Cassettes and spacers

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Cassettes and spacers

Postby AUbicycles » Fri Sep 13, 2013 11:04 pm

When running different wheels (training and racing) you want to avoid setting up the gears each time - so am interested in feedback from others about setting up - specifically spacers.

Is this something that you can really rely on the manufacturer and their instructions or is the reality setting up spacers to suit and fine tuning with these until it is just right on the second set.

If you have done fine-tuning with spaces - what is the maximum adjustment (mm) outside of what the manufacturer had recommended (supplied or suggested).
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by BNA » Sat Sep 14, 2013 7:23 am

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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby antipodean » Sat Sep 14, 2013 7:23 am

What spacers do you speak of?
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby trailgumby » Sat Sep 14, 2013 7:38 am

In the past when I've had to get it done to suit disc rotors I did it by fitting shims between bearing cones and locknuts as there were only tenths of millimeters in it. Otherwise, it hasn't been an issue with quality wheelsets even across wheels by different manufacturers. . For example I have an XT center lock disc hub that is a drop in swap for a Mavic 6 bolt and I have to adjust nothing neither brakes nor rear derailleur nor shifter.

The new rear road wheel came with a spacer to suit 10 speed (down from 11) but I haven't checked yet whether I need to adjust the transmission from the 10 speed rear wheel I'd been borrowing.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby trailgumby » Sat Sep 14, 2013 7:45 am

I assume you're using cassettes from the same manufacturer and not mixing say Sram and shimano?

I'd also commend the practice of running multiple chains and rotating them so you spread the wear and don't trash your race cassette
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby Duck! » Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:20 am

I've found that any variation in cassette position between wheel brands is less than any spacer.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby antipodean » Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:40 am

Constantly amazed as to how little the OP actually knows about bikes.
After all he only admins/founder(?) possibly the most popular cycling site in Australia, does bike and related gear reviews, and asks the most noobish questions on here.
Flame away.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby rustychisel » Sat Sep 14, 2013 11:17 am

antipodean wrote:Constantly amazed as to how little the OP actually knows about bikes.
After all he only admins/founder(?) possibly the most popular cycling site in Australia, does bike and related gear reviews, and asks the most noobish questions on here.
Flame away.



noobish? No.

A wise man asks the question rather than bash through a solution.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby scirocco » Sat Sep 14, 2013 1:43 pm

Duck! wrote:I've found that any variation in cassette position between wheel brands is less than any spacer.


Exactly. Also, any given wheel doesn't usually have much room to add or subtract spacers. If a particular wheel/cassette combination needs a spacer, it's to move the cassette slightly so that the lockring can screw down far enough to clamp the cassette in place. Take the spacer out, and there will not be enough threads on the freehub and the ring will not hold the cassette tight. If you use two spacers, the lockring will not be able to get enough threads engaged to clamp the cassette.

So, any spacers you add or subtract to do what you want would have to be much thinner than the normal 1mm Shimano jobbie. You would have to get something custom made. Much easier just to twist the barrel adjustor on the gear cable to suit the new wheel. You will most likely find you don't even have to adjust the limit screws on the RD because the change is so small.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Sat Sep 14, 2013 2:02 pm

There is always someone making custom something so if you need spacers click the link below I use them for a number of reasons. You can even email this chap and ask for a really custom made job if he doesn't sell them.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Mountain-Bike-Road-Bicycle-Custom-Cassette-Spacer-Set-/260737921897?pt=US_Cassettes_Freewheels_Cogs&hash=item3cb530f369

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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby trailgumby » Sat Sep 14, 2013 2:47 pm

antipodean wrote:Flame away.

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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby AUbicycles » Sat Sep 14, 2013 6:09 pm

antipodean wrote:Constantly amazed as to how little the OP actually knows about bikes.
After all he only admins/founder(?) possibly the most popular cycling site in Australia, does bike and related gear reviews, and asks the most noobish questions on here.
Flame away.


So I am meant to pretend that I know everything?
I founded the site with the aim to create a free information source around cycling and have not yet suggested that I am an expert mechanic. If you look, you will notice that I also havn't done any bike bike reviews or reviews of gear (eg. wheelsets) beyond what I feel I can represent well - which I why people like trailgumby are better suited. (A single review in my name was ghost written, with the review from two others)

So let me ask you - what is your motivation and intention in your criticism, you obviously havn't got much right yet but are interested in discrediting me... why?

--

So onto the topic, a recent set of wheels we got for review, that I passed to a reviewer who is skilled and well suited needed an extra 0.5mm spacer above what was specced and the manufacturer got back and agreed that this is probably more suited. A bit unusual if it is an exact science.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby Saturnstarzz » Sun Sep 15, 2013 8:10 pm

AUbicycles wrote:When running different wheels (training and racing) you want to avoid setting up the gears each time - so am interested in feedback from others about setting up - specifically spacers.

