2015 Tour de France

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Chuck
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Chuck » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:59 pm

jasonc wrote:despite what they were saying on the footage, froome did crack


It's all relative I suppose but when I think of "cracking" I think of someone losing minutes to all of his main rivals (ala Landis in 06 and Cadel a couple of times between 08 and 2011) not 30 seconds to one of his rivals and actually gaining time on all the others in the top ten bar Nibali. Sure Quintana had him under the pump but it was a pretty decent save imo. I'm sure he'll be expecting more of the same tonight
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JPB
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby JPB » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:06 pm

RonK wrote:Dunno about that. I recall that LA famously actually waited for Jan Ullrich when he flubbed a corner, ran off the road and crashed.


Not sure LA is a good example of chivalry in cycling, he knew he could wait because he had a bit more tiger in the tank than the others.
Or better tiger if you go with the belief that everyone was doing it.

I think the chivalry is getting pushed into the background by the money in the sport. How many team owners would choose chivalry from their riders over a stage win?

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Chuck
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Chuck » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:10 pm

RonK wrote:Dunno about that. I recall that LA famously actually waited for Jan Ullrich when he flubbed a corner, ran off the road and crashed.


One of the bigger myths in cycling. When Ullrich crashed there was still a long way to go on the stage and a couple of big climbs, Armstrong was smart enough to know that he would use up a lot of energy needlessly being out in "no mans land" on his own and sat up and waited for the next group on the road, which happened to be a group containing Beloki, and he tacked on. Ullrich then caught back up with that group thanks in big part to the help of a teammate. No one was waiting, why should they.
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Grgic » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:43 pm

It's gunna be a huge night!

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Grgic » Sat Jul 25, 2015 11:17 pm

Wow that first HC was fantastic. Alpe-d'Huez is going to be epic!

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Grog
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Grog » Sun Jul 26, 2015 12:41 am

Well that was an impressive stage. Thoroughly riveting to watch.

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby rodneycc » Sun Jul 26, 2015 12:43 am

Last edited by rodneycc on Sun Jul 26, 2015 12:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby find_bruce » Sun Jul 26, 2015 12:58 am

Worth staying up for- Quintana left nothing on the road - will next year be his?

Ironic to see Nibali have a mechanical - no one was going to wait for him

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Grgic » Sun Jul 26, 2015 12:59 am

Fantastic stage. Well done to Quintana for making it interesting, can't believe his constant attacks over the last few days. Froome was lucky he had support up that last climb with Poels and Porte pacing him but congrats to him for the overall win (barring something dramatic happening tomorrow).

Fairly certain i saw someone try to shirt front Richie on one of the hairpins that last climb...

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby gabrielle260 » Sun Jul 26, 2015 1:04 am

Once again Froome got spat at. I can't believe the commentators missed it - or, for that matter, the police. Froome even looked back to see who did it.
Disgusting!

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby edsa » Sun Jul 26, 2015 1:07 am

someone made a gif of it already, its the first few seconds on the bottom left http://gfycat.com/FrighteningCompetentDove
cyclinghubtv has a video clip of it

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby gabrielle260 » Sun Jul 26, 2015 1:12 am

Thanks Edsa. It appears to be some idiot wearing polka dot t shirt and cap. It was just before the barriers started.

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Derny Driver » Sun Jul 26, 2015 1:32 am

Yes great stage. Quintana has been great every stage. But for me Valverde has been the amazing one. I thought the guy was just a one day classics rider. He has been incredible up the hills, down them ...attacking. Been very smart too. Ive previously disliked him due to his schnivelling tactics in nearly every race he does, but Ive enjoyed watching him these 3 weeks and have a new regard for his ability.

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby danny the boy » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:02 am

The booing was disgraceful and on the biggest day of the race and what it means to the people of France I hope there is some fairly blunt messages in the local media about the shame the so-called fans are causing.

Nairo is only young but I hope Movistar can get him another older head in his domestiques. Has probably lost the tour on the back poor tactics. Has consistently shown now he is stronger than nearly everyone in the third week of tours.

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Grog » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:44 am

danny the boy wrote:The booing was disgraceful and on the biggest day of the race and what it means to the people of France I hope there is some fairly blunt messages in the local media about the shame the so-called fans are causing.
Unfortunately I've seen similar behaviour here in Oz, especially at car and motorcycle racing events. Hearing yobs booing someone on a win because they weren't their hero and even dares to be :shock: gasp! :shock:, foreign is pretty pathetic behaviour.

danny the boy wrote:Nairo is only young but I hope Movistar can get him another older head in his domestiques. Has probably lost the tour on the back poor tactics. Has consistently shown now he is stronger than nearly everyone in the third week of tours.
Think he played a clever strategy by just biding his time, ticking along mostly until he felt in a position to really hit ie: the Alps.

I thought it was a pretty good tour and enjoyed what I saw immensely. Personally found watching the downhill sections some of the most engrossing. Phenomenal handling skills.

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CKinnard
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby CKinnard » Sun Jul 26, 2015 10:53 am

another example from a TS mate who was there. He too had a cup of urine thrown at him (from behind) for just being there watching (wearing TS official clothing) http://t.co/WVMuqFlgGU
No doubt what nationality were behaving badly there.

I really get the impression people who behave like this could not be genuine cyclists with an appreciation for racing and athleticism, but just losers and pheads.

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby fat and old » Sun Jul 26, 2015 11:24 am

Bummer that Quintana and Valverde couldn't make the attack on croix de Fer stick. But you have to give Porte and Poels credit. Getting back up to carry the boss up the hill made his day.

