your rain jacket when touring?

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il padrone
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby il padrone » Mon May 02, 2016 1:11 pm

Yeah, yeah....... same ol' standard tripe you peddle.

You can keep your Qld in my opinion. Certainly for anything outside of May to Sept. I hate that sultry humidity, and can put up with all manner of cold and wet instead of it. As for your ideas of running from bridge (suitable place for a troll) to cowshed to railway station for accommodation - good on you, but I like to be independent and not impose so much on community facilities.

Good to know you think we are all here and out touring just as a "fashion statement" :roll: . Go away now!
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby Aushiker » Mon May 02, 2016 1:42 pm

il padrone wrote:As for your ideas of running from bridge (suitable place for a troll) to cowshed to railway station for accommodation - good on you, but I like to be independent and not impose so much on community facilities.!


What I find pretty amusing is that the $12.00 tent which is such apparently such a decent tent and all you need for for touring "Australia", has to be suddenly abandoned for a bridge, cowshed etc to gain protection from, whoops the weather that we don't need rain jackets for ... so a useless tent, no rain jacket and running for a cowshed ... :lol: :)

Personally I will stick to my "fashion statement" secure in the knowledge that a well designed and manufactured tent which is well pitched will provide pretty damn good protection against pretty much all the weather I am likely to encounter; no running to a cowshed for me, not that there is likely to one run to where I tour, nor a bridge for that matter :wink:
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby avolve » Mon May 02, 2016 2:54 pm

johnfordau wrote:I use the $12 ones at Big W. Good enough and if they break .. buy another ..


Some of us are a little less self-centred and share a concern for the environment which we like to explore.
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby Tim » Mon May 02, 2016 3:43 pm

Speaking of completely unnecessary, conspicuously-consumptive, fashionable rainwear, Showerspass are having a 20% off Spring sale starting May 3 to May 8.
But then again my Showerspass jacket just sits in the bottom of my cupboard. I never need it 'cause it never rains. Plenty of bridges to shelter under and culverts to hide in around here. Only trouble is most of them have water flowing through them or under them. Must be those glaciers up the road starting to melt. :roll:

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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby Aushiker » Mon May 02, 2016 3:51 pm

Tim wrote:Speaking of completely unnecessary, conspicuously-consumptive, fashionable rainwear, Showerspass are having a 20% off Spring sale starting May 3 to May 8.
But then again my Showerspass jacket just sits in the bottom of my cupboard. I never need it 'cause it never rains. Plenty of bridges to shelter under and culverts to hide in around here. Only trouble is most of them have water flowing through them or under them. Must be those glaciers up the road starting to melt. :roll:


LOL :)
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby RonK » Mon May 02, 2016 5:50 pm

Touring is meant to be fun...yep, absolutely!

But wait - getting saturated because you don't have a rain jacket, camping under a bridge, in a culvert, in a cowshed, in a leaky $12 tent - THIS IS FUN?

I don't think so... :roll:
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby il padrone » Mon May 02, 2016 6:01 pm

Aushiker wrote:Personally I will stick to my "fashion statement" secure in the knowledge that a well designed and manufactured tent which is well pitched will provide pretty damn good protection against pretty much all the weather I am likely to encounter; no running to a cowshed for me, not that there is likely to one run to where I tour, nor a bridge for that matter :wink:

Hilleberg are very expensive tents, and maybe classed as "conspicuous consumption", though the standard design and subtler colours would seem to mark it as less-than conspicuous; not quite the "fashion statement" you attribute to such gear. Regardless, if I was planning to tour in any colder climate areas, where a windstorm was possible, the Soulo would be my first choice, LONG BEFORE any "cowshed" :P

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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby Trevtassie » Mon May 02, 2016 7:34 pm

"For all of Tasmania
Weather Situation

An approaching cold front will produce strengthening winds in all districts overnight tonight and early tomorrow morning, before contracting to the northeast.

DAMAGING NORTHWESTERLY WINDS around 60 km/h with peak gusts of 110 km/h are forecast for the King Island, Furneaux Islands, North West Coast, Central North, North East, Western and East Coast forecast districts and parts of the Central Plateau, Midlands, Upper Derwent Valley and South East forecast districts."

I suppose you could hide under a bridge but...
"Flash flooding of small creeks and low lying areas may occur in locations that receive heavy rainfall throughout the State."

Farked if I'd wanna be in a crappy Kmart Tent in the current weather. I've seen the carnage any kind of wind or rain wreaks on them at the Falls Festival. You'd be better off with a roll of gaffa, a couple of broomsticks and a packet of heavy duty rubbish bags.

