Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby rolandp » Fri May 22, 2009 12:59 am

City of Joondalup agenda 19th May 2009.

That Council ACCEPTS the Tender submitted by Downer EDI Works Pty Ltd for the Construction of a Dual Use Path Upgrade – West Coast Drive in accordance with the statement of requirements as specified in Tender 005/09 for the fixed lump sum of $2,650,336.51 (GST Exclusive) for completion of the works within eleven (11) weeks from issue of the letter of acceptance.


The West Coast Drive dual use path runs parallel with the Indian Ocean along West Coast Drive (also known as the Sunset Coast Tourist Drive) for 1.8 km. The path is in high demand for public recreation activities such as walking, running and cycling.
The City identified the upgrading of the path between Beach Road, Marmion and The Plaza, Sorrento as a priority initially in the 2006/2007 Capital Works programme. The 2008/2009 CITY OF JOONDALUP - AGENDA FOR MEETING OF COUNCIL - 19.05.2009 54
Capital Works programme included provision for the final design works and construction phase. Council considered the project at its meeting on 15 July 2008 (CJ131-07/08) and identified a number of issues to be addressed. Council subsequently approved a final design on 16 December 2008 (CJ278-12/08) which addressed these issues and provides an enhanced environment for all the users of this section of the coastal pathway.
The upgrade works include the construction of limestone retaining walls, upgrading of the dual use path and pathway lighting, installation of shade structures, balustrades, new beach accesses and street furniture.


Is it me, but doesn't this sound like a lot of money to upgrade a 1.8km dual-use path?

Fully support upgrading shared paths, but I travel on this path on a weekly basis and don't believe it is that bad, and there are worst areas that need to be considered including getting rid of the PSP in Whitfords which turns in to a road, back into a shared path, back into a road etc.
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by BNA » Fri May 22, 2009 1:25 am

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby Aushiker » Fri May 22, 2009 1:25 am

G'day

Would have to agree that the money could have been better spent elsewhere in the City.

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby ajh_ausnzcf » Fri May 22, 2009 3:31 am

Seems like all the upgrades are predominately for the pedestrian activity on that path. Unless they are expanding the path to the width of the road this work is for cycling at very low speeds, perhaps with small children. Pedestrian traffic was dense last Saturday morning.
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby rolandp » Fri May 22, 2009 8:27 am

Just used Google Maps to have a look at the area. I generally won't ride on this section due to the volume of other dual-use path traffic during the week coming home, my trips are on the week-end enjoying the sea-view.

Interestingly Google Map's reveals there is a 'Cyclist Dismount' sign that I don't recall seeing, so looks like we are meant to walk on some of this section.

Hopefully the upgrade does expand the width to cater for the volume of traffic.
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby Aushiker » Fri May 22, 2009 9:44 am

rolandp wrote:Interestingly Google Map's reveals there is a 'Cyclist Dismount' sign that I don't recall seeing, so looks like we are meant to walk on some of this section.


G'day

IIRC that was there for the work that was taking place on the path just to the north of the sign. You should see it in Google Street view.

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby moosterbounce » Fri May 22, 2009 5:01 pm

The upgrade works include the construction of limestone retaining walls, upgrading of the dual use path and pathway lighting, installation of shade structures, balustrades, new beach accesses and street furniture.

Nah - it isn't a lot of money to upgrade the path...and all the other stuff that goes with it :roll:
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby cavebear2 » Sat May 23, 2009 1:28 pm

Remembering that the East Perth to Maylands section of the PSP cost about $1,000 per metre to build in about 2000/2001/2002 :roll:
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby rolandp » Wed May 27, 2009 12:00 am

I know that all sites will be different, but if we use DPI 2008-09 PBN Grants as a guage, looks like the most expensive path to build is $32,500 for 220m red asphalt shared path. This works around $150,000 per Km, so based on these figures, the 1.8Km upgrade for the shared path will be around $270,000.

This leaves a lot of spare change out of $2.65M for the other items. Just my opinion.
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby rolandp » Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:52 pm

This work is just about finished. Small section left near the surf club to join up with the original path, and should be finished soon, at least from a dual-use perpective, though a couple of the 'look-outs' need to be finished.

Lots of path markings so everyone knows it is a dual-use path.

One concern is the location of bus signs, they seem to be further away from the curb (into the dual-use path), which I can't work out why this is the case (eg why they couldn't be located on the curb).

