Okay Gary here is one I was hiding

Vintage, yesteryear and retro biking

Okay Gary here is one I was hiding

Postby cludence » Tue Jan 29, 2008 8:04 pm

Hey Gary, here is one I found thrown out early last year. It has been hanging in my garage as I couldnt decide what to do with it. Each time I thought of passing it on, something told me to hang on to it. I found out today it was built by a frame builder called Slim Ward. Apparently he is still alive, at least late 80's if not older and was known to make good quality frames in his time. Obviously it is now definately staying and I am hoping to see if I can pay a visit to him and have a chat.

The pics are not the best and someone gave it a charming coat with white paint and mixed up parts, but if you look closely on the headtube it has nice little holes cut within the lugs.

I think it will come up stunning repainted. Just got to work out the age of it and what it would have originally had on it.

Karen.

Image

Image
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by BNA » Tue Jan 29, 2008 8:06 pm

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Postby stryker84 » Tue Jan 29, 2008 8:06 pm

Oooh, purty.
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Postby GaryF » Tue Jan 29, 2008 8:39 pm

Ha,ha ha! Karen, I swear, you must be a bike magnet! .......and you've been holding out on us!

It does look like a good quality racing bike. The stem looks like an old Ambrosio stem but it appears to be fabricated with an elbow where the horizontal bit and vertical bit join. Is it alloy? I think the headset is called a continental headset. Love the holes in the lugs too. It looks like a decent size too - 23"?

What is the gear system and what are the cranks?

I'm probably seeing things but has the bike had a head on crash? It looks like the top and down tubes could be bent a little in the photo. The fork look straight so I'm probably seeing things.

Oh yeah......you know who built it - fantastic.

Thanks for the photo's and, again, another piece of Aussie bike building history in appropriate hands.

P.S. I looked through my old decals and they are all impossible to photocopy or scan due to their paper/card backing.

Thanks once again, Gary.
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Postby cludence » Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:44 pm

Hi Gary,

I am forever scouring cleanups for bikes for the community project I am pursuing so I dont know if it is a magnet as such, probably more a case of being in the right place at the right time.

I am unsure if the stem is alloy as it is caked on with so much paint. The headset looks to be english but again, who knows what is under all the paint.

The gears are simplex but to be honest I cannot remember how many. The shifters are also simplex but one is missing and so is the front deraileur. The cranks are williams but not sure on the chainrings as yet. The brakes are black weinmanns. I have no idea what has/hasnt been changed around.

Jim had a look at it and said something about the pedals being Brampton? and was talking about silver soldering in regards to the frame/lugs. I have to admit I forgot some of what he said as I more excited about knowing who made the frame and that the person was still around. Hopefully I can catch up with him to find out more info.

Thanks for checking about the decals. I might get a photo of the ones on my bike and see if copies can be made up from them.

Karen.
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Postby cludence » Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:33 pm

I spoke to the builder of the frame today. He is a lovely man. Now 84 and as sharp as a tack. He said without looking at the frame he guesses it would have been made in the 60's to early 70's. He said he didnt make a large quantity of frames, most were custom orders and he also made the odd utility bike. He said mine would have been a custom frame and that he used 531 tubing and nervex lugs.

He asked me if it needed repairs as he guaranteed his frames for life. Luckily it doesnt, even if it did, I wouldn't ask him given he is 84.

He has invited me to call in and visit when I get the chance and I will hopefully have the bike completed so I can show him the finished result. Will be fun working out components as he said they varied depending on the customers wishes.

So yes, I had fun today!

Karen.
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Postby GaryF » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:47 pm

Guaranteed for life - you don't get that anymore - and he meant it!

I must say that I've never had a day like that - I'm very jealous.
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Postby mikesbytes » Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:45 pm

Going to have to check out that garage one of these days
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Postby cludence » Wed Jan 30, 2008 8:22 pm

Mike, if you saw my garage right now you would have a heart attack. I have jars all over the floor as I am currently in the middle of sorting out nuts, bolts and various bike bits and pieces. I keep tripping over them as I dodge the bikes. Driving me mad.