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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby johnfordau » Tue May 03, 2016 11:14 am

Good to see such comrades among the touring set .. if you are all so terrified of the weather perhaps you should stay at home .. safe and dry .. just as matter of interest .. has anyone here actually done any touring other than commuting around Melbourne in the wet ..

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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby rifraf » Tue May 03, 2016 12:10 pm

johnfordau wrote:Good to see such comrades among the touring set .. if you are all so terrified of the weather perhaps you should stay at home .. safe and dry .. just as matter of interest .. has anyone here actually done any touring other than commuting around Melbourne in the wet ..

John there will likely soon be a whip around for a copy of "How To Make Friends And Influence People" for you.
Will your entire contribution to the Touring threads be of similar ilk?
How bout simply enjoying your own particular type of touring instead of evangelical-like attempts to convert and convince others to your way of thinking?
Theres room for all in here but do everyone a favour and lighten up on the "My way on the highway" approach, aye? :idea:
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby RonK » Tue May 03, 2016 12:38 pm

johnfordau wrote: .. if you are all so terrified of the weather perhaps you should stay at home .. safe and dry ..

Perhaps you have a problem with your short term memory - it was your suggestion to find a motel, catch a bus, camp in a cowshed, hide under bridge when it rains.

The rest of us are not at all discomforted by a bit of rain. We just put on our rain jacket (because unlike you, we actually have one) and keep on touring.
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby johnfordau » Tue May 03, 2016 2:08 pm

Down at the bike shop this morning when a couple of guys, (aged about 20-24) on bikes and dropped in for a few odd items. Travelled from Sydney on wide bar clunkers, three speed, with front baskets even, wide seats and with white walled tyres no less. (Some salesman must be laughing his head off). Loads of gear tied on with rope and bungie cord. Dress; ripped shirts and ordinary cotton shorts, non matching colours. Had a chat with them. Doing great and heading for Cairns. Spied a bundle of old canvas which probably their tent. No, I did not ask them if they had the latest rain jacket. Tried to lift their bikes .. only with a struggle.

Saw them off sitting on their bikes more like Mary Poppins than anything else. I would not have lasted five miles .... and people think they are doing it tough if they have to wear the latest rain jacket.

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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby rifraf » Tue May 03, 2016 4:14 pm

RonK wrote:Hmmm, since I started digging I've discovered that the Marmot Essence is currently the best rated jacket for lightweight and breathability.

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A bit of trivia that you may have missed (or not).
They don't sell the Essence, but I spotted today that Torpedo7 sell a selection of Marmot gear amongst others including the well thought of but much heavier Precip which also got good marks in some reviews.
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby RonK » Tue May 03, 2016 6:50 pm

rifraf wrote:
RonK wrote:Hmmm, since I started digging I've discovered that the Marmot Essence is currently the best rated jacket for lightweight and breathability.

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A bit of trivia that you may have missed (or not).
They don't sell the Essence, but I spotted today that Torpedo7 sell a selection of Marmot gear amongst others including the well thought of but much heavier Precip which also got good marks in some reviews.

Yeah, I have a Precip in my trekking kit, but it is not breathable enough for cycling. Last time I wore it was in the snow on the Overland Track. :)
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby rifraf » Tue May 03, 2016 7:52 pm

I see Macpac has just released their own light weight jacket called the Hightail Anorak

http://www.macpac.com.au/mens/jackets-v ... -mens.html

Within 10grams of claimed weight of the Marmot Essence and with bolder claims of breathability and water resistance.

I'm not entirely sure if the figures are apples with apples but Macpacs include

Hydrostatic Head (mm) 20,000
Breathability (g/m2/24hr) 40,000

and the Marmot Essence

Water column in mm: min. 10.000mm
Breathability: min. 17.000gm/24h

Both companies also pair lightweight pants to match their jackets with Macpacs here:

http://www.macpac.com.au/mens/trousers- ... -mens.html

Two decades ago, Macpac did a cycle specific lightweight rain jacket and it was a great one which folded into its own pocket which housed a belt so when not in use you could clip it around your waist (folded inside its own front zipped pocket. Alas walking to close to a saw sticking out from a wheelbarrow saw to its demise. They had stopped producing it around the time mine carked it about a decade later so I've never replaced it.
I'm very tempted to look to something of similar ilk to lighten the load of my Showers Pass.

