City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

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rolandp
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby rolandp » Mon Feb 15, 2016 10:45 pm

softy wrote:No no

I saw a red filter light for turning left and a green bicycle light and car light for going straight, yet three cars turned left across a cyclists from both lanes and he had to stop on a green light.

they broke the law flat out, they did it because they couldn't understand why they couldn't turn left. Bicycles don't count!

My advice is be super careful riding along Barrack street and keep ypur speed down.

The traffic lights including the bicycle light are visible on Google Maps Street View. My observation is when there is a green bicycle lantern, the arrow for left turn is red. When there is a green arrow for left turn, there will be a red bicycle lantern. The length of time there is a green bicycle lantern is significantly less than a green traffic light, so a number of cyclists are not using the cycle lane.

nachoman
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby nachoman » Fri Apr 08, 2016 11:43 am

Walking along Barrack St yesterday at 17:15 I saw a cyclist hit the pavement. He was riding north on Barrack St through the green light at St Georges Terrace when he clipped or swerved to avoid a group of pedestrians crossing Barrack St on the red light. No-one was hurt but the peds kept going and even started taunting and laughing at the cyclist who then hurled some abuse as he picked himself up.

방구 똥
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby 방구 똥 » Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:50 pm

This morning when turning left, there was a solid red man and a pedestrian started walking.
I need to give way to pedestrians even if it's a solid red man, right?

Scott_C
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby Scott_C » Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:17 pm

방구 똥 wrote:This morning when turning left, there was a solid red man and a pedestrian started walking.
I need to give way to pedestrians even if it's a solid red man, right?

Yep. The way the Road Rules are written turning vehicles (which includes bicycles) must give way to pedestrians crossing the street you are turning into, regardless of if the pedestrian is crossing against the lights.

As give way essentially means 'not collide with' I would think you would give way regardless of if you are legally required to or not. I don't think anyone on a bicycle wants to have a collision if they can avoid it.

방구 똥
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby 방구 똥 » Fri Apr 08, 2016 2:19 pm

Scott_C wrote:
방구 똥 wrote:This morning when turning left, there was a solid red man and a pedestrian started walking.
I need to give way to pedestrians even if it's a solid red man, right?

Yep. The way the Road Rules are written turning vehicles (which includes bicycles) must give way to pedestrians crossing the street you are turning into, regardless of if the pedestrian is crossing against the lights.

As give way essentially means 'not collide with' I would think you would give way regardless of if you are legally required to or not. I don't think anyone on a bicycle wants to have a collision if they can avoid it.


Yeah, I wouldn't want a collision! I just need to be extra careful when turning, watching for jaywalkers.

If the pedestrian is standing at the red man and not crossing (because it's a red man), then I don't need to give way (ie. rather than stop and wave the pedestrian on to cross against the red man)? I'm thinking of it like driving, if I am at a give way sign, and the car on the road I'm turning into is stopped, I can go.

nachoman
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby nachoman » Thu May 05, 2016 11:09 pm

I have noticed many times lately that scooters and motorbikes are also enjoying the new bicycle lanes and advanced stopping boxes on Barrack St

dmwill
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby dmwill » Sun May 08, 2016 1:05 pm

Anyone notice that since the old treasury building was refurbished and the bar, The Petition opened up, Taxis now use the Barrack Street bike lane to queue up.

Probably not much of an issue late at night, but early on a Friday evening would be a bit annoying.

SimoneF
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby SimoneF » Wed May 11, 2016 5:00 am

dmwill yes I have, actually was late at night Sunday ~ 10pm. They should park around the front on SG Tce, but problem is the people leaving spill out from exits facing Barrack St, it sucks and is probably a permanent thing unless it says 'absolutely no stopping' sign etc. but these 3rd world cab drivers don't follow rules, probably why they're still third world countries heh?

wellington_street
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby wellington_street » Wed May 11, 2016 11:18 am

Taxis have an exemption from 'No Stopping' zones under the CoP Parking Local Law, so unfortunately not a lot we can do, short of changing this law.

dmwill
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby dmwill » Wed May 11, 2016 1:25 pm

I'll just wait for Uber to take their jobs :P

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rolandp
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby rolandp » Wed May 11, 2016 10:12 pm

wellington_street wrote:Taxis have an exemption from 'No Stopping' zones under the CoP Parking Local Law, so unfortunately not a lot we can do, short of changing this law.

Are you sure?

From the cop parking local law:
A person must not stop or park a vehicle –
(a) in a no stopping area;
(b) at the side of a carriageway marked with a continuous yellow edged line;
(c) in an area of a carriageway signed or marked with a keep clear marking;
(d) in a bay marked “M/C” unless it is a motorcycle without a side;
(e) in a bus lane or bus way;
(f) in a transit lane;
(g) in a truck lane; or
(h) in a bicycle lane or on a bicycle path;
Unless, in the case of sub-clause 2(a)-(d) inclusive, the person is driving a public bus, or charter vehicle or a taxi and is immediately dropping off, or picking up passengers.

