Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Sun Feb 05, 2012 5:18 pm

I am reading a full page ad in this mornings Sunday Times from Zap Electric Vehicles (p49 on my edition). The add gives a lot of info with the intention of convincing ht reader that e-bikes are useful, ideal for short trips and so forth. Fine with all, that. It is essentially true. They point out the savings on rego and so forth and they refer people to the department of transport site for maps.

However, nowhere does it hint that the motor can, for most routes, only be (legally) engaged on the road. And the sort of friends that I know who would be attracted to power assisted riding would mostly balk at the idea of riding on roads, including those road-edge cycle lanes. While the ad does not actually say they can be ridden with power engaged on all bike paths, it does say, quite accurately as far as I know, that "ZAP electic bikes can be safely ridden on dedicated Bike Paths already in place all around the metro area. Bearing in mind that this is a full page spread with much persuasive content, methinks that ZAP are being a little coy with the facts that a consumer should have. Or is it just that I am not aware of the plethora of dedicated bike paths that ZAP refers to?

Aside from the fact that most prospective purchasers would not appreciate the difference between a "dedicated cycle path" and, say, the many k's of foreshore shared paths, is there actually much in the way of dedicated cycle paths around Perth atm?

("dedicated path" seems to be an accepted term used by many including dept of transport to refer not to PSPs but to paths that are only able to be used by cyclists such as the City to Sea Greenway (C2C) and the recent additions around South Perth.)

So, restating - does Perth have much in the way of dedicated cycle paths? Where?
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by BNA » Sun Feb 05, 2012 6:54 pm

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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby citywomble » Sun Feb 05, 2012 6:54 pm

Colin,

There are two answers to your query actually:

Firstly, in response to the increase in support for e-bikes, the law in WA has actually been modified recently (there is a thread somewhere) to allow for the use of e-bikes on Shared Paths (up to 200W just like in the Ad). These bikes are now legal, using power assistance, on all shared paths

Secondly, there are not many Bike Paths! Despite repeated (and very misleading) assertions from the state government and in the press that there are about 1,130 Km of Bike Paths - this is wrong - they are shared paths. Sadly very many cyclists think they are bike paths which expains much of the abuse they give to pedestrians. Lets hope that these 'bike path' cyclists do not seriously injure a pedestrian because they would have little legal defence and need good insurance or, given recent changes to the law on culpability, some tolerance of a stint in jail.

They are about as rare as hen's teeth and even new freeway paths (IMO which should be bike paths) are shared. I myself only know of the South Perth bike paths and, in Stirling, a short bike path across Carine ROS which does not even connect to the roads at each end. I would be interested to know where the C2C is.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby citywomble » Sun Feb 05, 2012 6:57 pm

OK found it.

Even the C2C is a shared path, so bike path count so far is two. South Perth and Carine, Stirling. Any advances?
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Sun Feb 05, 2012 6:58 pm

That's good to know. imo the restriction against ebikes was more wrong than right.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Sun Feb 05, 2012 7:06 pm

citywomble wrote:OK found it.

Even the C2C is a shared path, so bike path count so far is two. South Perth and Carine, Stirling. Any advances?

and there was talk that the windy* track along riverside drive was going to be bikes only once the peds only path along the water-wall was completed but it hasn't happened.

(*How the hell do I spell the adjective describing a track that winds???) :?
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby Mulger bill » Sun Feb 05, 2012 7:27 pm

Serpentine? Convoluted? Meandering?

If Govt and press are busy touting these PSPs as "bike paths" then they need to share a degree of culpability if it ever goes pear shaped.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby fixed » Sun Feb 05, 2012 8:52 pm

good thtead and good posts, very impressed by citywomble
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby Aushiker » Tue Feb 07, 2012 3:17 pm

There is a cycle only path outside the Raffles Hotel and at Tompkins Park

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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby Jezza75 » Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:11 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:
citywomble wrote:OK found it.

Even the C2C is a shared path, so bike path count so far is two. South Perth and Carine, Stirling. Any advances?

and there was talk that the windy* track along riverside drive was going to be bikes only once the peds only path along the water-wall was completed but it hasn't happened.

(*How the hell do I spell the adjective describing a track that winds???) :?


There is s a path around the Raffles that is bike only, so does that make 3?
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby rolandp » Fri Feb 10, 2012 12:53 am

Telford cres, stirling. Joins Cedric st to the freeway area. Trucks and cars love parking in it and lovely connection to the shared path which gives you a lovely jolt each morning. 4 years ago provided city of stirling with video of it as the camera fell off at this point and still waiting for the repairs to be undertaken
The boulvard, city beach, only one small section and misses the heavy area through floreat
Glengarry drive, duncraig but only half of it. The council has recently installed traffic measures in the non-cycle lane area which now prevents cars overtaking me. Got almost wiped out by a bus who atemped to overtake me and even this won't get the city to change the layout.
Davila rd, carine, but only half of it. Has parking lane next to it so watch out for those opening door
Riverside rd, fremantle. Heard a remour that local government has recently installed speed bumps on sections of the path, as well as a dividing strip between the road and The path which includes raised poles. Sounds very dangerous if this the case
Aberdeene st, north bridge. I'm a cycle path, no I'm not, yes I am, no I'm not. If you are going to put a cycle path in, make it the whole length of the road. This is the only new shared/cycle path that city of Perth has built in 5 years, I asked this recently, and for some reason they weren't impressed that I pointed out the only new section was around the new Tafe and could they go back and complete the other sections
Murray st, east of barrack st, Perth. Takes you up to cathedral
Doesn't hay st also have some?