There is a bit of a blog review on the Macpac site that goes into some detail of the spec

http://blog.macpac.co.nz/gear-review-hightail/
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby il padrone » Tue May 03, 2016 8:45 pm

rifraf wrote:I see Macpac has just released their own light weight jacket called the Hightail Anorak

http://www.macpac.com.au/mens/jackets-v ... -mens.html

Within 10grams of claimed weight of the Marmot Essence and with bolder claims of breathability and water resistance....

....I'm very tempted to look to something of similar ilk to lighten the load of my Showers Pass.

Very interesting. However:

1. I hate anorak-style rain-wear. Much better to use a jacket

2. I note from their page
Note: The lightweight nature of this fabric means it's not suitable for high abrasion use.


I don't think it meets my needs, despite its claimed exceptional breathability and waterhead ratings.
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby rifraf » Tue May 03, 2016 8:59 pm

il padrone wrote:[
Very interesting. However:

1. I hate anorak-style rain-wear. Much better to use a jacket

2. I note from their page
Note: The lightweight nature of this fabric means it's not suitable for high abrasion use.

I don't think it meets my needs, despite its claimed exceptional breathability and waterhead ratings.


Well good that you know what suits you best Pete.

I posted merely to inform and not to twist anyones arm behind their back...... Well at least not until Macpac start talking serious turkey about offering inflated CEO levels of commission. :P

We've heard from folk who claim that no jacket is necessary and I thought that their might simply be one or two who'd not be born again into this baptism of new faith and immersed themselves into the culvert of Queensland ideology and perhaps..... just perhaps might be tempted into the sin of renouncing the shelter of bridges and cowsheds (Apostasy) and were worried about being banished somewhere where the heavens opened up on occasion...... :wink:

It was just a theory..... no need to claim heresy or suggest excommunication

I'm merely happy it momentarily held your interest

I'm sure the Showers Pass would pass a tougher torture test :!: :)
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby il padrone » Tue May 03, 2016 10:27 pm

I posted just to express an opinion (my own). Not suggesting anything else.
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby Aushiker » Tue May 03, 2016 10:41 pm

rifraf wrote:
I'm not entirely sure if the figures are apples with apples but Macpacs include

Hydrostatic Head (mm) 20,000
Breathability (g/m2/24hr) 40,000

and the Marmot Essence

Water column in mm: min. 10.000mm
Breathability: min. 17.000gm/24h


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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby RonK » Wed May 04, 2016 12:18 am

rifraf wrote:I see Macpac has just released their own light weight jacket called the Hightail Anorak

http://www.macpac.com.au/mens/jackets-v ... -mens.html

Within 10grams of claimed weight of the Marmot Essence and with bolder claims of breathability and water resistance.

I'm not entirely sure if the figures are apples with apples but Macpacs include

Hydrostatic Head (mm) 20,000
Breathability (g/m2/24hr) 40,000

and the Marmot Essence

Water column in mm: min. 10.000mm
Breathability: min. 17.000gm/24h

Impressive numbers - since you are an avowed Macpac fan, will you be the guinea pig and buy one first? :D

BTW, the numbers for the Marmot Essence seem a little out...

Waterproofness: 10,000 mm minimum JIS-L 1092
Breathability: 20,000 to 47,000 gm / 24h JIGS-1099 B1
11,700 to 12,500 gm / 24h JIGS-1099 A1
CFM: 0.14 to 0.20 CFM Air Permeability
Hohenstein RET: 2.9 to 4.0
Technology: 2.5 Microporous lamination with Dry Touch finish

For waterproofness, Marmot gives the minimum head - I suspect Macpac gives the maximum

For breathability Marmot gives the results of the B1 (Inverted Cup) and A1 (Upright Cup) test - see the link in Aushiker's post for explanation.

I suspect Macpac has given the result of only the more impressive looking B1 test. Naughty naughty Macpac.

A bit like the Treasurer's budget really - smoke and mirrors. :D
Last edited by RonK on Wed May 04, 2016 1:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby RonK » Wed May 04, 2016 12:37 am

Double post deleted
Last edited by RonK on Wed May 04, 2016 1:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby rifraf » Wed May 04, 2016 2:55 am

RonK wrote:Impressive numbers - since you are an avowed Macpac fanatic, will you be the guinea pig and buy one first? :D

BTW, the numbers for the Marmot Essence seem a little out...