Has anyone ridden on it yet? The last time I was there on a bike was last week-end.
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby CycleSnail » Mon Oct 12, 2009 3:39 pm

I know that all sites will be different, but if we use DPI 2008-09 PBN Grants as a guage, looks like the most expensive path to build is $32,500 for 220m red asphalt shared path. This works around $150,000 per Km, so based on these figures, the 1.8Km upgrade for the shared path will be around $270,000.

This leaves a lot of spare change out of $2.65M for the other items. Just my opinion.


I noticed on the BTA blog on the 8th of October
http://www.bta-bulletin.blogspot.com/
that Geraldton is building 4 km of concrete bike paths for $272000, or about $68000 per km. I have been let to believe that MainRoads works of $1 mio per km (that is the $1000 per meter mentioned earlier in this thread).

For the $55 million that are earmarked for car parking at the train stations, part of the election promises, about 800 km of bike paths could be built.. :roll: . :evil:

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby rolandp » Tue Oct 13, 2009 12:43 am

Hi CycleSnail, found a copy of the City of Joondalup Bike Plan 2009 which indicates (see page 33), New concrete path, 2.5m width - $95 per linear m. Based on these costs, how many km’s of concrete paths can we get for the $55M?

The Bike Plan also indicates that the West Coast Drive Shared Path Upgrade is the only Infrastructure Work scheduled for 2009/10 for the City of Joondalup (see page 33). I feel a little cheated as this is only 1.8km of upgrade work, compared to 2010/11 schedule of works which is for around the same distance over lots of different areas, but only costing $350,000.

Also noticed that the estimates for the West Coast Drive Shared Path Upgrade was $4,250,000 (page 33 – there is a note about carry forwards, but can't work out what is carried forward). Given that the accepted tender for this work was around $2,650,000 (see my original posting which includes a link to this tender announcement), this means that there is a surplus of around $1,600,000 in the 2009/10 budgeted Bike Plan. At $95 per linear m, does this mean that the City of Joondalup will be able to build around 17Km’s of new concrete 2.5m width paths in 2009/10 ($1,600,000 / 1000 / 95 = around 17km)?

Can anyone see anything wrong with this logic?
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby CycleSnail » Tue Oct 13, 2009 3:08 pm

Thanks for the link to the Joondalup Bike plan.

What is interesting in reading a document like the Joondalup bike plan is that these local councils are doing an excellent job in promoting cycling and identifying both problems and solutions to get more people to cycle. In addition it seems to have taken only three months to get the first draft plan, and six months to get the final plan. Compare this to the PBN review which has been cooking for over two years, has not yet reached the first draft stage, and could well be out of date by the time it gets released.

At $95 per linear m, does this mean that the City of Joondalup will be able to build around 17Km’s of new concrete 2.5m width paths in 2009/10
.

So we have apparently costs per linear meter ranging from $65 (Geraldton), $95 (Joondalup) and $1000 (MainRoads WA). The mind boggles.



I get completely side tracked by trivia when I read these documents - for instance I am astonished at the comparatively low volume of accidents involving bicycles on the heavy usage PSP along the freeway (page 91)

Would have to agree that the money could have been better spent elsewhere in the City.


I am happy for any local authority that has a bike plan and spends money to improve cycling facilities ... :D

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby Aushiker » Wed Oct 14, 2009 11:50 am

rolandp wrote:One concern is the location of bus signs, they seem to be further away from the curb (into the dual-use path), which I can't work out why this is the case (eg why they couldn't be located on the curb).


Hi

Are you referring to the bus stop post or other signs? I saw a post this morning and see what you mean. I will report it as a hazard via MRD.

In reference to the costs, was the $95 for paths only or overall? I know that at least for some sections, they where repairing/replacing the drain pipes which would have added to the costs for sure.

It is looking nice along there and a lot better than before.

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby gdl_gdl » Wed Oct 14, 2009 10:28 pm

It is looking nice along there and a lot better than before.

I agree Andrew, I would say the work looks nearly complete although there was a service vehicle on the path when I rode home tonight. (I was on the road).

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby rolandp » Thu Oct 15, 2009 1:15 am

I was on the dual-use path at around 6:30pm this evening, and that service vechile was still there. The section north (near the surf club) is still not completed, but in fairness, I don't think they are scheduled to complete until the end of October so they look like they are still on schedule.

