Learsport BW-3000 issues

cyc715t
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Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Sat Oct 15, 2011 3:34 pm

Hello all!

I found this Learsport BW-3000 frame chucked out and thought it would be a nice bike to do up and ride around but it has a few issues. The rear derailleur was broken... and the chain rings are bent.

Can a Deore LX 7 Speed rear derailleur be used with a standard Shimano 7 Speed Shifter (the ones which are attached to the V-Brake Shimano levers? ST-EE28

Would Deore LX chainrings and cranks work with the standard ST-EE28 shifters please? I am missing the Deore LX front derailleur and front derailleur shifter hence I'm trying to mix and match!

The other issue with this learsport BW-3000 is that I can't seem to get a rear rim to fit in the frame! I tried sticking a standard 26 inch rim in there and the axle/hub/spacing width etc seems to be too wide for the frame. The distance between the two dropouts seems to be very narrow. The frame doesn't look squashed! Does anyone know if the BW-3000 was made for narrower rims/axle area etc please??

It is the same model as this one:
http://imageshack.us/f/577/ebay05.jpg/

Sorry about all the questions!

Thanks in advance!

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:56 pm

Pretty clearly with the damage you described it's been crashed.

Run a string line through the rear dropouts and check it's straight (it won't be), rectify that and try the back wheel again.

On your gearing questions, in my experience anything from any brand that says 7 speed will work together. You can fix your bent chainrings with a rubber mallet.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Sat Oct 15, 2011 8:50 pm

Thanks drubie. I tried sticking a piece of wool between the dropouts to see if it is straight. To be honest.. it does look straight - but maybe I am just dumb or something.

I measured the distance between the dropouts and it is almost 8cm (possibly just under). Is there such a thing as that?

How do I rectify the distance between the dropouts please? How wide should it ideally be?

Thanks again.

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Sun Oct 16, 2011 11:17 am

cyc715t wrote:Thanks drubie. I tried sticking a piece of wool between the dropouts to see if it is straight. To be honest.. it does look straight - but maybe I am just dumb or something.

I measured the distance between the dropouts and it is almost 8cm (possibly just under). Is there such a thing as that?

How do I rectify the distance between the dropouts please? How wide should it ideally be?

Thanks again.


8 speed or better the distance should be 135mm. 7 speed MTB will be 130mm between the dropouts. If it's only 8cm you've got serious problems.

To bend it back assuming it's steel, put a 4x2 against the outside of the seat tube to the inside of the dropout and push it out.

However, if you're seriously missing 5cm I would put the bike back on the verge - check the tubes for cracking paint up near the welds - something as squashed as that is something I wouldn't ride.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Sun Oct 16, 2011 11:56 am

Thanks drubie again.

Sorry to sound dense but what is a 4x2 please? Is that a piece of wood?

I inspected it again and can't see any cracks.. confusing.

Are there any diagrams on the internet that show how you do that procedure exactly please?

Like this:
http://sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Sun Oct 16, 2011 12:17 pm



That page has all you need to know, but again if it's down to 8cm between the dropouts I would be very hesitant to ride it assuming you can re-spread it.

A 4x2 is just a block of wood. Any long bit of wood will do the trick - steal some garden edging from your neighbour and put it back when you are done.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Sun Oct 16, 2011 6:36 pm

I stretched it out to 130mm.. but it wasn't symmetrical haha. So I pushed it back to 110mm and will try again tonight to get it even distances away from the seatpost.

How will I be able to tell if it will be safe to ride? Look for cracks?

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Sun Oct 16, 2011 8:16 pm

Go over the rear subframe very carefully and look for peeling paint and tweaked tubes - if the paint has peeled off (in tiny slivers) at a particular section you can be pretty sure the tubes are bent/tweaked at that point.

Now, I'm guessing a bike that that it probably won't be a total catastrophe if one of the tubes fails (not like a fork failure), but it'll be fairly unpleasant. I've pushed an el-cheapo steel subframe dual suspension bike back into shape after a similar verge find and it was OK, but it was more like 15mm not 5cm. I guess as long as you use it as a pub bike / shop bike it'll be fine. I wouldn't take it out for anything serious though.

If the tube is actually cracked...well, use your discretion.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

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scotto
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Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby scotto » Sun Oct 16, 2011 8:19 pm

It was a crap frame before someone threw it out

cyc715t
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:14 pm

Aww.. but a fun project and I thought it would be a better frame than the Big W and co ones like Huffy, Repco and whatever else they call them!

I got it to 130mm...

Next problem!

I can't get the rear wheel into the dropouts. The axle seems to be too wide for the inbuilt hanger-sided dropout.

The quick release axle seems to be about 9mm - is that correct?

