Jamis Build Thread

Workshop tales, trials and disasters.
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Postby thomas_cho » Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:00 pm

what sort of BB is it? Octalink?
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by BNA » Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:04 pm

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Re: GRRRRRRRR

Postby mikeg » Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:04 pm

europa wrote:I was pulling the drivetrain off the Trek tonight. You reckon I can get the bottom bracet out? The left hand side nearly didn't come, the right hand side has me wondering if it's Italian threaded (ie, not a cack handed thread on that side). I'm wondering if the same gorilla mechanic that rounded out the seat post clamping bolt also installed the bottom bracet (they had it out at one point).

Ah well. Park Tools show a ubeat method of freeing seized bottom bracket cups, guess I'll be finding out how easy that is tomorrow, can't be stuffed trying tonight.

Richard


Right hand fixed cup - Left hand thread

Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Bottom Bracket Crib Sheet

Is it a Cartridge sealed BB or Cup and Cones?

Mike
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Postby europa » Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:21 pm

Sealed bearing Octalink. Ultegra.

Grrrr. I'm tempted to just leave the sodding thing there and buy a new bb.

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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 12:49 pm

Okay, out in the shed this morning before it got too hot.

Image

No, this isn't my idea, it's from Park Tools. The quick release skewer holds the tool firmly locked into the splines - the splines are shallow and the tool flicks out rather easily under extreme pressure. The idea is to clamp the tool in your vice and use the frame to give you the leverage to undo the bb cup.

My bb tool is round, which doesn't clamp securely in a vice, so if you look on the right hand side of the tool, at the top, you'll see the head of a bolt - that's been pushed into a hole in the tool. The idea is that I do the vice up as tight as I can but with that bolt hard up against the vice jaw to stop the tool turning in the vice.

Easy as eh? Using the frame as a lever gives you so much leverage you could undo anything.

Well, I sheered the head off that bolt :shock:
Then I put in two bolts, one on each side, and sheered both of them off :shock:

That bb cup does NOT want to move. So I took it down to the lbs and left it with them. If it doesn't want to come, I'll just buy a new bb, they aren't expensive, but they did say they could get it out, even if they have to take a hacksaw to the frame :shock: I think he was joking :roll:

I'll find out later today.

Richard

for those who've made this mistake before - yes, it is a left handed thread and yes, I was turning it the right way 8)
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Postby Birdman » Fri Nov 16, 2007 12:58 pm

Sorry Richard for the retarded question.

What are you actually trying to remove? Is it the bottom bracket or is it something else?

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Until next time...
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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 1:00 pm

I'm trying to remove the frame from the bottom bracket :D

The picture would probably be easier to understand if you know what the bits are in the first place.

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Postby Birdman » Fri Nov 16, 2007 1:02 pm

Okay so you are trying to remove the frame??? Is the BB threaded into the frame? If so is the problem merely the fact that it was originally done up by Hercules. Or is there dramas.

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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 1:28 pm

Birdman wrote:If so is the problem merely the fact that it was originally done up by Hercules.


It was done up by his pet gorilla :?
There may be other issues (such as not greasing the threads and having them seize) but we won't know unless we can get the thing apart. Considering the frame is only 12 months old, I think we can assume that overtightening is at least part of the problem.

It is however, the last thing to remove from the Trek. Chain and rear sprockets are currently soaking in kero. I'll do the clean up and begin installing the bits on the Jamis when this heat gives up ... about wednesday next week according to the weather bureau. Okay, maybe I will do something before then :roll:

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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 3:56 pm

Well, I don't feel so bad now. The lbs worked for over half an hour to get the bb out (he only had to undo one cup). He admitted that he nearly gave up. Tried a couple of tools first, wound up with one he called 'industrial strength' with a 2m handle :shock:

Still, it's out now ... well, loose. And it's nearly 40C outside so I'm not really tempted to go out in the shed and start cleaning the other bits. Maybe a bit later.

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Postby mikesbytes » Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:20 pm

europa wrote:And it's nearly 40C outside


Hope your got aircon mate
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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:34 pm

mikesbytes wrote:
europa wrote:And it's nearly 40C outside


Hope your got aircon mate


Not really - it can be used but it's not real efficient. Fortunately, the temperature's dropping fairly quickly and maybe well get some gully winds later in the evening. I had a really nice, shady tree here when I moved in. A couple of months later, the landlord cut it down to leave the front of the house exposed to the sun.

I hate renting.

Back to the build. I've just cleaned the groupset and it now awaits installation in the Jamis :D

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Postby mikeg » Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:37 pm

europa wrote:It was done up by his pet gorilla :?


Sounds like this pet gorilla has someone/something to answer to/for.

That's at least 2 things over-tightened or damaged. Start a tally for any more.

