Living with a velomobile

Recumbents and all feet forward machines

Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Wed May 22, 2013 8:33 pm

I recall a post on some recumbent forum somewhere, where a guy was shown an image similar to the one on the t-shirt below:

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To which he responded, "All it needs now is a recumbent on the end."

To which his mate replied, "Which end?"
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by BNA » Mon May 27, 2013 11:35 am

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Bartek » Mon May 27, 2013 11:35 am

Stopped by the Police again last night on the way home from work. :(

They took my details and will get back to me if they find out I am doing anything wrong or that the Mango is not legal :shock:

Edit: Hopefully I won't hear from them........but it would be better if they also got back to me to tell me everything is ok.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Baalzamon » Mon May 27, 2013 2:01 pm

:shock:
It's a bike.... technically
So need to wear a helmet
have rear reflector tick
rear lights tick
front headlights tick
front reflector white?
pedal reflectors YEAH right, recumbent and they are enclosed.....
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Mon May 27, 2013 2:12 pm

That's ridiculous. I can accept they may want to pull you over to confirm whether its motorised or not (since they can't see you pedalling) but having established that, it is no less a bike than any other pedal trike. What is there to check?

With horn, indicators, mirrors etc, its actually more "road worthy" than it legally needs to be.

PS If you get done for pedal reflectors, I'd be challenging that in court.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby find_bruce » Mon May 27, 2013 2:16 pm

Bartek wrote:Stopped by the Police again last night on the way home from work. :(

They took my details and will get back to me if they find out I am doing anything wrong or that the Mango is not legal :shock:

Edit: Hopefully I won't hear from them........but it would be better if they also got back to me to tell me everything is ok.

Any idea what they thought might be the problem ? As I understand it, the Australian Standard AS/NZS 1927:1998 (1) only applies at the time of sale (2) does not apply to recumbent bicycles & (3) I think it may also be limited to 2 wheel bicycles.

The road rules do apply, but only require an effective brake & a bell (Australian road rule 258, WA Traffic Code 224(2)), lights etc if you are ridding at night (Australian road rule 259, WA Traffic Code 224(1), (2A) & (2B)) & a helmet or exemption (Australian road rule 256, WA Traffic Code 222).

About the only thing I can see that might cause you any trouble is a West Australia specific law, being the requirement to have wheel reflectors (WA Traffic Code 224(2A)) and pedal reflectors (WA Traffic Code 224(2B)). As baalzamon says, it is a pretty stupid requirement for a velomobile.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Mulger bill » Mon May 27, 2013 6:10 pm

Bartek wrote:Stopped by the Police again last night on the way home from work. :(

They took my details and will get back to me if they find out I am doing anything wrong or that the Mango is not legal :shock:

Edit: Hopefully I won't hear from them........but it would be better if they also got back to me to tell me everything is ok.


Sad really.

I know Plod has a job to do but it sounds like borderline harrassment to me. (Or: "Wow, that looks pretty cool, I'll pull him up to ask some questions and have an ogle but I'll make it sound official so I don't come across as a nerd.")
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Roinik » Mon May 27, 2013 8:57 pm

If he pulls you over again, make sure you get his name and number. He's legally required to provide you with this if you request it. Take note of the time, date and location of all incidents and if it is a repeat then report it to the police Internal Investigations division or better, the commissioner. The police are legally required to follow up these sorts of complaints. My old man was pulled over near Adventure World for having a blue dot in the tail light lens of his old car (totally original item). Dad explained that it was part of the original vehicle, of which Mr Plod wasn't having a piece of because it was a street rod. To cut a long story short, dad reported it to our friend who happened to be Acting Supt of Internal Investigations (who owned a 1939 street rod at the time). The Police had been waiting for someone to make a complaint on this bloke. Next time, all dad got was a stern look as he drove past. I don't know whether you have anyone like this in your contact list.

A little less extreme would be to do as has been done on other forums and go into the cop shop for a bit of show and tell and make them aware of what they're looking at. Proactive is often easier and better accepted than reactive (it makes a good story though).
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby burnt » Mon May 27, 2013 10:27 pm

Wow-and I thought Queensland was backward!!
Remind them it was passed as completely roadworthy in Qld, that should help!!
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Tue May 28, 2013 1:39 am

Bartek wrote:Stopped by the Police again last night on the way home from work. :(

They took my details and will get back to me if they find out I am doing anything wrong or that the Mango is not legal :shock:

Edit: Hopefully I won't hear from them........but it would be better if they also got back to me to tell me everything is ok.