Karen.
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Postby stevendavid75 » Wed Jan 30, 2008 8:29 pm

sounds like we should have a working bee at your place, (mental note steve: wear pants with big bike size pockets when attending)
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Postby WyvernRH » Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:10 pm

Hi, I dont think that is a Continental type headset, That is the older 'English" type where the races just sit in the head lugs. The Continental style that replaced it are the more modern pressed in type.
Nice bike tho! However, with that headset type and that gearing set up, (ie not much difference in the Simplex style front rings and are there two cables going to the rear derailleur? more of a 50's set up?)I am surprised the builder dated it that late but he built it mind you so he should know.
If there are two cables to the rear changer and it is a Simplex (actually any make really) that would date the changer at least into the mid to late 50's as they worried about chain tension a lot then so had a second cable to fiddle with the chain tension while they used the other one to change gear. Might be a TDF or a JUY 51?
The addition of the reflectors tends to infer that it has been used for other than racing duties in its later life....

Cheers

Richard

[quote="GaryF"] I think the headset is called a continental headset. Love the holes in the lugs too.
P.S. I looked through my old decals and they are all impossible to photocopy or scan due to their paper/card backing.
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Postby Mulger bill » Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:10 pm

Methinks Karen, GaryF, Kid Carbine, 5*Rolf and a few others should all get their heads together and write a definitive history of bicycles and cycling in Australia, this sort of history must not be allowed to fade.

An 84yo bloke offering lifetime warranty repair on one of his 30+yo frames. I dips me lid to a fine old gentleman :)

Shaun
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Postby cludence » Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:02 pm

I suspect it may be older than he thinks. It would be difficult given he wasnt looking at the bike. The headset I think may be english but I have yet to clean off the paint and have a better look.

The person who originally identified the frame said it would be at least 40 yrs old so that puts it in the sixties era.

I will clean it up and hopefully then will know more.

Methinks Karen, GaryF, Kid Carbine, 5*Rolf and a few others should all get their heads together and write a definitive history of bicycles and cycling in Australia, this sort of history must not be allowed to fade.


I have been keeping a record of the info I hear about but mostly I only hear stories of what they got up to 'back in the old days.' I have just been very lucky I have come across some of these guys and had the time to sit and chat with them.

With so many different eras and styles of bikes, it makes it difficult as some collectors/enthusiasts never cross paths.

No doubt the bike museum in Canberra would have a great deal of info and so would Kid, Gary and Rolf as well as several others who are not on the forum.

Karen.
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Postby Kid_Carbine » Thu Jan 31, 2008 10:16 am

It's an English headset & would therefore be dated 'up to' sometime in the mid 50's

The supply of older type headlugs did not simply evaporate overnight & there are still some who would have a few laying about. There must surely have been at least some buyers of new custom built frames who would prefer the old ways, so I would speculate that bespoke frame builders would have still used them at customers specific request for some years after they were first seen on production bikes in the mid 50's but this would have fallen away fairly quickly

This means that there would be a tiny chance that it's later than 1957, but I wouldn't be betting the house on it.
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Postby 5 Star Rolf » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:26 pm

My guesstimate is late 30's early 40's with consideration to head lugs and stem... other parts could have been upgraded or changed in time, obviously the brakes and saddle were. I would suggest the headstem is original as the stem was probably the most difficult to remove. The stems style of lug also looks 'handmade' by the framebuilder...worth the question to him Karen.
Nice bike all round,- congratulations...again!

Ride safe, cheers, 5*R :wink: .
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Postby cludence » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:46 pm

Hi Rolf,

From what I have been told, this type of stem was often handmade by the builder. I will check when I speak with him next.

Apparently he phoned my friend last night and was quite chuffed to hear after all these years someone remembers his bikes. I will be in contact with him again shortly and have asked for some more info on his frame building days. He also did a great deal of cycling riding with many well known riders in his time.

He is known for writing long letters so it could provide some great stories. He lives alone so whilst it will give us some great history, I think it means more to him being involved with the bikes again.

I will keep you posted.

Karen.
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Postby Kid_Carbine » Thu Jan 31, 2008 7:10 pm

Rolf. The shape of the lower head lug is widely regarded as a post war style & I'm talking about the 'bell' where the lower head race sits, so this one would be in the 1946 to about 1957 era.
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Postby mikesbytes » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:39 pm

How does the front deralier work? Karen, can you post a pic
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Postby cludence » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:47 pm

Hi Mike,

It doesnt work as it is missing. Looks like someone got halfway through a bodge job and gave up.

Karen.
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