The bus stop post is shown below which I took this evening:
Image
I leaned the bike against the post to get this shot, and with one side of my handlebars being around 30cm, that post is sticking out at least that far from the side of the road. Note this is the second set of work-men in the area, so they must be pulling all stops to get it finished.

Andrew, I believe the $95 quoted in the COJ Bike Plan relates to work only associated with a dual-use path. In the case of the West Coast area upgrade, when you see that new stairs, covers, walls etc have been built which would made up the $2.65M tender for this work. I just hope that the CoJ doesn't turn around later and indicates that they provided $2.65M of cycling infrastructure in this area, as I personally can't see me riding my bike down those stairs to the beach. In particular, as this work is indicated in the CoJ Bike Plan, where as a large proportion of the expenditure was not on cycling infrastructure. 1.8km (which is the length of this development) at $95 per l m, is $171,000

I agree that the work has improved the area, however, with the number of people walking/running on this dual-use path, it is not the most practical design from a cyclist perspective, and would have a dedicated cyclist path on the road have been a better option? There would have been space as you can also see from the photo there is a strip in the middle of the road which could have been re-allocated to a dedicated cycle path, in my opinion.
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby wintal » Thu Oct 15, 2009 11:00 am

That bus stop sign is pretty bad. Also bad is that anyone _waiting_ at the bus stop has to stand in the middle of the bike lane.

I sometimes wonder what the designers of these things are thinking.... it's presumably their job yet they miss obvious usability issues. Maybe they just don't care.

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby CycleSnail » Thu Oct 15, 2009 11:07 am

I agree that the work has improved the area, however, with the number of people walking/running on this dual-use path, it is not the most practical design from a cyclist perspective, and would have a dedicated cyclist path on the road have been a better option? There would have been space as you can also see from the photo there is a strip in the middle of the road which could have been re-allocated to a dedicated cycle path, in my opinion.


That whole stretch should be one way for cars, and the other road lane should be bi-directional for cyclists. That would give the pedestrians all of the current dual-use path, justified by the number of people using that area.

We had discussion with MainRoads on this.

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby Aushiker » Thu Oct 15, 2009 12:01 pm

CycleSnail wrote:That whole stretch should be one way for cars, and the other road lane should be bi-directional for cyclists. That would give the pedestrians all of the current dual-use path, justified by the number of people using that area.


Hi

While I wouldn't say no to this, I find it rather amusing that it is considered so bad to ride on the road along this section from Scarborough through to Hilarys and beyond. As someone who ride this section regularly (up to eight times a week) and all on the the road I consider this one of the safer and better sections of my regular road riding. The speeds are relatively low, there is sufficient clearance for cyclists and traffic to co-exist for most of it and the few sections where trucks can be held up, one can normally get through quite quickly allowing them through.

While I have had one or two incidents on this section I have more incidents per hour ridden on other parts of my regular commutes than I do on this section. Curtin Avenue comes to mind and Curtin Avenue has a cycle lane!

Personally I stopped riding the DUP probably a year ago now because the road is far more convenient, i.e., much easier to ride with the traffic than pedestrians. Furthermore once the City of Stirling installs the gates, I suspect more cyclists will go to the road.

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby Thoglette » Thu Oct 15, 2009 1:12 pm

CycleSnail wrote:That whole stretch should be one way for cars, and the other road lane should be bi-directional for cyclists. That would give the pedestrians all of the current dual-use path, justified by the number of people using that area.

Aushiker wrote:While I wouldn't say no to this, I find it rather amusing that it is considered so bad to ride on the road along this section from Scarborough through to Hilarys and beyond.


+1 I only use the DUP when I'm with the kids and below 12kph (particularily Triggs to Hillarys).

I think we might have more success pushing the speed limit on this "tourist drive" down to 40kph

If it was one-way you'd get a lot of counter-current traffic in the 'burbs (it can be done) both from residents and the "tourist drivers". Which I wouldn't want to foist on the residents. It may be that I'm wrong - a one-way car route is an interesting idea

Which way did the discussions have it - northbound or southbound?
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby rolandp » Fri Oct 16, 2009 12:34 am

Aushiker wrote:Furthermore once the City of Stirling installs the gates, I suspect more cyclists will go to the road.

What gates, and where?

The reason I don't like riding on the road at this section is that the curb is a mother of a solid curb (hit it and you bounce off), and there are solid islands in the middle of the road, which makes motoring traffic impatient when they can't overtake you, or worse, overtake when there is no room to overtake. I ride West Coast Hway/Marmion Ave where there is a higher speed, but generally motoring traffic are able to overtake due to the dual lanes.