Mike
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Postby Kalgrm » Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:46 pm

The one whose priorities are muddled wrote:And it's nearly 40C outside so I'm not really tempted to go out in the shed

So why is your bike in the shed all of a sudden? :wink:
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Postby Kid_Carbine » Fri Nov 16, 2007 6:22 pm

Overtightened, ...... or Loctite?
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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:24 pm

Over tightened Kid, simply overtightened.

The shed? I'll do a lot inside the house but not sitting over a tray of kerosene washing parts. The bike herself was safely inside the house :D

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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:30 pm

And here is the clean groupset, ready to be installed :D

Image

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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:53 pm

Right. So I installed the bottom bracket ... without using a 2m lever to reef it up tight 8)

Bolted on the cranks ... twice because I got them one tooth out on the splines the first time :oops:

Fitted the cassette ... and then realised I hadn't rescued the spoke protector off the wheel of the Trek so I'm joining the 'I don't need no stinkin' frisbee' brigade :roll: I reckon they're a good idea but you can assume I don't value them overly highly.

Mounted the rear derailleur.

Hey, it's starting to look like a bike :D

Now the front derailleur.

OH POO

The seat tube on the Trek has a diameter of 31.8mm, the seat tube on the Jamis is 28.6mm - my front dr DOESN'T FLAMIN' FIT :?

Interestingly, both bikes take the same sized seat post ie, same internal diameter seat tube, but the external diameter is less on the Jamis than the Trek. I guess that means thinner side walls ... and a lighter frame :D

But in the meantime, I need to buy a new front dr :cry:

Question - what to buy?

The rear dr is a DeoreLX.

It's a 9 speed set up. 11-32 tooth cassette.

My triple chainring set is 26, 42, 52 - yup, that's some jump from the granny to the middle.

The standard front dr is a 105 unit and while it works, is fussy on adjustment when going from the small to the middle. Middle to top is fine.

What do you reckon? Buy another 105? Buy a DeoreLX or XT?

Richard
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Postby DavidH » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:13 pm

Don't you hate that? I have an assortment of lights...various LED and Halogen units. When I bought the new road bike I discovered that NONE of them can be mounted on the new handlebars, which are now 31.8mm.

Needless to say it has yet to be ridden in the dark.

Sorry...I have had zero experience with triple chainrings and have never had any problems with front derailleurs (Ultegra and Dura-Ace) so I'm no help there.

Following the build with interest Richard...and impressed with the custom built wheels. My LBS guy says it took him over two years and countless builds before he was putting together wheels with confidence. You are obviously gifted (and patient).
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Postby mikesbytes » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:15 pm

europa wrote:And here is the clean groupset, ready to be installed :D

Image

Richard


That's a might low bottom gear
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Postby Kalgrm » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:25 pm

Hi Richard,

As you say, it's a big jump: I don't know if many Derailleurs can handle it. I'd try an XT derailleur. They now have top pull and bottom pull in the one unit and their seat tube specs are sorted out with a bunch of shims (ie one size fits all). The only reservation I have in the recommendation is that jump ..... You may end up with a 30t small ring on your MUCH lighter frame. :)

XT FD costs about $70. LX will be about $50. Doesn't matter which you get - the shifter is the thing which controls where it sits, and that could have been why your current one was fiddly - your shifter may not be up to it.

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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:25 pm

mikesbytes wrote:That's a might low bottom gear


Yup, and it gets used regularly. The new bike might allow me to put the 30 back on, but I'm sure if I do, I'll find an even steeper hill.

Been looking at the various drs available from Chainreaction.

The road bike derailleurs will fit my large ring but don't have the capacity - well, I've been proving they'll handle my rig despite being well outside the stated capacity.

The mtb derailleurs don't state a range but only go to to 48 tooth large ring.

Is there any chance I'll walk into my lbs tomorrow and they'll have a spacer that'll allow me to use my current dr on the thinner tube?

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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:28 pm

europa wrote:Is there any chance I'll walk into my lbs tomorrow and they'll have a spacer that'll allow me to use my current dr on the thinner tube?


Ah ha. Found them in the Chainreaction catelogue, so my lbs should have a spacer :D

Keep the old dr in that case ... I hope :D

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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:30 pm

Thanks Graeme.

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Postby europa » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:32 pm

DavidH wrote:Following the build with interest Richard...and impressed with the custom built wheels. My LBS guy says it took him over two years and countless builds before he was putting together wheels with confidence. You are obviously gifted (and patient).


Thanks.

Mind you, it takes me all evening to build a wheel, your lbs guy loses money if he takes more than an hour :wink:

I enjoyed building the wheels, it's a job that has a nice 'black art' feel to it :D

Richard
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Postby Kalgrm » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:38 pm

europa wrote:Ah ha. Found them in the Chainreaction catelogue, so my lbs should have a spacer :D

Keep the old dr in that case ... I hope :D

Richard

You could try the ghetto solution (I would but I'm a cheapskate).

Ghetto solution = a piece of inner tube trimmed to the appropriate width so it can't be seen. No need to flaunt your ghetto in this case ..... ;)

Cheers,
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