Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby rolandp » Wed Jul 10, 2013 1:36 am

For those up North, Gribble Rd has been dug up to install drainage etc. There are 40kph signs installed but don't try this speed on the bike.

Another fine example of rip up cycle routes into the Perth CBD 3 days before the largest train outage in WA.

Gwelup Rd is where we turn off the PSP, whilst we wait for MAinRoads to use the vacant piece of land next to the Freeway for a hopefully dedicated cycle path. There were some talks, but no movement yet.

Why mention this last point? Because the drainage etc is to support the 30-odd houses being built in this location, which means more motorists traffic on Gribble Rd. where are the cycle paths.
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by BNA » Wed Jul 10, 2013 12:41 pm

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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby archetuthus » Wed Jul 10, 2013 12:41 pm

went past the big truck this morning preparing to rip it up. not going to be fun on the way home and for the next week or so. Everyone be careful out there.
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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby eldavo » Wed Jul 10, 2013 4:38 pm

This one? I didn't notice much difference to the general mess of the development happening across the road.
When I was a kid my Dad taught me to sweep up the road and clean up after ourselves when we mowed the lawn and covered the road with rubbish...

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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby rolandp » Thu Jul 11, 2013 11:57 pm

Closer view of this area:
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Interesting that the 40kph signs I originally reported are no longer there, with no warning of this road works.

Please spread the sand a bit more, just to make it more interesting for us.

City of Stirling, is this normal best practice for these types of road works?
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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby rolandp » Thu Jul 18, 2013 8:16 am

This area was repaved yesterday (in the rain) and is again open.

I was pulled over by the 'developer' last Friday, after taking a photo of cars parked on the area allocated as a footpath, and the car was blocking view of the sign. He asked why I was taking the photo, and not to report to Stirling. Too late, I had already contacted them on Thursday night and explained that there were no warning signs (only seen them when they were working), there was no traffic warden in operation even though this guy was working heavy machinery at the time, and this area was part of the PSP route and additional consideration should have occurred on the type of work/length of time and warning signs installed. Response back was interesting, traffic warning had a flat battery so wasn't there there that morning (we then discussed why there was no signs permanently installed), the work was meant to be finished last Thursday due to poor weather (but the repaving can occur on a wet day), and that eventually a new footpath would be installed at the location (he indicated that this would be of benefit to cyclists in the future - not if it is a footpath).

I have also been in contact with MainRoads as this area has had several developments and it is no longer the quite street it was 5-6 years ago when funding was provided to install a 'shared path' on the footpath (good luck at spotting this now as majority of the footpath has been ripped up to install driveways and personally don't use after mistaking a drainage for the exit of the shared path and fell off) , so hopefully there will be an announcement later this year about the PSP being located nearer the freeway.
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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby Marty Moose » Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:44 am

I rode there last week, had to get off walk through a little mud to get round a "digger" :) Little disruption but no big deal.Roland I know there are some issues you address that are issues, in this case I think its a whinge, the disruption was not major. If this is to much for anyone to deal with then I'd suggest a bicycle is not their ideal form of transport.

It really annoys me that its considered peopled are so stupid to need flashing signs, fixed signs and wardens to get around a little dirt. I can't see why we can't use our eyes and make a decision and be responsible for our own choices for once. People need places to live and having deep sewerage is not such a bad idea for the house situation..

Pictures and council reports in this case I think is an over reaction and truly making a mountain out of a mole hill.

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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby eldavo » Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:01 am

It's fine to take that approach in the light of day.
When it's wet and dark, lights don't light but reflect, oncoming lights glare, then I find most of the infrastructure horrible, and what is benign laziness in good conditions is dangerous in bad conditions.
Also consider that not everyone is as skilled/capable/experienced/hazard aware as yourself. There are kids. There are retirees.
It's selfish saying they shouldn't be provided safe reliable infrastructure to cycle, really be better if jump in a car instead.

I cycle the same route and have a good knowledge of the hazards of it, but put me onto someone else's route and I'll get caught out by most things once.

Also the major PSP arteries are the freeway for cyclists. Take your expectations of the motor vehicle freeway adjacent to this section and apply it here.

I cycle a similar route to Roland daily, and appreciate that he takes the time to stop and document this stuff that few others do. It's time that I'm quicker to work that he isn't, and time that I'm home quicker to my kids, that he isn't.
The complaints I find are constructive and with traffic control usually based on regulations and obligations that people are shirking.

