Living with a velomobile

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Aushiker
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Sun Jan 12, 2014 11:47 am

Rhubarb wrote:Here's a velomobile video that will bring a tear to your eye: ... On the upside, I think this reinforced the safety side of a velomobile. The front end effectively acted as crumple zone to absorb much of the impact. This damamge was caused by a head on collision with a BMW X5, fortunately on a corner so both vehicles weren't travelling too fast. The velomobile apparently hit black ice (in Germany) and just slid across into the other lane and the oncoming vehicle. The rider went to hospital to have his foot x-rayed but it was found to be just a severe sprain.
Lucky rider.

Andrew

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Riggsbie » Sun Jan 12, 2014 12:05 pm

Rhubarb wrote:Here's a velomobile video that will bring a tear to your eye:



On the upside, I think this reinforced the safety side of a velomobile. The front end effectively acted as crumple zone to absorb much of the impact. This damamge was caused by a head on collision with a BMW X5, fortunately on a corner so both vehicles weren't travelling too fast. The velomobile apparently hit black ice (in Germany) and just slid across into the other lane and the oncoming vehicle. The rider went to hospital to have his foot x-rayed but it was found to be just a severe sprain.
Imagine how it would have been if you were on a 'normal' bike colliding with an X5, you'd have more than a sprained ankle !

The mirror covers come from the Flatlands.....


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burnt
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby burnt » Mon Jan 13, 2014 6:42 pm

3 out of 4 of the fibreglass hoops in the wheelcovers on the Mango have broken since delivery. I was able to find some 1m 3mm carbon fibre rod to make new ones-but they require 2 joins. For 1 join I need about a 1.22m length, but have been unable to source anything locally except the 1m lengths.

Short of buying the carbon fibre wheel covers, any ideas where I can get the rod in excess of 1m? The 2 joins work, but it makes it twice as likely to fail again!

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby eldavo » Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:29 pm

Reminds me of fibreglass whip antennas that are black coated and can come in long lengths.
I made an archery bow out of one as a kid with slots in the ends hacksawed to tension some curtain cord.
Another idea is the fold-out tent flexible frame connections that would allow you to keep the covers rigid, or removed and folded compactly.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:40 pm

Terry, I have the same problem.
Temporary cure was a longer length of brass tube. Unfortunately it will
no doubt fail again soon.
I've been thinking of using a piece of piano wire instead. It would need two joins
as it is probably only available in 1m lengths. I'll overlap, bind with fuse wire and solder.
Must remember to slip some heat shrink tube on first to cover the solder joins.
I may put some plastic tubing all the way round if I find some suitable.
The downside will be a marginal extra bit of weight at the rim where its not wanted
but I doubt it will be noticeable.
I don't think the wire would need to be more than 16 gauge or so. About 1.5 to 2 mm thickish.
That should be a permanent cure.
Edit: Down the page here is how to make the covers like we have. Suggests fibreglass kite spar or Aluminium rod.
http://www.wisil.recumbents.com/wisil/w ... eldisk.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Thu Jan 23, 2014 9:14 pm

Duplicate post from commuting thread, but relevant here:

Awesome commuting home in the wet tonight in my velomobile. Even when its teaming down and I'm riding without my hood, my shoes and shorts remain lovely and dry.

I did however discover a new and unexpected hazard. I almost gave myself an enema on my way home, after misjudging the depth of a puddle at 30km/hr in my velomobile. From the outside it would have looked like "The Log Ride" at Dreamworld. From the inside, the footholes just scooped up the water and sent it all straight up the legs of my shorts. :-(

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby ldrcycles » Thu Jan 23, 2014 9:22 pm

Rhubarb wrote:Duplicate post from commuting thread, but relevant here:

Awesome commuting home in the wet tonight in my velomobile. Even when its teaming down and I'm riding without my hood, my shoes and shorts remain lovely and dry.

I did however discover a new and unexpected hazard. I almost gave myself an enema on my way home, after misjudging the depth of a puddle at 30km/hr in my velomobile. From the outside it would have looked like "The Log Ride" at Dreamworld. From the inside, the footholes just scooped up the water and sent it all straight up the legs of my shorts. :-(
That sounds like fun :lol: .
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Road Record Association of Australia

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:31 am

Repost from commuting thread, but this is "Living with a velomobile" .....