But the dropout gap seems to be a fair bit less on the 'hanger' side. The inner/medial side of the dropout of the hanger dropout is about 7.5-7.6mm whilst the outer/lateral side of the hanger-side droupout is about 8.5mm.

The non-hanger sided dropout is just over 9mm.

I know you all are thinking that I should just chuck it out, but... if I were to fix it, is the only way of fixing this filing it to the 9mm?

Thanks, sorry to annoy you guys and girls with my learsport and co problems!

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Mon Oct 17, 2011 6:58 pm

Just bend it down (we're talking longish dropouts, right?). Do it carefully and looks for cracks on the back side of the dropout beforehand, check for cracks after you've bent it down. It won't take much.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Mon Oct 17, 2011 8:29 pm

Hi,

Well it looks like the vertical dropout style as in this pic:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/images/dropf-vert.gif

What do you mean by bending it down please? Wouldn't that make the slot narrower instead of wider? Sorry, I'm confused.

:) Thanks.

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:00 pm

cyc715t wrote:Hi,

Well it looks like the vertical dropout style as in this pic:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/images/dropf-vert.gif

What do you mean by bending it down please? Wouldn't that make the slot narrower instead of wider? Sorry, I'm confused.

:) Thanks.

I thought it had semi-horizontal ones?
Which one is too small, the derailleur/drive side or the other side? Either way you need to open it up - if the derailleur tab is bent that far inwards, you'll be very lucky to get it back into place without snapping it off. Just open it up gently.

edit - ok, drive side.

Put the point of a chisel into the dropout with the shaft against the derailleur hanger and push it backwards until the hole is big enough, or something snaps.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:08 pm

No, no...

I can't get the rear wheel axle into the dropouts slots. The axle seems to be too wide for the inbuilt hanger-sided/derailleur-sided dropout slot.

The quick release axle seems to be about 9mm - is that correct?

But the dropout gap/slot seems to be a fair bit less on the 'hanger'/derailleur side. The inner/medial side of the hanger/derailleur-sided dropout slot is about 7.5-7.6mm whilst the outer/lateral side of the hanger-sided/derailleur-sided dropout slot is about 8.5mm.

The non-hanger sided dropout slot is just over 9mm.

That is why I thought the only way to get the derailleu-sided dropout slot was to try and file it to the 9mm..? Am I on the right track or wrong please?

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:52 pm

cyc715t wrote:No, no...

That is why I thought the only way to get the derailleu-sided dropout slot was to try and file it to the 9mm..? Am I on the right track or wrong please?

Photo required. If the derailleur hanger has take a biff and pushed it forwards, it'll close up the dropout (note - this is the closest I can find to guessing what is wrong with yours). If you bend the hanger backwards, it'll open up the dropout.

Image
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
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Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:55 pm

Ok, so how do I bend the hanger backwards to open up the slot more please? I tried sticking a screw driver in between to wedge it to try and make it wider but failed haha.

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:23 pm

Block of wood and a hammer if it won't respond to gentler persuasion.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:31 pm

A 9mm thick block of wood to try and wedge in the dropout slot and hammer it in?

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:42 pm

cyc715t wrote:A 9mm thick block of wood to try and wedge in the dropout slot and hammer it in?


No - put the block of wood along the chain stay (the pipe leading to the dropout underneath the bike) and hook the front of the hanger on it. Bash the other end of the wood until your dropout is opened.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:44 pm

Oh ok thanks I get you, but how would you position it all or keep the rest of the frame secure whilst bashing the other end. I can see myself bashing it and the whole frame moving instead of it opening up haha. How should I sit/secure the frame so it doesn't move please?

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:55 pm

cyc715t wrote: How should I sit/secure the frame so it doesn't move please?


Put it upside down and put your foot on it down in the triangle near the dropouts. Put something soft underneath it - perhaps your wife's best bra or something with a bit of padding in it.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:00 am

haha.. could you please draw me a pic of it? Or is there a pic of a similar method on the net please?

I shall try it tomorrow so I don't wake up the whole house nor kill myself when I'm half asleep!

Thanks.

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drubie
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Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby drubie » Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:12 am

cyc715t wrote:haha.. could you please draw me a pic of it? Or is there a pic of a similar method on the net please?


Mate, it's not a swiss watch, it's a verge find Learsport. Use your imagination! Hold it however you can and bash away like you're playing whack-a-mole. You can't possibly make it any worse than how you found it.
So we get the leaders we deserve and we elect, we get the companies and the products that we ask for, right? And we have to ask for different things. – Paul Gilding
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.

cyc715t
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Re: Learsport BW-3000 issues

Postby cyc715t » Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:01 pm

Ok, there is my latest update. I tried the whacking technique and it didn't seem to open it up anymore. So I have been trying to file it to make it bigger. Still not big enough! Any other suggestions please besides chucking it away? haha

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