I do like the coast though due to the views.
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby Aushiker » Fri Oct 16, 2009 12:50 am

rolandp wrote:
Aushiker wrote:Furthermore once the City of Stirling installs the gates, I suspect more cyclists will go to the road.

What gates, and where?


Hi

See my blog posting on the topic, dated September 23, 2009.

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby gdl_gdl » Fri Oct 16, 2009 8:54 am

is that the curb is a mother of a solid curb (hit it and you bounce off)

I'm glad it's not just me Roland! I noticed the curb the other night on the new section! No room for error if a car passes you closer than it should.

Hopefully most of the sand / debris will now be fully removed so the full lane of the road is available again.

Cheers,

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby Aushiker » Fri Oct 16, 2009 12:42 pm

Hi

From the Mayor of Joondalup

Over the past three months, the City has been upgrading the 1.8km dual-use pathway along West Coast Drive from Beach Road to The Plaza.

The works are now complete subject to some minor upgrades that will be undertaken towards
the end of the year.

The pathway is now open and the City encourages residents to enjoy the upgraded path and share it courteously with other users.

The work has greatly enhanced what is a very popular destination for local residents and visitors to the City.

This path has always been very well utilised within the community as a passive recreation focal point for walking, running and cycling and the upgrade has beautified the path while ensuring better safety for pedestrians and cyclists and offer improved beach access.

Some of the upgrades include the construction of limestone retaining walls to allow the widening of the path and when finished later this year improved lighting, look-out points, and new beach accesses including steps and ramps along the coastline like the set of steps next to the Marmion Angling and Aquatic Club, will greatly assist the elderly and people with disabilities to access this popular stretch of beach.

We hope that you enjoy the improvements to the area and continue to appreciate our stunning coastline.

The construction was managed to absolutely minimize the impact on the adjacent coastal dunal
vegetation.

The City would like to thank all motorists, path users and residents for their cooperation during the construction works.

For further information about the project call the City on 9400 4211.


Source: Joondalup Voice Online - 15 October 2009

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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby redned » Mon Oct 19, 2009 12:53 pm

I have avoided this stretch while the works were being completed and rode it for the first time yesterday. Work has started on the Trigg gates at the northern end (by putting a post in the middle of the path!).

The solution at Trigg is to push the dual use path around the back of the cafe along the road-side of the car park, rejoining the current DUP at the southern limit of the car park and leaving the path between the cafe and the beach to pedestrians. There is no benefit to cyclists to contend with kids, surf boards, life savers, strollers, dogs (not always constrained), beach showers etc.
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Re: Joondalup accepts tender upgrade to West Coast Drive path

Postby Aushiker » Mon Oct 19, 2009 1:44 pm

redned wrote:I have avoided this stretch while the works were being completed and rode it for the first time yesterday. Work has started on the Trigg gates at the northern end (by putting a post in the middle of the path!).


According to Jon Offer from the City of Stirling (October 15, 2009) and I quote

The 'Stirling Gate' that will be installed at Trigg is underway and should be completed within a week. This does allow for an unimpeded 900mm gap and should be far less restrictive that any other form of gate or chicane and has been field tested. It is intended to provide compliance and enforcement of two elements: Firstly, the legal requirement for single file and secondly slowing down (on entry to an area of major conflict already covered by a 10kph speed limit in the Citys Local Laws).

When I went through this morning there was a similar pole to the one you saw, but at the southern end of the building and a barrier (one of those traffic barriers that get filled with water) in the centre area.

I wasn't aware of the City's Local Law or the 10 km/h speed limit and couldn't find such a document on the City of Stirling's website so have requested a copy. I don't recall any signage there suggesting a speed limit. Anyone else seen such signage?

The solution at Trigg is to push the dual use path around the back of the cafe along the road-side of the car park, rejoining the current DUP at the southern limit of the car park and leaving the path between the cafe and the beach to pedestrians. There is no benefit to cyclists to contend with kids, surf boards, life savers, strollers, dogs (not always constrained), beach showers etc.


Great minds think alike :) That was my thinking to and have always thought it was a dangerous alignment from the first time I rode it. In fact on my very first ride along here I actually thought I had missed a turn-off as this section surly couldn't be a shared path. I was wrong.

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