If in doubt, report to CoP these types of issues.

wellington_street
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby wellington_street » Thu May 12, 2016 11:03 am

rolandp wrote:
wellington_street wrote:Taxis have an exemption from 'No Stopping' zones under the CoP Parking Local Law, so unfortunately not a lot we can do, short of changing this law.

Are you sure?

From the cop parking local law:
A person must not stop or park a vehicle –
(a) in a no stopping area;
(b) at the side of a carriageway marked with a continuous yellow edged line;
(c) in an area of a carriageway signed or marked with a keep clear marking;
(d) in a bay marked “M/C” unless it is a motorcycle without a side;
(e) in a bus lane or bus way;
(f) in a transit lane;
(g) in a truck lane; or
(h) in a bicycle lane or on a bicycle path;
Unless, in the case of sub-clause 2(a)-(d) inclusive, the person is driving a public bus, or charter vehicle or a taxi and is immediately dropping off, or picking up passengers.

If in doubt, report to CoP these types of issues.


Sorry you're right, it's only an immediate drop off/pick up exemption, not to queue like a rank.

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mikedufty
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby mikedufty » Thu May 12, 2016 5:31 pm

I was surprised to find completed bike lanes on Barrack St when I rode through the city with my son a few weeks ago. Very nice and a big improvement on what the street used to be like.

softy
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby softy » Thu May 12, 2016 11:54 pm

mikedufty wrote:I was surprised to find completed bike lanes on Barrack St when I rode through the city with my son a few weeks ago. Very nice and a big improvement on what the street used to be like.


I am very surprised you like it, I have rode through the road a few times, and found I have to super concentrate, it would have to be one of the worst areas to ride for me. just to many things happening and too many things to run into. You have to watch cars drifting into the bike lane, people getting into and out of unparked cars, peds shooting out from the kerb, peds coming through the cars between intersections, peds walking in the bicycle lane, peds walking on red lights when you have green and vehicles stopped in the lane.

I am not sure what there is to like?

nachoman
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby nachoman » Fri May 13, 2016 10:57 am

Yeah you have to be prepared for anything.
Taxis dropping off passengers at red lights and opening their doors.
The CAT bus stopping in the bike lane to let off passengers even though their is no bus stop.
Taxis U-turning in front of you to get to the parking bay near Bar 138
The coach bus that parks opposite Stirling Gardens to let off what looks like FIFO workers

or horse t*rds in the bike lane thanks to WA Police:
Image

or a salmon cyclist, the passing police car showed no interest:
Image

or people stopping to pick up a takeway, here the police did indeed speak to them but issued no infringement:
Image

SimoneF
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby SimoneF » Sat May 14, 2016 2:32 am

Sheez, what hope have we got if the police don't comply........
Interesting pictures! Yeah CoP has got some road design issues absolutely.

I don't expect the majority of West Australians to respect any cycling infrastructure. If were heading to 3.5 million in Perth, then people have got to start consciously following rules otherwise, we'll all be hating on each other. Why build this infrastructure if it's going to be pissed (and literally crapped) over by commuters of all sorts.

I was riding on the Armadale Train PSP along Railway Parade (Welshpool Industrial area), so the road is still extremely wide, and saw aftermath of a car crash, so don't know what happened or if they actually crashed to a stop onto the bike path (thank heavens I wasn't riding on it when it happened!) but both their cars were parked perpendicular across the entire PSP. I couldn't help but think if they actually made a decision to "hey lets get them off the street and park em up onto the PSP no worries aye".
That sort of attitude....

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mikedufty
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby mikedufty » Mon May 16, 2016 4:53 pm

softy wrote:I am not sure what there is to like?

I liked the separated lane and the head start at the traffic lights.
All the negatives you mention seem to be attributes of the city centre in general and nothing to do with the bike lane. They were all there before the bike lane.

Previously you needed to be quite assertive with claiming lanes to ride through the city, OK for me, but not nice riding with kids.

My only use of the lane has been in the middle of the day on weekends with little traffic around.

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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby theenglishguy » Tue May 17, 2016 12:50 am

rolandp wrote:From the cop parking local law:
A person must not stop or park a vehicle –
(a) in a no stopping area;
(b) at the side of a carriageway marked with a continuous yellow edged line;
(c) in an area of a carriageway signed or marked with a keep clear marking;
(d) in a bay marked “M/C” unless it is a motorcycle without a side;
(e) in a bus lane or bus way;
(f) in a transit lane;
(g) in a truck lane; or
(h) in a bicycle lane or on a bicycle path;
Unless, in the case of sub-clause 2(a)-(d) inclusive, the person is driving a public bus, or charter vehicle or a taxi and is immediately dropping off, or picking up passengers.

If in doubt, report to CoP these types of issues.


Does anyone else find it crazy that taxis are allowed to drop people off in bike lanes? I've cycled down Barrack St a few times now and had a couple of taxis stop when I'm right behind them. It's dangerous and really puts me off using the lanes.

It's disappointing how bad these bike lanes are, especially considering how much money was spent on them. I still regularly see cyclists on the pavement - a clear sign they have failed. City of Perth need to get the help of the Town of Vincent when it comes to cycling infrastructure.