Fremantle police?

I have the Road Traffic Code on my mobile phone ... In such a case I would remind them politely of regulation 3 of Code which defines a bicycle as ....

bicycle means a vehicle with 2 or more wheels that is built to be propelled by human power through a belt, chain or gears (whether or not it has an auxiliary motor) and —
(a) includes a pedicab, penny-farthing and tricycle; but
(b) does not include a wheelchair, wheeled recreational device, wheeled toy or any vehicle with an auxiliary motor capable of generating a power output over 200 watts (whether or not the motor is operating).


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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Roinik » Tue May 28, 2013 7:26 am

burnt wrote:Remind them it was passed as completely roadworthy in Qld, that should help!!


Terry,
You forget one thing. Qld is in 'The Eastern States' and isn't WA. Sometimes it's a complete world away.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby chuckchunder » Tue May 28, 2013 11:51 am

find_bruce wrote:
Bartek wrote:Stopped by the Police again last night on the way home from work. :(

They took my details and will get back to me if they find out I am doing anything wrong or that the Mango is not legal :shock:

Edit: Hopefully I won't hear from them........but it would be better if they also got back to me to tell me everything is ok.

Any idea what they thought might be the problem ? As I understand it, the Australian Standard AS/NZS 1927:1998 (1) only applies at the time of sale (2) does not apply to recumbent bicycles & (3) I think it may also be limited to 2 wheel bicycles.

The road rules do apply, but only require an effective brake & a bell (Australian road rule 258, WA Traffic Code 224(2)), lights etc if you are ridding at night (Australian road rule 259, WA Traffic Code 224(1), (2A) & (2B)) & a helmet or exemption (Australian road rule 256, WA Traffic Code 222).

About the only thing I can see that might cause you any trouble is a West Australia specific law, being the requirement to have wheel reflectors (WA Traffic Code 224(2A)) and pedal reflectors (WA Traffic Code 224(2B)). As baalzamon says, it is a pretty stupid requirement for a velomobile.


And the real bummer for velos and bent trikes under Section 6 of the WA Road Traffic (Bicycles) Regulations 2002, a rear brake.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Tue May 28, 2013 12:12 pm

chuckchunder wrote:And the real bummer for velos and bent trikes under Section 6 of the WA Road Traffic (Bicycles) Regulations 2002, a rear brake.


Good catch as it highlights yet another discrepancy in the regulations as the Road Traffic Code 2000 as at April 13, 2013 only requires one effective brake.

224. Lights and other equipment on bicycles
(2) A person shall not ride a bicycle that does not have — (a) at least one effective brake; and
(b) a bell, horn, or similar warning device, in working order.


This modification to the regulations was amended as per the Gazette 30 Aug 2011 p. 3518.

So which applies? The Road Traffic Code or the WA Road Traffic (Bicycles) Regulation 2002?
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Xenon » Tue May 28, 2013 1:47 pm

Wouldn't it be far easier to duck down to the local police station and have a quick chat?

You're going to stand out, you are likely to get pulled over.

Perhaps you could even get a letter from a senior officer saying that you are legal?
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Riggsbie » Tue May 28, 2013 2:03 pm

You guys seem unlucky.....

I have still not been pulled over by the Victorian cops......have ridden past many.......

I like the comment about lights because I would say 30 - 40% of the cars on the road down here in Victoria only have one functioning light and as for indicators.......they must be optional on cars here......

Had some fun at Casey Fields criterium track on Sunday here is my Strava link:

http://app.strava.com/activities/56345692

I managed hold a steady 39 kph average (not including the cool down laps at the end) and my best lap was 42.9 kph.....
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Tue May 28, 2013 11:00 pm

When I first got the Mango I showed it to a couple of coppers who happened to be nearby. Told them to let the rest know so I wouldn't be pulled over.
One guy was very interested but thought it should have an amber reflective stripe down each side.