Yeah, I would have been booing Froome. Not because my man didn't win, I just don't like the Sky automaton approach. Or the way his head bobs around like one of those dogs on your parcel shelf. Or the way he whined about being passed on a downhill by Valverde. Or the way he shoves people aside if he doesn't like what they're doing. Or the way his elbows stick out. And so on....

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby neild » Sun Jul 26, 2015 12:52 pm

It would be interesting to know who would be in the yellow if Froome didn't have Porte and Poels to pace him up the last climb. If it was just a one one one between Quintana and Froome it would have been awesome to see.
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Robinho » Sun Jul 26, 2015 2:43 pm

neild wrote:It would be interesting to know who would be in the yellow if Froome didn't have Porte and Poels to pace him up the last climb. If it was just a one one one between Quintana and Froome it would have been awesome to see.
if it was one on one then you'd have to have taken valverde out of the equation for putting himself up the road and a springboard and the other movistar rider Quintana caught later and used for pacing for a bit. As great as Quintana's ride was, it was every bit as much a team effort as Froome and Sky. Froome and Sky had set themselves up over 3 weeks to be able to pace themselves up the climb. Still, Quintana's ride was incredible to watch

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby neild » Sun Jul 26, 2015 3:59 pm

True. And don't get me wrong, Sky's effort was awesome. It's a team sport and they did exactly what was needed. I just think Quintana might very well have been in yellow if both had just been against each other. I thought he looked much better on the climb. Though I don't know how any of them are able to ride through the crowds like that with flags, flares and who knows what else. Crazy.
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby jasonc » Sun Jul 26, 2015 4:18 pm

quintana - what a rider!
and valverde has my respect now. far out. he just didn't give up for quintana the whole time
Image

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CKinnard
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby CKinnard » Sun Jul 26, 2015 7:12 pm

The belief that people get carried up hills is highly exaggerated imho.
You either have the watts/kg to get up the hill at a certain average speed, or you don't.

Froome avoids surging when climbing, and uses a higher cadence. When attacked he increases his speed slightly, but eventually catches the competition. Some see this as him being more fatigued or a weaker climber than Quintana, who would accelerate rapidly away from Froome.

However, averaged over the whole TdF, Quintana wasn't the stronger climber.

But many are mesmerized by the violent accelerations and the 1 minute gain he made on Froome in Stage 20.
They forget that Quintana couldn't or didn't stay with Froome in Stage 10.

Froome and Team Sky's success is due to their rising above the illusion of emotion and spectacle, and respecting the science that says

1.
the guy with the strongest power to weight ratio will climb quickest on average over multiple climbs. As we all know, there's no hiding on hills. The belief that one can be carried up hills by team mates is grossly exaggerated....just as Quintana's climbing superiority over Froome is. If he was the stronger climber, he would have climbed quicker on average. He didn't.

Froome's success is in large part to him being the leanest guy on the tour He has also stripped non essential lean tissue better than anyone else....hence why many think he looks like an alien.

2.
that the TdF winner has the lowest overall time. Time gained in the early and middle stages is just as important as time gained in the latter. But those more slave to emotion believe the later big climbing stages effect the race outcome more. They don't. Time is time. Froome won the race by going into stage 20 with 2m30s up his sleeve.

Team Sky respected the science beautifully in this TdF, and it paid off. And it's unfortunate that those who don't respect science, don't respect Team Sky's victory.
Last edited by CKinnard on Sun Jul 26, 2015 7:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Xplora
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby Xplora » Sun Jul 26, 2015 7:24 pm

The sad fact is that without tribalism and emotion, sport ceases to have relevance. No excitement, just a challenge for the riders. That's fine, but self focus is not interesting.

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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby biker jk » Sun Jul 26, 2015 7:27 pm

CKinnard wrote:The belief that people get carried up hills is highly exaggerated imho.
You either have the watts/kg to get up the hill at a certain average speed, or you don't.

Froome avoids surging when climbing, and uses a higher cadence. When attacked he increases his speed slightly, but eventually catches the competition. Some see this as him being more fatigued or a weaker climber than Quintana, who would accelerate rapidly away from Froome.

However, averaged over the whole TdF, Quintana wasn't the stronger climber.

But many are mesmerized by the violent accelerations and the 1 minute gain he made on Froome in Stage 20.

Froome and Team Sky's success is due to their rising above the illusion of emotion and spectacle, and respecting the science that says

1.
the guy with the strongest power to weight ratio will climb quickest on average over multiple climbs. As we all know, there's no hiding on hills. The belief that one can be carried up hills by team mates is grossly exaggerated....just as Quintana's climbing superiority over Froome is. If he was the stronger climber, he would have climbed quicker on average. He didn't.

Froome's success is in large part to him being the leanest guy on the tour He has also stripped non essential lean tissue better than anyone else....hence why many think he looks like an alien.

2.
that the TdF winner has the lowest overall time. Time gained in the early and middle stages is just as important as time gained in the latter. But those more slave to emotion believe the later big climbing stages effect the race outcome more. They don't. Time is time. Froome won the race by going into stage 20 with 2m30s up his sleeve.

Team Sky respected the science beautifully in this TdF, and it paid off. And it's unfortunate that those who don't respect science, don't respect Team Sky's victory.


Yes, only Team Sky understands the science of cycling. Plus they have rounder wheels, use their own pillows in hotels, warm down after the stage, etc. :roll:

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CKinnard
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Re: 2015 Tour de France

Postby CKinnard » Sun Jul 26, 2015 7:35 pm

biker jk wrote:Yes, only Team Sky understands the science of cycling. Plus they have rounder wheels, use their own pillows in hotels, warm down after the stage, etc. :roll:


the low brow emotion behind your sarcasm confirms my point. thanks :)

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