I've had a motorcyclist friend die from negligent roadworks out behind Dwellingup with the blue metal being left instead of being swept off malpractice. No consequences for contractor or council. It didn't follow any of the roadworks practices legally required or that we would find in the city.
Similarly cycle infrastructure attracts the same negligence because there is no accountability and no visibility. If a tree falls across the PSP, does it make a sound?
Have a look at the Stirling Princeton development example... it was before I cycle commuted across it again in recent years, but I was astounded that a "cyclist's freeway" was shat on like that.
Last edited by eldavo on Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:31 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby CXCommuter » Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:18 am

Marty,
This section was seriously rough whilst they were working on it (all good this morning) with no warning and on one of the fastest sections of the cycleway into town. I agree with Eldavo that in the light of day it is no problem but in the mornings particularly with rain/dark and general poor visibility this had potential to be very dangerous.
An aside- I love the council? workers who drive up and down the PSP periodically checking things and leaving their doors open blocking the entire path whilst they look at a wall/drain...
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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby rolandp » Fri Jul 19, 2013 8:30 am

Cyclist dies after hitting bollards on shared path Gwelup - Dec 2010

Are these the same developers? - Don't know, but both locations are on the boundary of a very large development occurring (200-300 lots)
Do developers have a responsibility to ensure that they meet all safety requirements? - Yes

Will I continue to report these types of issues - yes
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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby Marty Moose » Fri Jul 19, 2013 10:40 am

I remember that and it was more than he just hit the Bollard. This was series of bad choices lowest common denominator stuff which is why it annoys me. If we aim at the bottom that's where we will end up.People need to make their own choices if that includes using a light to see what's in front and riding to the conditions so be it, not carrying the blame and responsibility onto others. I agree with safety but I feel this is over the top stifling almost, its a disease in our society driven by our legal system.

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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby eldavo » Fri Jul 19, 2013 12:21 pm

No blame/responsibility is being carried to others, just the issue of the developer/council in their portion of responsibility.
He is dead for his part in no helmet and no lights, his family are paying that price.
That doesn't nullify the developer/council for their part in the bollards hazard, not having the area lit.
FYI Fault in an accident is not always with one party... being at fault in some way does not make you wholly at fault for all parties.
e.g. because a cyclist is riding fast does not mean they’re wholly at fault for another slower cyclist crossing their path suddenly causing the accident at speed.

For the rest of us, it’s a reminder why you need to do the right thing as a cyclist, and why developers/councils need to do the right thing by the public.

You might remember growing up, we didn't require helmets by law, and the friction dynamo headlight didn't light my way much more than a candle.
Killing people to weed out the good from bad doesn't sound like a great policy, but is that what they were doing to us kids back then, raising the bar?
Maybe we're a superior race who now have the right to decide how lazy people can be and what hazards are acceptable to continue weeding out who lives and dies by today's laws, or our choice in which ones we obey or do not obey.
Nobody is perfect “good guy, bad day” incidents will catch out even your most esteemed elitists, so be careful what you wish for.

Whatever view you like, statistically we've all got the same chance of being dead some day, so don't sweat it too much =P
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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby Marty Moose » Fri Jul 19, 2013 1:50 pm

Guess we could wax lyrical about this for ages comparing cars, dynamos etc etc I feel this is still a mountain out of a moll hill haVing ridden through this twice now.

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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby eldavo » Fri Jul 19, 2013 2:08 pm

Statements about the disease of society and using not exactly a radical example to support it aren't going to garner support though.
I get what you're saying, but one extreme isn't helped by another extreme, most things in moderation (as everything moderation would be too extreme ;)
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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby Jackfrost » Mon Jul 22, 2013 1:59 pm

rolandp wrote:Cyclist dies after hitting bollards on shared path Gwelup - Dec 2010

Are these the same developers? - Don't know, but both locations are on the boundary of a very large development occurring (200-300 lots)
Do developers have a responsibility to ensure that they meet all safety requirements? - Yes

Will I continue to report these types of issues - yes

You mean the guy that was riding home from a Christmas party and was more than 3x the limit?
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Re: Gribble Rd, Gwelup road works

Postby rolandp » Tue Jul 23, 2013 12:04 am

Jackfrost wrote:You mean the guy that was riding home from a Christmas party and was more than 3x the limit?

No idea, heavy price to pay if he was.

It still does not remove the responsibility for the developers and/or the council, for installing those barriers. As indicated last week a fellow cyclists ran into a 8ft tree on the PSP, and he was wearing a helmet, lights, etc. Replace the 8ft tree with concrete barriers, and he may not have escaped with scratches.
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