Can we get the number of locations greater than 20?
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Sat Feb 11, 2012 9:38 am

It'd be nice to also tote up the length of these paths. For example the bit aroubd the Raffles I assume is just the 100m I assume.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby Aushiker » Sat Feb 11, 2012 11:30 am

rolandp wrote:Riverside rd, fremantle. Heard a remour that local government has recently installed speed bumps on sections of the path, as well as a dividing strip between the road and The path which includes raised poles. Sounds very dangerous if this the case


The dividers are in at three places IIRC and the plastic poles are already squashed or heading in that direction. Keep in mind but that there is no bike lane on Riverside Drive, just a red bitumen shoulder. I will put up a video of the new interference later. I assume they are there to stop the motorists trying to bypass the new speed humps.

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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby Aushiker » Sat Feb 11, 2012 6:28 pm

Aushiker wrote:The dividers are in at three places IIRC and the plastic poles are already squashed or heading in that direction. Keep in mind but that there is no bike lane on Riverside Drive, just a red bitumen shoulder. I will put up a video of the new interference later. I assume they are there to stop the motorists trying to bypass the new speed humps.


Here is a video taken on the evening of Friday February 10, 2011 riding in a westerly direction on Riverside Drive, East Fremantle. This is the video from my rear facing camera.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9ZXdbe147U&hd=1[/youtube]

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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby rider_1 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:01 pm

does tonkin hwy have a complete bike path from reid hwy until thomas rd ? or only partial bike path ?
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby bobmac » Tue Feb 14, 2012 7:00 pm

No, no continuous path. Dual use cycle path that connects to Thomas Rd.starts at Mills Rd west, Martin, on opposite side of Tonkin Hwy. at Lumen Christi College. Easiest access to path is Mills Rd West from Gosnells, right at entrance to College into Ferres Dr. next left into Broadhurst, just before end of Broadhurst, left under underpass, turn left to Thomas Rd. (saves hassle of Tonkin Hwy.) Path has a reasonable surface & a good width, plus overpasses over Albany Hwy. & Corfield St.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby rcmkII » Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:01 pm

If a motorist touches that raised yellow part with their front wheel, is it going to pull the car left into the bike lane? (ie. pull the steering wheel out of their hands and launch the car off the road?) If so, I wouldn't want to be riding alongside.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:16 am

rcmkII wrote:If a motorist touches that raised yellow part with their front wheel, is it going to pull the car left into the bike lane? (ie. pull the steering wheel out of their hands and launch the car off the road?) If so, I wouldn't want to be riding alongside.


Good point and probably so.

I used to put my front wheel onto the inside curb when racing gokarts at Morley outdoor track for just that reason. Fasted and sharpest cornering possible without losing any traction.

Of course,the same thing applies for most paths since road builders have move from vertical curbs to sloped ones.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby rolandp » Tue Feb 21, 2012 8:34 am

And good bye to the dedicated cycle path on Murray St, going up to full Council tonight - http://www.perth.wa.gov.au/documentdb/2798.pdf

Also wrote an article on the BTA website on this item as we need access to the City of Perth's Draft Bike Plan.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby blkmcs » Tue Feb 21, 2012 9:58 am

rolandp wrote:And good bye to the dedicated cycle path on Murray St, going up to full Council tonight - http://www.perth.wa.gov.au/documentdb/2798.pdf

Also wrote an article on the BTA website on this item as we need access to the City of Perth's Draft Bike Plan.


From pages 117/118
At the time of the design, contra flow cycle lanes were required to be physically segregated with a
one metre separator, in the form of a raised island, to allow for vehicle overhang or opening car doors...

...Current Austroad guidelines for contra flow cycle lanes in low speed
environments, such as Murray Street, no longer require physical separation and
favour placing the contra flow lane between on-street parking bays and the carriageway.

So 12 years ago the guidelines recognised that dooring was an issue.
The current guidelines either do not see it as an issue or are in favour of dooring. :roll:
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby rolandp » Tue Jun 11, 2013 12:04 am

rolandp wrote:And good bye to the dedicated cycle path on Murray St, going up to full Council tonight - http://www.perth.wa.gov.au/documentdb/2798.pdf

Also wrote an article on the BTA website on this item as we need access to the City of Perth's Draft Bike Plan.

14 months on, and City of Perth have released concept plans of Murray St, according to the City of Perth's 4-June-2013 Agenda.
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What is the difference in what we have got now, except that we get a headstart box, to annoy motorists as we can jump to the front of the queue?

So at least some signs will be installed but I hope that we also get reduced speed on these roads as well (eg 30kph). As well as large fines for anyone who doors us from the parked cars, which are again located on the street.

This is the first of the roads to be considered, and if you have a look at City of Perth's Bike Plan, look out for more to come.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby rolandp » Wed Jul 24, 2013 8:21 am

City of Perth is seeking feedback for the Two Way Murray St project:
The City of Perth is asking the community to comment on the proposal to convert Murray Street to two way traffic.

This change will help to improve the city’s road network and increase safety for all road users.

City of Perth Lord Mayor Lisa Scaffidi noted that Murray Street is a major road in the CBD and that every effort will be made to engage the community in the conversion plans.

Two-way streets have a number of benefits, making the city more accessible by providing alternative route choices while also providing streetscapes which are more pedestrian friendly.

“It is important that the community takes this opportunity to share their thoughts on the Murray Street two way proposals,” Ms Scaffidi said.

The community has until Friday 26 July 2013 to provide feedback to the City.
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Re: Dedicated Cycle paths - What does Perth have?

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:32 pm

I can't say the loss of the token bike-lane will be missed. What a pointless waste of space that was.
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