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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Roinik » Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:40 am

Rhubarb wrote: Regarding the physical distance / time challenge, I think its very do-able. Google Maps tells me its 1500kms, relatively flat, even slightly downhill. Assuming he takes 3 x 10 hour breaks for sleeping at night, that leaves 60 hours over 4 days at just 25km/hr to cover the distance in the overall time of 90 hours. 25km/hr should be very easy to do, provided he is of reasonable fitness. If his fitness is high, he might average as much as 40km/hr or more.
Last time I checked it was 3050 from Darwin to Adelaide. Assuming that he has 4 hours sleep per day, that leaves 78 hours travelling time or 39 km/hr average speed. It's mostly flat with a couple of lumps around Alice and a couple around Lochiel/Snowtown. If he's fit, he'll have to maintain 45 km/h travelling speed in the Milan for the entire distance. I suspect that a fit person should be able to make that happen in a Milan during August. August will see more low pressure systems over SA so the wind may be a crosswind from the west before Pt Augusta and then a tailwind into Adelaide. If the fastest solar team can do the Darwin-Adelaide at speeds up to 130 km/h then it should be able to be done in 90 hours with lots of bananas consumed.

Are there any contact details for this future pilot? Maybe we can drum up some welcoming party through Adelaide Cyclists and BikeSA. I'll let our cycling politician know as well as the City of Adelaide. Victoria Square is now finished and we're wrapping up the TDU so I think the ACC might be interested in something for August.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:55 am

Roinik wrote: Last time I checked it was 3050 from Darwin to Adelaide.
Andrew's original post on this quoted "Alice Springs to Darwin". I'm not sure which it is.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Sat Jan 25, 2014 9:00 am

Roinik wrote: Are there any contact details for this future pilot?
I don't know him personally but I understand its Mark Textor, chairman of the Amy Gillett Foundation. He has posted a couple of times on other velomobile forums. He will definitely be looking for publicity though (I think that's the purpose of the ride) so I will contact him via the other channels to get him to create a thread here with the details.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby trailgumby » Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:37 am

Maybe we should see if we can get the Indonesian ambassador to see him off.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:53 am

Rhubarb wrote:
Roinik wrote: Last time I checked it was 3050 from Darwin to Adelaide.
Andrew's original post on this quoted "Alice Springs to Darwin". I'm not sure which it is.
From Mark himself in a Tweet to me ...

ordering a Milan SL Carbon special this week. Alice spring to Darwin in 90hrs attempt in August for AGF / road safety. Billboard!


BTW he has now ordered it and paid the deposit.

He rides both recumbents and diamond frames and has a bit of a fleet.

Andrew

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Sat Jan 25, 2014 1:29 pm

Rhubarb wrote:Repost from commuting thread, but this is "Living with a velomobile" .....
Hi Rhubarb,
Couldn't help but recall this when I saw your vid and leaving the roadie in the dust.
Very unfair of you. :mrgreen:

In my case though its the kids on BMX's laughing as they pass me in the Mango. :cry:

From about 3.30 on. Rotovelo Vs Roadie.



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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Riggsbie » Sat Jan 25, 2014 10:07 pm

Fellow Mangonites.....l

My Mango has really started knocking badly at the back under power......seems to be from the left side a the back when you are riding....no noise when coasting....reduces with higher cadence and low load.....

Any ideas ?


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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Riggsbie » Sat Jan 25, 2014 10:14 pm

I am guessing it is something to do with the cheap left handed freewheel hub......


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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Sat Jan 25, 2014 10:16 pm

Is there any play in the rear swing arm? Is the rear wheel axle bolt tight? Maybe bearings?

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Sun Jan 26, 2014 12:52 am

Yes. Check the rear axle bolt.
I recall some discussion about it coming loose and causing noise on BROL.
Also worth checking round the rear swing arm joint.
Mine has made a tickety tick noise when pedaling from new and I've yet to find the cause.
Might be worth posting the question on BROL where Harry might see it and respond.
John

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Sun Jan 26, 2014 8:43 am

or just email Sinner / Harry direct. Harry will respond pretty quickly.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Roinik » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:27 am

Rhubarb wrote:
Roinik wrote: Last time I checked it was 3050 from Darwin to Adelaide.
Andrew's original post on this quoted "Alice Springs to Darwin". I'm not sure which it is.
Your are correct. My bad for reading things without paying too much attention. Darwin - Adelaide in 90 hrs is actually a challenge worth the publicity. Heck, it's even worth a team challenge like the Solar Challenge.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby zebee » Mon Jan 27, 2014 8:13 am

May as well post here rather than start a new...

A Velo has been on my list of things I'd like but can't justify.

That's probably still true, but hey....

What I don't know is what it is like in humidity. Most of the velos I know about are in Melbourne and I don't think the weather there gets as humid as Sydney on average.

Also, when does the advantage of a velo kick in compared to an unfaired trike? Do you need to be fit enough to maintain 30kmh+ pushing that weight through the air for it to be worth it?

Flying Furniture have long curcing screens they say are better in the Oz climate because you get more airflow than in a fully enclosed velo and they provide practically the same aero advantages, what does the panel think?

