Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

twowheels
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Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

Postby twowheels » Sun Sep 23, 2018 9:46 am

I just researched an activity I was considering. Ride bikes 5 km to Maylands train station, catch train to Freo. Ride around Freo. Catch train back to Maylands. Ride home. Cost = $4.80 one way/ person x 4 trips = $19.20 total cost ($38.40 for 4 people) Versus estimated $6 for fuel + $5 for 2 hours parking = $11, same for 1, 2 or 4 people. An example that demonstrates why public transport is not better utilised in Perth.
This is a recreational activity example. I can choose whether to do this or not. But it is exploitative of people who have no choice.

Wixxy
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Re: Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

Postby Wixxy » Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:06 am

A family rider ticket could bring the cost down if 2 of the 4 were kids / adult concessions?
Factor in maintenance/tax/insurance, although minimal.

I use a mix of bike/bus/train for commuting. I accept the cost and don't think much about it.

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Thoglette
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Re: Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

Postby Thoglette » Sun Sep 23, 2018 1:30 pm

This is a classic example of the economic traps we make for ourselves: you didn't count any of the "sunk" costs of the car. Such as rego, insurance, depreciation and wear & tear are ignored in your examination of "viability".

Then one should add the cost of your garage (60m2 at $2000pm on the top of your mortgage/rent) and the subsidies for your parking spaces in Freo.

On top of that the entire govt contribution to the PTA is one quarter of what the MRD alone spends on building or improving roads. Not maintenance: this is new and bigger roads. Yet while the MRD has never generated any revenue in it's entire existence, the PTA is expected to "pay for itself". (Fares are important to creating a perception of value but, like road usage fees, are technically unnecessary )

Then there's the direct costs a car/truck focused transport solution causes to the health budget (e.g. about 1/3rd of hospital beds)

And this is before we start talking about the indirect costs.

But none of these costs are visible to you when you make your decision: all you see is fuel and (subsidised) parking costs

twowheels wrote:This is a recreational activity example. I can choose whether to do this or not. But it is exploitative of people who have no choice.


What's explotative is that you can not chose to use public transport to get to many blue collar jobs in industrial estates. There are no rail services at all and rarely any bus services before "prestart".

This is where public transport is not viable: if you don't have 24/7 service everywhere (as opposed to rush hour services to/from the CBD) it is not a viable alternative to motorvehicles (private, rented or taxis)
Stop handing them the stick! - Dave Moulton
"People are worthy of respect, ideas are not." Peter Ellerton, UQ

Grev
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Re: Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

Postby Grev » Sun Sep 23, 2018 1:55 pm

Still much better than Switzerland - 20 Swiss Francs per bike - about A$30.00 each.

twowheels
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Re: Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

Postby twowheels » Sun Sep 23, 2018 3:36 pm

Thog, we are in agreeance. I didn't include, I had considered. I KISS. Fuel cost prob closer to only $5. The overall point is that the bike/ train option is not a hands down winner. I also had not included the time factor, keeping in mind I was considering a Sunday. Abandoned the plan at last minute when the Royal Show and impact on trains was considered.

Thog, if as you say , Fares are important to creating a perception of value but, like road usage fees, are technically unnecessary , please raise the issue with your local member of parliament. I was considering $1 flat fare up to 10 km, thereafter $0.10 each additional km.


Rode past Maylands, on to Angelo St South Perth for coffee, back to Barrack St jetty Annalakshmi Restaurant, ride back home.

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rolandp
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Re: Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

Postby rolandp » Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:54 pm

And to throw an another consideration into the mix, public transport is subsidised
Mr Murphy said just 17 per cent of the cost of running the service in the past financial year — $85 million — was recouped in passenger fares.

Source http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-11-29/t ... ds/9207194

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Thoglette
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Re: Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

Postby Thoglette » Sun Sep 23, 2018 9:34 pm

rolandp wrote:And to throw an another consideration into the mix, public transport is subsidised

Not to the degree that private transport is subsidised. The MRD alone burns through over $2,000 million dollars every year.

twowheels wrote: I was considering a Sunday

Ah, then you didn't read the fine print. The Family Pass is, IIRC, $9 and provides all day travel for a family of up to seven
Stop handing them the stick! - Dave Moulton
"People are worthy of respect, ideas are not." Peter Ellerton, UQ

twowheels
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Re: Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

Postby twowheels » Mon Sep 24, 2018 9:43 am

twowheels wrote: I was considering a Sunday

Ah, then you didn't read the fine print. The Family Pass is, IIRC, $9 and provides all day travel for a family of up to seven[/quote]

Assumption that the four comprised a family. Fine print, yes that web site is confusing, possibly intentionally. The particular Sunday was a Royal Show day, no way I'd put a bike on a train.

Again, exploitative of people who don't have a choice. I was considering people on low income. Perhaps don't have a car. Perhaps don't have internet access. Perhaps don't have a home.
(Fare concessions have been considered)

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Red Rider
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Re: Why bicycles & public transport is not economically viable for many in Perth

Postby Red Rider » Thu Sep 27, 2018 2:46 pm

Also consider Smartrider fares are up to 20% off. $3.84 for a standard 2 zone, $1.60 for concession.

But generally I do agree the fares should be subsidised more to encourage more use.

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