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rolandp
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby rolandp » Tue May 17, 2016 9:28 am

theenglishguy wrote:
rolandp wrote:From the cop parking local law:
A person must not stop or park a vehicle –
(a) in a no stopping area;
(b) at the side of a carriageway marked with a continuous yellow edged line;
(c) in an area of a carriageway signed or marked with a keep clear marking;
(d) in a bay marked “M/C” unless it is a motorcycle without a side;
(e) in a bus lane or bus way;
(f) in a transit lane;
(g) in a truck lane; or
(h) in a bicycle lane or on a bicycle path;
Unless, in the case of sub-clause 2(a)-(d) inclusive, the person is driving a public bus, or charter vehicle or a taxi and is immediately dropping off, or picking up passengers.

If in doubt, report to CoP these types of issues.


Does anyone else find it crazy that taxis are allowed to drop people off in bike lanes? I've cycled down Barrack St a few times now and had a couple of taxis stop when I'm right behind them. It's dangerous and really puts me off using the lanes.

It's disappointing how bad these bike lanes are, especially considering how much money was spent on them. I still regularly see cyclists on the pavement - a clear sign they have failed. City of Perth need to get the help of the Town of Vincent when it comes to cycling infrastructure.


Taxis are not allowed to stop or park in a bicycle lane.

Strip out the local law to the relevant section:
A person must not stop or park a vehicle -
(h) in a bicycle lane or on a bicycle path;


The last line that relates to taxis is not applicable to (h). Please correct me if I'm wrong.

wellington_street
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby wellington_street » Tue May 17, 2016 2:39 pm

Agree with you rolandp. Nice pickup.

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rolandp
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby rolandp » Tue May 17, 2016 9:07 pm

This one goes to the CoP Council tonight.

A 12m electronic billboard in the CBD may be approved on the condition the City of Perth is exempt from liability if it distracts drivers or pedestrians.

The sign on the corner of Murray and Barrack streets is a scaled-down version of a design the council rejected last year in part because of concerns about what it would look like.


Really, if you have to be exempt from liability, then perhaps it is not the right thing to approve to have installed in the CBD.

Sinner
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby Sinner » Wed May 18, 2016 2:34 pm

rolandp wrote:
theenglishguy wrote:
rolandp wrote:From the cop parking local law:
A person must not stop or park a vehicle –
(a) in a no stopping area;
(b) at the side of a carriageway marked with a continuous yellow edged line;
(c) in an area of a carriageway signed or marked with a keep clear marking;
(d) in a bay marked “M/C” unless it is a motorcycle without a side;
(e) in a bus lane or bus way;
(f) in a transit lane;
(g) in a truck lane; or
(h) in a bicycle lane or on a bicycle path;
Unless, in the case of sub-clause 2(a)-(d) inclusive, the person is driving a public bus, or charter vehicle or a taxi and is immediately dropping off, or picking up passengers.

If in doubt, report to CoP these types of issues.


Does anyone else find it crazy that taxis are allowed to drop people off in bike lanes? I've cycled down Barrack St a few times now and had a couple of taxis stop when I'm right behind them. It's dangerous and really puts me off using the lanes.

It's disappointing how bad these bike lanes are, especially considering how much money was spent on them. I still regularly see cyclists on the pavement - a clear sign they have failed. City of Perth need to get the help of the Town of Vincent when it comes to cycling infrastructure.


Taxis are not allowed to stop or park in a bicycle lane.

Strip out the local law to the relevant section:
A person must not stop or park a vehicle -
(h) in a bicycle lane or on a bicycle path;


The last line that relates to taxis is not applicable to (h). Please correct me if I'm wrong.



You're not wrong Roland. However, it only relates to setting down/picking up. What the taxis are doing is waiting, which is clearly in breach of both the Local Law and the Road Traffic Code.

nachoman
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby nachoman » Wed Oct 12, 2016 12:24 pm

CABS HOG CITY BIKE LANES

MILLIONS have been spent on bike lanes through the Perth CBD to help cyclists get around but long stretches of them are often being hogged by taxis waiting for a fare

Perth councillor Reece Harley raised the issue at this week’s finance and admin committee saying it’s a constant “bugbear” of his and one he had raised numerous times.

CEO Martin Mileham said the city had written twice to the taxi board but had been ignored.

Cr Harley said parking officers needed to crack down and start handing out fines.


Interesting read. Surely it is not hard to walk down Barrack St with a mobile phone in video mode and catch up to ten at a time

Image

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rolandp
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby rolandp » Wed Oct 12, 2016 10:58 pm

Saw this posted on Facebook by Reece with several people asking isn't it the City's rangers who should just be booking them.

I Wonder if Reece will get in trouble for CoP,s media gagging order - http://www.communitynews.com.au/guardia ... ing-order/

wellington_street
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Re: City of Perth - where is the cycle lanes on Barrack St?

Postby wellington_street » Mon Oct 17, 2016 12:46 pm

I saw further comments from Reece Harley stating that when the rangers approach to the taxis to get their photographs etc the taxis drive off and the rangers are unable to prosecute. So it does seem like a police intervention is required.

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