After that I had a few others had a sticky but only when I was stopped somewhere such as the local donut van. I did ask about the problem with the hood that there is little room for a helmet. They said they wouldn't book me but they could'nd say what the boys in traffic would do. :D
I notice that whenever they go by they always take a good look. Then again so do a lot of other motorists.
As to other rules there is or was one about the maximum height of the handlebars above the seat.
This could be a problem for a number of recumbents. Another is the fork rake. There is or was a WA rule that was brought in way back when kids were raking forks and making bikes dangerous. On my LWB the rake is in excess of that max but is needed to get the trail right and make the steering safe. The rules for DF's just don't always fit Bents. A rear brake on a tadpole trike can be quite dangerous for example.

Not in in Aus but in at least one US state there is a rule about how high pedals can be. This was to outlaw Penny farthings but it now works against HiRacer type Bents if enforced.

If common sense prevails then there is no problem but the laws are certainly in need of modification. Unfortunately when this happens the rules are usually decided by people who know little or nothing about the subject.

John
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Tue May 28, 2013 11:10 pm

Sounds like a great day out Riggsbie. Were you riding with others or alone?

I'm envious of the speeds you guys manage. I went out today and made a moving average of 20 kmh into town with a max of 53 and thought that was pretty good. By the time I got home though the hilly bits had dropped the average to 16 kmh for a total distance of 14 km. Thats still better than I manage on my trike and the Velo is quite a bit heavier.
Had a young lady approach and ask what the cool car was. She was quite disappointed when I told her it was a bike. "You mean you have to pedal it?" she asked. She didn't think it was so cool after that.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Riggsbie » Wed May 29, 2013 7:04 pm

The reason I went to Casey Fields was because Trisled were there testing some new riders/drivers......it is just up the road from the Trisled HQ !

So there were 2 or 3 Aquilas going around, I think there was an Avatar, a trike and a 2 wheeler recumbent (VeloRossi)....

They regularly hold training/tryout sessions.

Good work John, good to see you are still able to get out and about !

I mix up my riding, so been riding all my recumbents (Musashi, Vortex, Mango).....almost got to 1000km for May. I am really enjoying my Musashi a lot more now.....yesterday was cruising (heavy cold, cough, sore throat) and managed a 29.5 kph average on a 60km ride with an average heart rate of 129bpm....I love the efficiency.....


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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Wed May 29, 2013 11:17 pm

Hi Riggsbie,
That all makes me more envious han before. I'm going to have to get over that way some time and visit TriSled and see some of the action.

My HR (with the meds) jumps within a minute of startin any activity to around 120 then stays there. At least it doen't keep going up like it used to. Annoys me a bit because I should be making a bit of effort to be at that level.
Take it the 1000km is all round.

I must have had my Mango a bit over a year because I rode it down to the Classic Motor Races last yera and they are on again this coming weekend. Its a round the houses event. Also some hill climbs on Saturday so might go look.
Anyway the point was to go check the Mango's odometer. Just did that and find I've only made 792 km in the time I've owned it. Had a fair period last year where I Couldn't ride much at all.
Like you like to ride all my bents but the trike seems to get the most use as I tow the trailer with the dog or take it to bring home bales of hay and stuff from the feed place.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Bartek » Fri May 31, 2013 10:38 pm

I think this was mentioned before, but I don't recall seeing any decent pictures. Sinner have advertised on their site a new Aero top for the Mango = 730 euro

looks like this

http://www.sinnerbikes.com/wordpress/wp ... -Mango.pdf

I wonder when we will see the first one "on the road"
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Sat Jun 01, 2013 7:17 pm

That might help with the purported crosswind problem.
Be interesting to see it on the velo.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Bartek » Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:17 pm

Sinner has posted some pictures of a Mango fitted with the new 'Aero' top on their facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... =3&theater

I dont think you need to be on Facebook to look at them
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Riggsbie » Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:18 am

An expensive upgrade....

The $10 rubber sealing strip works pretty well for me, obviously does nothing for those big gusts but works well on a constant sidewind !


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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:20 pm

So I guess the question is : Will this be the new normal top for Mango or just an option?
Shouldn't cost more to make so I can't see a price difference unless for the cool factor.
Be interesting to see how many decide to make the change and upgrade.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:06 pm

John Lewis wrote:So I guess the question is : Will this be the new normal top for Mango or just an option?


Option I believe.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby recumbenteer » Sun Jun 09, 2013 7:45 pm

Looks like I'm being noticed in the Sydney Scene 8) 8)

http://www.bicycles.net.au/forums/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=64797

see page 2
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