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:41 pm

Ok - so I have a Sinner Mango Sport (Red Edition) velomobile. I have owned this for 18 months (ie 2 summers) and have now done 9500kms of mostly commuting in Brisbane. My velomobile is my daily, all weather commuter. I commuted via road bike for 3 years before that. So I feel qualified to respond :-)

Firstly, justification. I think we all go through this. I know for me it was a lot of money. We're a 1 income family so there were times I felt guilty spending $12k on a bike, when my roadie was still in good nick. All feelings of guilt disappeared the day it arrived. If it was stolen or destroyed tomorrow, I would definitely spend the insurance payout on another one. No doubt at all.

Re humidity, I've never lived in Sydney but I can't imagine its hotter or more humid than Brisbane :-) The mornings here are 95% humidity even in winter. So long as you pick a velomobile with sufficient ventilation you'll be fine. I normally ride without my hood, except when its very cold or raining. I just like the open feeling of head out riding. This also means I don't heat up when I stop. If you're working reasonably hard, you simply couldn't stop in a fully enclosed velomobile for more than 30 secs without steaming it up. The Trisled Avatar is impractical for this reason, where as the Trisled Rotovelo, mango, quest etc have sufficient ventilation even when stopped.

Everyone thinks the velomobile must be hot. But even here in Brisbane, on my 18.5km / 40 minute commute, I don't even bother carrying water anymore, since I was not needing it. The protection from the sun helps a lot I think.

The advantage of a velomobile comes in when you can build and maintain momentum, since the aero benefits increase with speed. In stop / start riding the weight is a penalty. It all depends on your route too. Climbing hills are slower, but then the speed is too great downhill and you may have to ride the brakes to stay under speed limits etc. If you ride mainly bikepaths, other bikes will hold you up on downhills too so you may not be able to use your speed advantage.

2 thirds of my commute is hilly and quite stop-start / speed limited. The last third is open and flat, but often there is too much traffic to just roll through at 50km/hr. So even on an 18.5km commute, I am only maybe 5 minutes faster than I was on my road bike. On a flat open road, I could maintain 45km/hr. But who commutes via a flat open road ? The more I see of the bikepaths in Perth, the more I think a velomobile would be ideal there. Particularly punching into headwinds.

I've never ridden an open trike with a FF fairing so can't comment with any authority about their aerodynamic capabilities. They don't appear to provide the other advantages of a shell though, like full weather protection (wind, sun and rain), luggage space, road visibility, enclosed drivetrain etc. Even without my hood, my velomobile keeps my shoes and shorts nice and dry in the rain. Only my chest,shoulders and head get wet. Even my backpack and laptop remain dry stowed away behind the seat.

I hope this helps. There is a rotovelo in Sydney if you want to try to meet up. I think I really made my mind up the day Nitramluap (Australia's first mango owner) rode my commute with me and I found I couldn't keep up with him. It also helped me believe it could handle my hills (up to 18%) and the gutters / ramps etc I have to contend with. It also settled all my safety concerns, which I laugh at now since I feel the velomobile is considerably safer and more visible than other bike on the road.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Riggsbie » Mon Jan 27, 2014 5:24 pm

I agree with Rhu's comments.....

The only down point from my 18months of ownership would be the noise......the roads around Geelong are coarse chip and rough as a Badger's ar$e and the shell noise from the stiff carbon body can be awful......it's a lot better with the Risse rear shock but with the race hood fitted I have to wear earplugs or iPod......

Other than that the Mango is brilliant.......

The Mango is faster than a quick 2 wheeled recumbent but not by much, my Musashi is my fastest lowest effort bike I own......yesterday I did a 150km non stop ride and averaged 28.2kph for 5.5 hours for an ave HR of 128bpm.....the Mango would have a 31.5 kph average for 145bpm average over a similar distance....

Sometimes I find the Mango can be a bit fatiguing mainly due to the noise.....also avoiding road debris can be a challenge with 3 wheels.....but you soon learn to pick a safe line !

Even roadie's are starting to appreciate the speed of the Mango, and I often get called "The Pace Car".....

Need to get some Osymetrics on the Mango next ;-)


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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby zebee » Tue Jan 28, 2014 7:06 pm

Rhubarb wrote:
Re humidity, I've never lived in Sydney but I can't imagine its hotter or more humid than Brisbane :-) The mornings here are 95% humidity even in winter. So long as you pick a velomobile with sufficient ventilation you'll be fine. I normally ride without my hood, except when its very cold or raining. I just like the open feeling of head out riding. This also means I don't heat up when I stop. If you're working reasonably hard, you simply couldn't stop in a fully enclosed velomobile for more than 30 secs without steaming it up. The Trisled Avatar is impractical for this reason, where as the Trisled Rotovelo, mango, quest etc have sufficient ventilation even when stopped.
Fair enough! I vaguely recalled you were in Brisbane.