Is this something that you can really rely on the manufacturer and their instructions or is the reality setting up spacers to suit and fine tuning with these until it is just right on the second set.

If you have done fine-tuning with spaces - what is the maximum adjustment (mm) outside of what the manufacturer had recommended (supplied or suggested).

For me its whats the manufacturer specs are but.......
Many different varibles with cassette speeds etc.
My training wheels are Shimano RS-10 with a 105 10 speed cassette, Mavic Cosmics slrs with a 10 Ultegra speed cassette.
Followed what both shimano and mavic have said and never has to tune gears.

Brakes on the other hand have to always be adjusted as the Mavics are thinner than the RS-10.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby andione1983 » Sun Sep 15, 2013 10:11 pm

Antipodean at it again I see....

Sent from my Galaxy far far away....
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby jacks1071 » Sun Sep 15, 2013 10:46 pm

AUbicycles wrote:When running different wheels (training and racing) you want to avoid setting up the gears each time - so am interested in feedback from others about setting up - specifically spacers.

Is this something that you can really rely on the manufacturer and their instructions or is the reality setting up spacers to suit and fine tuning with these until it is just right on the second set.

If you have done fine-tuning with spaces - what is the maximum adjustment (mm) outside of what the manufacturer had recommended (supplied or suggested).


As long as you run the same brand cassette on both wheels ie. both shimano or both sram ( don't mix brands ) - most of the time you can swap wheels without any adjustment.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby thomashouseman » Mon Sep 16, 2013 7:01 am

I've never needed any adjustment when swapping my two wheels out. (I have disc brakes too and a couple of clicks on the BB7 adjusters and they're sweet as well. I could be just extra lucky though. :)
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby jasonc » Mon Sep 16, 2013 8:49 am

jacks1071 wrote:As long as you run the same brand cassette on both wheels ie. both shimano or both sram ( don't mix brands ) - most of the time you can swap wheels without any adjustment.


When swapping from shimano to pro-lite wheels, I've had to adjust the rear derailluer
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby jacks1071 » Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:39 am

jasonc wrote:
jacks1071 wrote:As long as you run the same brand cassette on both wheels ie. both shimano or both sram ( don't mix brands ) - most of the time you can swap wheels without any adjustment.


When swapping from shimano to pro-lite wheels, I've had to adjust the rear derailluer


You should be able to tune it so worst case scenario you'll need half a turn on the cable tension either way.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby toolonglegs » Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:09 pm

jacks1071 wrote:
AUbicycles wrote:When running different wheels (training and racing) you want to avoid setting up the gears each time - so am interested in feedback from others about setting up - specifically spacers.

Is this something that you can really rely on the manufacturer and their instructions or is the reality setting up spacers to suit and fine tuning with these until it is just right on the second set.

If you have done fine-tuning with spaces - what is the maximum adjustment (mm) outside of what the manufacturer had recommended (supplied or suggested).


As long as you run the same brand cassette on both wheels ie. both shimano or both sram ( don't mix brands ) - most of the time you can swap wheels without any adjustment.

Spacing between 105 & Ultegra cassettes isn't the same.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby jasonc » Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:33 pm

toolonglegs wrote:Spacing between 105 & Ultegra cassettes isn't the same.


sorry TLL, but I disagree with that. In the same series, the cassette gear spacings are the same
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby toolonglegs » Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:48 pm

Not in my experience... Disagree all you want, when I go from 11-28 to 11-23 I have to adjust the levels.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby jasonc » Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:54 pm

toolonglegs wrote:Not in my experience... Disagree all you want, when I go from 11-28 to 11-23 I have to adjust the levels.


that's because the derailleur has to move further/less because of the different gear sizes.

if you went from a 105 11-28 to an ultegra 11-28, no adjustment would be required.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby toolonglegs » Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:03 pm

Huh?... The levels have nothing to do with the range of the cassette, just the width of the cassette and where it sits in relation to the derailleur.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby thomashouseman » Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:47 pm

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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby human909 » Mon Sep 16, 2013 6:44 pm

Mmmmm... Flamed popcorn..... :D :lol:

Spacing between cogs is 3.95mm for 10 speed. Sheldon has more details: http://sheldonbrown.com/cribsheet-spacing.html

Some wheels/cassette combinations might be offset slightly but it won't be by much. If you are worried simply measure from the lock nut to the centre of the first cog on both wheel in question.
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Re: Cassettes and spacers

Postby Duck! » Mon Sep 16, 2013 7:43 pm

Try cranking your B-tension screw in when you throw a bigger cassette on. From Tiagra to Dura-Ace, all 10-sp. cassettes are the same spacing and overall width. SRAM is the same as Shimano, but the offsetting is different due to the flat-backed big sprocket vs Shimano's dished inner sprocket (except Tiagra, which is also flat-backed, hence does not require the thin spacer that the other levels do). Campag is unique, slightly wider than the two Ss.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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