo in the past in my tubes and quickly gave up on it. Now days two of my bikes [fatbike and roadie] are tubeless so I run Orange or Stans sealant in them. So far so good [touch wood].
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby HappyHumber » Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:04 pm

Yeah... seems to be a bit of confusion between even us ' local lifers ' as to what each name sometimes refers to. But generally the hard, very spikey ones are the "prickles" (the catch all term I used as a kid) to watch for as far tyres go. Bindy-eyes were/are just the little scratchy ones that stuck like to velcro to your socks or school jumper in my mind.

I've used a few different tube sealants and just beginning in the world of tubeless; insofar as I am aware they all manage to dry out after a while (depending on storage conditions and a few other factors) within the tyre and lose their effectiveness. Sealant isn't a permanent solution.
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Aushiker » Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:18 pm

HappyHumber wrote:I've used a few different tube sealants and just beginning in the world of tubeless; insofar as I am aware they all manage to dry out after a while (depending on storage conditions and a few other factors) within the tyre and lose their effectiveness. Sealant isn't a permanent solution.


Both Orange and Stans need replacing around every three months. I just use the change of seasons as a reminder to do the quick change.
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby HappyHumber » Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:33 pm

Yeah, it really comes downto a trade off of convenience in one regard vs. inconvenience in another. I was getting a couple of years out of generic Auto-shop tube sealant (roughly half the price of 'bike specific' tube stuff by volume) but it also meant learning a new technique of getting the stuff in there/refershing it and also adjusting my technoque to checking pressures. I was generally only using the tube sealant for the runabout or hack bikes with shcrader valves. The convenience in the end was negligble for those bikes.

Maybe once I get to use the tubeless set up a litle more I can comment further; but the funds being what they are at the moment; the idea of having spend money on a bottle of bike specific goop every few months isn't that attractive - though I see there are some home brew recipes around which may mitigate the expense.
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Inspectorgadget
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Inspectorgadget » Tue Dec 26, 2017 9:50 am

I am still undecided on this. Frankly I am afraid to take my nice Scott e-aspect off the road until I get the right presto valve tubes with goo in them. I never realised that filling them wasn’t possible. I am running Tough Tom tyres with synchro 27.5 inch rims. The bike weighs 20.5kg already being electric.

I can buy continental gator tyres or Schwalbe marathon tyres which have high puncture resistance it not sur about effect on ride.

I can’t ask the impossible but a Tyre has to be doublegee proof at least. There must be a good solution. My bike shop has chosen one but would there be better choices without sealant that people have experience with,

I find it positively deflating to think a simple shortcut down a path off road can result in such a high probability of a punctured Tyre. Should I stop being a princess and just carry a puncture repair kit and get used to using it?

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby brumby33 » Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:44 am

I reckon you should give the Schwalbe Marathon Plus a go....they have a 5mm silicon band under the tread as apposed to the standard Marathons which have only 3mm. Not much I know but could mean a difference as punctures are concerned. I've run them on both the Vivente bikes I've owned and so far (touch wood) no flats.

As for slowness, some say they arn't a fast tyre but I can't really compare plus i'm slow anyway :lol: but on an electric bike, I doubt you'll ever notice. On my last Vivente touring bike I originally had 700 x 35's on it but changed to 700 x 38's Schwalbe plus and it gave me a much nicer ride comfort wise. My newer Vivente Patagonia came with 700 x 32 on the front and 700 x 35's on the back and they are only the Marathons, but i'll put another set of of Marathon plus 38's again when funds allow. Marathon plus is also designed for long distance wear so you'll get your money's worth as they're not exactly cheap.

Cheers

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Aushiker » Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:58 am

Inspectorgadget wrote:I never realised that filling them wasn’t possible.


You can get tubes with removable valves which makes them refillable.
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Inspectorgadget » Tue Dec 26, 2017 1:46 pm

Aushiker wrote:
Inspectorgadget wrote:I never realised that filling them wasn’t possible.


You can get tubes with removable valves which makes them refillable.


The bike has presta valves. I assumed the valves are incorporated into the tube when made?

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Inspectorgadget » Tue Dec 26, 2017 1:51 pm

brumby33 wrote:I reckon you should give the Schwalbe Marathon Plus a go....they have a 5mm silicon band under the tread as apposed to the standard Marathons which have only 3mm. Not much I know but could mean a difference as punctures are concerned. I've run them on both the Vivente bikes I've owned and so far (touch wood) no flats.


They sound good. They did quote a puncture resistant continental to me but I didn't take note of the details. He did say they were expensive at $100 each. Yes, that is very expensive for a bicycle tyre.

There is also the tubeless tyres but the issues with punctures would be similar. They are easier to fill with sealant. I'm not sure if they are compatible with my rims though.

I appreciate you taking the time to offer your advice. One thing for sure I had visions of taking my nice new bike all over the place off road and I still want to do that so possibly a much tougher tyre is the answer.

These tubes I am getting are thorn resistant and so a mm or so thicker at least and wit the goo in them. Chances are the bike shop advice is sound but we'll see. I have to wait until after the New Year to get them.

Grant

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby brumby33 » Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:03 pm

I'm not too positive with tubeless at this stage on a bicycle primarily due to the fact that the spokes still go into the rim...on a Motorcycle, most tubeless tyres are on bikes that have alloy wheels so you can assure a decent seal around the rim unless you bang it hard but i've seen some roughly treated wheels on the Suzuki V-Stroms to know that it still takes a bit of beating to lose that seal. On Bikes like the BMW GS adventure series who run tubeless on spoked wheels (as do the newer V-Strom XT series) you'll find that the spokes actually are fixed into a flange on the rim and the spokes don't go into the rim itself so it provides a good seal. Cruiser type Motorcycle like Harleys and the Japanese variants that use spoked wheels still run tubed tyres as their seal isn't good at the spoke entry.