Waterproofness: 10,000 mm minimum JIS-L 1092
Breathability: 20,000 to 47,000 gm / 24h JIGS-1099 B1
11,700 to 12,500 gm / 24h JIGS-1099 A1
CFM: 0.14 to 0.20 CFM Air Permeability
Hohenstein RET: 2.9 to 4.0
Technology: 2.5 Microporous lamination with Dry Touch finish

For waterproofness, Marmot gives the minimum head - I suspect Macpac gives the maximum

For breathability Marmot gives the results of the B1 (Inverted Cup) and A1 (Upright Cup) test - see the link in Aushiker's post for explanation.

I suspect Macpac has given the result of only the more impressive looking B1 test. Naughty naughty Macpac.

A bit like the Treasurer's budget really - smoke and mirrors. :D


Whilst I am a fan and find here in Perth their service a real breath of fresh air compared to the local bike shops I've visited, I think fanatic might be pushing my admiration for a decent product a bit far.
After all when looking at a soft-shell, I followed your lead and bought a Marmot Gravity when Macpac market a few different soft shells of their own.
I'm not a fan of their top of the line rainwear, I find their Minaret (winter) and Microlight (three season) fit for purpose and I've been happy with their sleeping bags and my Cascade pack of around 20 years old refuses to wear out bar me replacing the straps.
I still use their 20 year old now (approx) polyprop base layers - wearing one of the tops right now in fact.
OK, I'll settle for "Big Fan".... :lol: :lol: :lol:

I'm sure they all fudge the figures in pursuit of market share.
Apologies if mine are incorrect, I cut and pasted direct from that link I PM'd you. :oops:

Their old light weight reflex cycle specific rain anorak used to be my favourite bit of kit, which is the only reason I'm tempted to look hard at this latest one.

Will I be a guinea pig? More a guinness pig really and after a few I might be tempted to press the buy now button.

However, I'm in no hurry to make up my mind and as I showed you via PM, I can get the aforementioned Marmot Essence cheaper.

In Macpacs favour, I can try out the fit first and I know from past experience that I would be looked after well should their be any issues via either the local shop or NZ direct.

On the other hand, the Essence doesn't rely on breathability alone but utilises two pit opening so arguably less humid under exertion.....
Decisions, decisions.... More than enough to keep my tiny mind occupied for the duration.

I'm merely opening my mind to the possibilities of a rethink, reshuffle and revamp of my touring kit to see if I favour any upgrades in the never-ending search for bang for buck.

And as for the garnishment of the title of Treasurer for Scotty Morrosin, the less said likely the better..... :wink:
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby dalai47 » Wed May 04, 2016 10:33 am

My personal opinion on equipment is dependent on what it is.

Of course you can tour using cheaper kit. I rode the Mawson trail solo last year on a KHS Hardtail I bought second hand for $200. It didn't let me down as I serviced it and had it running perfectly for the trip.

But when it comes to critical kit which can actually be the difference between life and death due to exposure / hypothermia I will not scrimp! Like going out in the ocean in a dingy without a life jacket. Can be done and if the sea is glassy you will probably fine, but when the wind and seas pick up...

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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby RonK » Wed May 04, 2016 1:27 pm

rifraf wrote:Whilst I am a fan and find here in Perth their service a real breath of fresh air compared to the local bike shops I've visited, I think fanatic might be pushing my admiration for a decent product a bit far.

Hehe - well, fan is just a shortening of fanatic anyway, but changed that for you.

rifraf wrote:I'm merely opening my mind to the possibilities of a rethink, reshuffle and revamp of my touring kit to see if I favour any upgrades in the never-ending search for bang for buck.

Very commendable and worthy, however I don't think a jacket such as the Essence is necessary for regular touring.

The main advantage of this type of jacket lies not so much in the low weight as in the miniscule packed volume - something very important when carrying capacity is limited with bikepacking bags. Not so important when touring with panniers. Showers Pass will still have a place in my touring kit.
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Re: your rain jacket when touring?

Postby rifraf » Thu May 05, 2016 4:20 pm

RonK wrote:
The main advantage of this type of jacket lies not so much in the low weight as in the miniscule packed volume - something very important when carrying capacity is limited with bikepacking bags. Not so important when touring with panniers. Showers Pass will still have a place in my touring kit.


Given that I'm utilising a rack bag as well as my 4 panniers currently, I'd say there is likely some room for improvement regarding some of my gear choices and bulk.
I try to actively avoid riding in the rain unless caught out in a shower where something lighter and less robust "may" prove ample.

I'm currently looking at cookware and rainwear but am unsure as yet how far I'll go.
I've just ordered my first pair of bib knicks from Singapore so I'm definitely broadening my cycling mindset
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