Rhubarb wrote: The advantage of a velomobile comes in when you can build and maintain momentum, since the aero benefits increase with speed. In stop / start riding the weight is a penalty. It all depends on your route too. Climbing hills are slower, but then the speed is too great downhill and you may have to ride the brakes to stay under speed limits etc. If you ride mainly bikepaths, other bikes will hold you up on downhills too so you may not be able to use your speed advantage.

Yeah... my commute is about 2/3 bike path. Can be more road if there was a reason. (Would have to be, as there are bollards on the path in a couple of places that a trike has to be lifted over)
There is a bit of up and down though. Mostly not too much of a problem on the Bacchetta Giro except for That Bastard Hill which I have only once managed to do without stopping.

MInd you... it's a hoot in the other direction!

I do worry about the size of a velo on the paths though. I suspect it would be a bit wide for the Copenhagen lanes in the city in peak for example, and it would take up quite a lot of the Shrimpton Ck path.

Rhubarb wrote: I've never ridden an open trike with a FF fairing so can't comment with any authority about their aerodynamic capabilities. They don't appear to provide the other advantages of a shell though, like full weather protection (wind, sun and rain), luggage space, road visibility, enclosed drivetrain etc. Even without my hood, my velomobile keeps my shoes and shorts nice and dry in the rain. Only my chest,shoulders and head get wet. Even my backpack and laptop remain dry stowed away behind the seat.
It's the protection that interests me, that and the storage.

Usually if I get wet I get wet. It's a commute with showers and changing/drying available both ends so I just wear wool and get wet. But it can be a bit miserable!

I think it would have been a better deal a couple of years ago when I was going into North Sydney. Not as much up and down, and fewer facilities.

I would love to try one but I am seriously vertically challenged (5'2" in the old money) and so borrowing 'bents tends to not work very well. They usually can't be set up so I can reach the pedals! (It's why I ride a Bacchetta: they were the only ones who made a bike small enough for me)

And a velo would have the extra problem of seeing over the edge.... It's a shame because I'd have to get one custom made and there's no way I'd spend that money without trying one.

MInd you if I win the lottery I could get one made to my specs. Have to be a lottery win because they'd have to make the molds for me.

Zebee

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby recumbenteer » Tue Jan 28, 2014 7:58 pm

G'day zebee....

Well, I'm the Sydney Velonaut.
I have owned a Trisled Rotovelo for quite a while and find it an absolute blast to tear around in.

I might be biased in saying that, as I've owned a Trisled Cool Cruza (unfaired) trike since 2000, racking up well over 35 000kms. I commuted daily clocking 12000km for one year.The Cool Cruza has no suspension, nor does the RV, therefore I haven't missed a suspended ride.

Regarding the Rotovelo....
I'm a "heavy sweater" when riding anyway, so the humidity makes it pretty wet inside. I carry at least 5-6 bidons every ride. As long as I keep moving the airflow keeps me "cooler", but the enjoyment I get from riding it, outweighs the discomfort. Although it steams up a bit when having to stop after a decent effort. I have a Flevobike Velomobile Roof fitted, for sun protection, which steams up a little on humid mornings when first setting out...I'm hoping some Rainex will deal with that issue. I have clear vision below this screen anyway.

The aero (for me) kicks in immediately. I noticed the difference the very first time I rode the RV.
On the Cool Cruza my avg speed is 20-22km/h on the RV its 25-28km/h or higher depending on the "undulations"


"The advantage of a velomobile comes in when you can build and maintain momentum, since the aero benefits increase with speed. In stop / start riding the weight is a penalty. It all depends on your route too. Climbing hills are slower, but then the speed is too great downhill and you may have to ride the brakes to stay under speed limits etc. If you ride mainly bikepaths, other bikes will hold you up on downhills too so you may not be able to use your speed advantage." AGREED!!....

The RV is roto-moulded HDPE and therefore is much quieter than those made of fibreglass etc., It can withstand a HUGE amount of punishment from "nose scrapes" on gutters/spoon drains/ramps as well.

Its a "crowd magnet" every time you're out in it....you MUST be prepared for "20 Questions" EVERY time you stop.... be it for a rest or just caught up in traffic.

I ride both on shared paths, foot paths, and the road. No issues with width ... everyone sees me coming, and moves out of the way.... its the "deaf" peds that are too busy chatting, or zoned out on their iPods that are a pain! I use an old fashioned bicycle bell, when coming up on peds, as most will then at least, expect a bicycle of some description.... and are then shocked out of the way when the RV flies past.

I'm also 6'2 and find the RV a very comfortable fit. Plenty of room
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