There will come a time where it'll be common for bicycles to go tubeless but untill that happens....tubes all the way :) and they arn't that expensive really!!

Cheers

brumby33
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Inspectorgadget
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Inspectorgadget » Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:48 pm

There will come a time where it'll be common for bicycles to go tubeless but untill that happens....tubes all the way and they arn't that expensive really!!


I still have my E-Go Fat Bike which I need to sell. I mind take it down a few track in the park and see if I can find the offending path with the doublegee.

The Fat Bike is actually pretty cool and the rear hub works well. The Bosch though is incredibly sophisticated and efficient and there is a lot less friction from the wheels as well.

I have had a lot of fun on both bikes now. I just did 25k around lake Joondalup, averaging 21kph. Good day for it.

Grant

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby bychosis » Tue Dec 26, 2017 6:16 pm

brumby33 wrote:There will come a time where it'll be common for bicycles to go tubeless but untill that happens....tubes all the way :) and they arn't that expensive really!

It is already common for bicycles to go tubeless. MTB riders have been doing it for years, and it’s mot that expensive or difficult. Rim tape, tubeless valve, rims and tyres are all readily available. My new bike arrived tubeless ready. I hadn’t converted it, but copped a pinch flat that out two 15mm cuts in the tube and the tyre remained inflated for several more kms without any sealant. The bead stayed in place, the tyre held its air but probably leaked out around the valve hole slowly until it went flat. I still had to break the bead to remove the tube despite riding on it for maybe 30m after it finally went flat.

I fitted tubeless to that wheel this afternoon with a track pump and no sealant and it inflated easily, unlike the ghetto tubeless conversion I ran previously which required sealant, compressor and a lot of patience.
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Inspectorgadget » Thu Dec 28, 2017 5:10 pm

The Schwalbe Marathon Plus look like good tyres but I don't know where you would get them in Australia. Maxxis seem much more popular.

It seems the best strategy is just to get the best level of puncture resistance possible in the tyre even if that means a bit more weight and rigidity although in my electric bike it is probably not an issue.

This is expensive though so the obvious strategy is maybe to wear out the Schwalbe NOT SO Tough Toms first with the thicker tubes and sealant already in it.

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby John Lewis » Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:35 pm

Inspectorgadget wrote:
Aushiker wrote:
Inspectorgadget wrote:I never realised that filling them wasn’t possible.


You can get tubes with removable valves which makes them refillable.


The bike has presta valves. I assumed the valves are incorporated into the tube when made?


I have presta valve tubes on my Velo. The cores are removable so that the goo can be put into them without much trouble.
I believe not all presta valves have removable cores. These are Swalbe tubes

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby brumby33 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 9:10 am

Inspectorgadget wrote:The Schwalbe Marathon Plus look like good tyres but I don't know where you would get them in Australia. Maxxis seem much more popular.

It seems the best strategy is just to get the best level of puncture resistance possible in the tyre even if that means a bit more weight and rigidity although in my electric bike it is probably not an issue.

This is expensive though so the obvious strategy is maybe to wear out the Schwalbe NOT SO Tough Toms first with the thicker tubes and sealant already in it.


It seems they have changed the naming on the shwalbe range of touring tyres and I can't find the Schwalbe Plus anymore however this seems to be it's equivelent...these are pretty much the same size as I had on my previous Vivente touring bike and will be the ones I replace the present tyres on my new Vivente.
http://www.99bikes.com.au/tyre-schwalbe ... ard-reflex

the 99 bikes stores are a growing business with stores in just about every major City in Australia and they will home deliver...you may have to join their club for $5 to get the discounts.

But just about any bike shop can get them in for you...I got my last set from Metro cycles in newcastle who are a touring , e-bike and cargo bike specialist....the same as Omafiets in Redfern Sydney pretty much.
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Aushiker » Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:28 pm

Andrew
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rifraf
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby rifraf » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:00 pm

The last few rides I did around Yanchep I ended up flatted thanks to thorns.
I'm currently trailing a ghetto tubeless set up on my front wheel which seems to have worked well enough for me to think its time I did the rear.

I have found irregular riding sees the pressure going down somewhat but I guess that means the innards needs regular refreshing of latex via the wheels rotating.

Andrew, I'm guessing after three months the stans solidifies and needs digging out before refreshment?
Last edited by rifraf on Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Trevtassie » Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:32 am

Double gees have the spines that break off and work their way into your tyres. So you pretty well want to pick them out or they ruin the tyre if you get enough of them. I even ruined a set of 4wd tyres working in farm paddocks.
I've had good results from the green car sealants with double gees, when I lived in Kalgoorlie I'd go out riding to places like Kookynie and get 20 or 30 at a time, with no issues other than picking them out afterwards.

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Re: Doublegee and Blue Goo

Postby Baalzamon » Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:49 am

rifraf wrote:The last few rides I did around Yanchep I ended up flatted thanks to thorns.
I'm currently trailing a ghetto tubeless set up on my front wheel which seems to have worked well enough for me to think its time I did the rear.

I have found irregular riding sees the pressure going down somewhat but I guess that means the innards needs regular refreshing of latex via the wheels rotating.

Andrew, I'm guessing after three months the stans solidifies and needs digging out before refreshment?


Nah don't need to dig it out. It becomes a ball of latex so easy to scoop it out.
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