Letter p24 Jan 11 Cambridge post on Outlaw cyclists

Letter p24 Jan 11 Cambridge post on Outlaw cyclists

Postby Thoglette » Sat Jan 11, 2014 1:02 pm

Another letter by the ill-informed needs responses correcting the facts. Post 11 Jan 2014

The usual claims are dragged out:

First, that motorists pay for roads through rego and fuel excise (they don't even pay for the direct cost of the roads, never mind direct non-road costs such as medical costs nor indirect costs like opportunity cost on land usenor congestion) and therefore somehow have a "right" above other road users (they don't by law nor by this argument).

Getting good data on the complete direct cost of road provision and maintenance is hard due to the three tiers of government involved and vaguaries about what goes on which side of the ledger. See Common Urban Myths About Transport for one attempt. And also BBC, ipayroadtax

Counterpoint: the RAC recently reporteda 1:3 (ish) benefit return ratio on cycling infrastructure expenditure.

Secondly the correspondent would like videos of bad cycling behaviour sent to the transport minister. I'm sure the head-cam people would love to point out that the police and minister already ignore the videos of idiot motorists (especially those who don't leave a meter).

The "no bells" strawman could be usefully responded to with a comment that'll be worth addressing once after more urgent matters are dealt with - like things that actually result in death, dismemberment or actual civil disturbance.
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by BNA » Sat Jan 11, 2014 1:57 pm

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Re: Letter p24 Jan 11 Cambridge post on Outlaw cyclists

Postby biker jk » Sat Jan 11, 2014 1:57 pm

Yes, "no bells" is clearly as dangerous as the 46% of motorists who admitted to using a mobile phone while driving. :shock:
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Re: Letter p24 Jan 11 Cambridge post on Outlaw cyclists

Postby dmwill » Sat Jan 11, 2014 6:58 pm

I recommend motorists mount video cam-eras on their windscreens to record cyclists’ behaviour on public roads.


Good luck identifying them. Oh wait, cyclists should have rego.

Equestrians are more likely to own motor vehicles but I have only read polite requests from them for motorists to be considerate when they pass horses on roads.


Um, what?


Overall, I'm over this kind of debate, simply because no one wants to listen to a a sensible, intelligent opinion from the minority. Us.

At the end of the day, the person who wrote that letter probably had a bad day and was delayed 10 seconds on their way to/from home.
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Re: Letter p24 Jan 11 Cambridge post on Outlaw cyclists

Postby Flighter » Sun Jan 12, 2014 11:08 am

biker jk wrote:Yes, "no bells" is clearly as dangerous as the 46% of motorists who admitted to using a mobile phone while driving. :shock:


I don't understand why people don't use bells myself. If a pedestrian suddenly moves in front of me and I collide with him then I am considered responsible, just as a motorist is responsible if he hits another car from behind. The onus is clearly on me not to hit a pedestrian, and as I do not need the grief of the legal and insurance nightmare that would result from hitting someone, I signal my intention to overtake by ringing my bell, multiple times if need be. I appreciate it when faster cyclists do the same when overtaking me on my bike, as it can otherwise be quite startling.
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Re: Letter p24 Jan 11 Cambridge post on Outlaw cyclists

Postby queequeg » Sun Jan 12, 2014 11:15 am

I have variable results with bell ringing. About 50% of the time it is not heard as the pedestrian is attached to an iPod.
Of the remaining 50%, half if those will react to a bell ring by actually stepping into my path instead of simply holding their line. The rest are split between those who thank me for the warning or abuse me for "telling them to get out of the way".
So, given that I only get a positive experience from bell ringing about 12.5% of the time, I just don't think there is any point. My bell is there for legal compliance, and I just use common sense when passing people, staying behind them if necessary until it is safe to pass.
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Re: Letter p24 Jan 11 Cambridge post on Outlaw cyclists

Postby MyNameIsNoone » Mon Jan 13, 2014 5:17 pm

Don't have a problem with this tool's suggestion. I'm happy to take the challenge that a motorist record his journey and we ping ALL the infringements recorded (both cyclist and driver). I reckon an easy 10:1 offences happen car:bike on a standard journey.

Of course mounting a camera on the car windscreen may create a sight impediment for the driver (which would be an offence) and of course operating a camera whilst driving (without due care and attention) would be an offence.

Equestrian is an adjective (not a noun) so I'm not clear who these polite types are, but I'm sure the writer is clear that giving way to a horse on the road is governed by the road rules (regardless of their politely written requests to him - as an aside, how on Earth does someone riding a horse hand a driver a politely written request to get his car out of his horse's @r53!), where as being a dis-courteous cyclist isn't actually an offence (it's just a consequence of having an idiot in a car try to run you off the road).

I'm sure Mr Tickle from Robinsons Terrace in Daglish is also aware of the difficulties in trying to force bicycles to pay tax, registration fees, fuel excise(!!!) etc, given that they're inanimate objects, but cyclists do pay gst on their bikes (and on their power gels - does that count as fuel excise), and most cyclists already pay rego on their cars which aren't sitting in front of him in the traffic jam.

I'm also keen to see how Mr Dickle from Robinson terrace in Daglish "records the videos" - does this mean he's going to nip along to Blockbuster and record a 20 sec clip of old VHS tapes?? Or is he encouraging people to create video clips on digital media?

Tool.

Maybe I'll write to the minister for education with documented evidence of Mr Pickle of Robinson Terrace Daglish's poor use of language and reason. I may even video his letter and send the USB memory stick!

Just think, if I hadn't wasted so much time writing this, I could have been out buying a bell!

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Re: Letter p24 Jan 11 Cambridge post on Outlaw cyclists

Postby Thoglette » Fri Jan 24, 2014 4:07 pm

A couple of nice replies in today's Post
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