Australian Cycling Forums - Bicycles Network Australia

Musson book bought!

Weird double post going there, Cameron.

JustJames wrote:Musson book bought!

Weird double post going there, Cameron.

Damn electrickery. Should stick to pen and paper. Sorry about that.

I forgot to add that the sidewalls of some 'disc only' rims are a long way from being parallel which will greatly reduce the life of brake pads, as you'd have to file them roughly to shape in order to have a reasonable amount of pad in contact with the rim. Rims that can be sold as either variant (like Velocity) only vary by whether the braking surface has been machined.

A practice wheel is a good idea, although a beaten up old one may have problems such as corrosion between the spoke and nipple and non-round rims, which could mean that you are making a bit of a rod for your own back. You could get some cheap Chinese wheels on ebay (Stars Circle or similar) pull them apart, put your favourite lubricant on the threads and then re-build them. You'd probably make them better than the originals at the same time as learning from them. Don't forget that machine built wheels are not symmetrical in that they feed all the pulling spokes through from one side, meaning that they are heads in on one side and heads out on the other. Most books would suggest that all pulling spokes should either be heads in or out, this means that the all the spoke marks on one of the hub won't line up with the new spokes.

Front wheels are better for learning on than back wheels, as they are usually symmetrical.

Cheers,

Cameron

Cheers,

Cameron

Next question, re: rim choice.

Am I right in thinking that a rim that is described as a 29er MTB rim is the same size as a 700C road rim?

And on the same topic, sort of, as I am planning on running XC tyres on these wheels, are there any pro's or cons to using road vs MTB rims?

They are both nominally the same outer circumference.

The usual difference between 29er and 700c rims is that 29ers are made to accommodate a larger knobbly tire, and the 700c will take a skinny road tire eg. 23c.

See Sheldon's Tire article which has a table at the end to show which size tires fit on various standard rim widths.

JustJames wrote:Next question, re: rim choice.

Am I right in thinking that a rim that is described as a 29er MTB rim is the same size as a 700C road rim?

And on the same topic, sort of, as I am planning on running XC tyres on these wheels, are there any pro's or cons to using road vs MTB rims?

Yes.

General difference is that the 29er rims will be wider and heavier (variable).

If you are running wider than 28c tyres, the 29er rims will be better.

+5 on the Musson book. A great start.

Don't bother with many expensive tools - his book tells you enough about most that you's need. I got a secondhand folding stand. it's OK but you can make one cheaply out of the bottom part of a standard cooling fan, and the inverted rear forks from a steel bike, chopped off on the chainstays just forward of the dropouts and on the seat tube 6 inches under the top tube (thanks GC). A dishing gauge is easy enough to simulate by flipping the wheel in the stand till there is no more difference. I find that I get to a good wheel quickest though by using a Park spoke tension gauge - pinging the spokes isn't close enough. Musically though, I've never even pretended to be able to carry a tune in a bucket. They are only $60-70 if you look around. The stick from an earbud puts the nipples in pretty well, after using the earbud to dab oil in each seat around the wheel.

So where are we sourcing our spokes and nipples from?

Most likely DT Swiss Competition DB spokes from c r c, and DT Swiss Pro Lock nipples also from c r c.

But may look elsewhere 'cause I'd like my nipples to be red (fner fner fner), and I'm not sure how good an idea locked nipples is.

grantw wrote:So where are we sourcing our spokes and nipples from?

Look up good886 as a seller on ebay.

Are we allowed to say "nice nipples" on a family friendly forum?

MichaelB wrote:

grantw wrote:So where are we sourcing our spokes and nipples from?

Look up good886 as a seller on ebay.

I looked up that user but not many items currently for sale.

I get my spokes from Bike24 in Germany - 39 Euro pence for each DT Swiss Competition spoke, with nipples provided. They charge 20 Euros for each order up to 600 Euros goods value. Pretty good prices on many things like Brooks saddles, but are much less competitive on clothing for instance.

I use the online calculator called Free Bike tools
http://wheelbuilder.freebiketools.org/
which has served me well.

For those who really don't want to trust their eyes as to the gap when truing a wheel, it's also possible to get a cheap mini magnetic base and a dial indicator for about $45 the two delivered, and use them to measure your wheels' trueness to a few hundredths of a mm - if you have the time.

Thanks for those suggestions

JustJames wrote:Most likely DT Swiss Competition DB spokes from c r c, and DT Swiss Pro Lock nipples also from c r c.

But may look elsewhere 'cause I'd like my nipples to be red (fner fner fner), and I'm not sure how good an idea locked nipples is.

You'll get nipples with the DT spokes from c r c, just use them unless you want colors.
Never had a need for 'lock' nipples.

Crawf wrote:
You'll get nipples with the DT spokes from c r c, just use them unless you want colors.
Never had a need for 'lock' nipples.

I do want colours, but don't really want my nipples locked. That just sounds way too "Fifty Shades".

wqlava1 wrote:

MichaelB wrote:

grantw wrote:So where are we sourcing our spokes and nipples from?

Look up good886 as a seller on ebay.

I looked up that user but not many items currently for sale.

I get my spokes from Bike24 in Germany - 39 Euro pence for each DT Swiss Competition spoke, with nipples provided. They charge 20 Euros for each order up to 600 Euros goods value. Pretty good prices on many things like Brooks saddles, but are much less competitive on clothing for instance.

.....

good886 is the best source for bladed spokes. The equivalent DT Swiss version is double the price before you add the shipping.

He will tailor an order for you and do it even cheaper as an off ebay deal.

Bike24 are indeed good for many things, but can be very uncompetitive on others.

+1 for Bike24 for spokes.

Good to hear you are having a go at building your own wheels
Roger Mussons book is a good place to start
If you are going to be using disc brakes try velocity's Blunt SL or perhaps Dyads for rim brakes.
Don't bother with alloy nipples as you might need to keep making some adjustments and brass will be more tolerant of this.
Use 222 loctite on the threads and a drop of oil where the nipple contacts the rim
If you are using disc brakes then you need to make sure that the spokes on the disc side have the outside facing forward. For the rear you might find it easiest to build one side at a time as the drive side always has the outside pulling.
Good luck

Wheels built!

Went with DT Swiss R520 rims (c r c), Pillar spokes and red brass nipples from BDop.

Very pleased with the results:

Bike is looking nice. Two things, are you short? And you need tubes with longer presta valves

Reman wrote:Bike is looking nice. Two things, are you short? And you need tubes with longer presta valves

Thanks for the compliment, Reman.

First thing:

Short? Not at all.

Standing in damp socks, I tower a commanding 170cm above my surroundings. The frame is a 'small', and I am at the upper end of the recommendation for a small frame. I've always preferred a smaller frame to a larger one as I find it easier to get comfortable, and prefer a more compact cockpit.

Second thing:

Presta valves...indeed. I really don't like the look of two feet of presta valve flopping about, but when I put the tubes in the tyres I realised that I had misunderstimated the depth of the rims' profile.

Nice work James, we can compare disc brake commuters when we meet next month.

Thanks Dave - very much looking forward to all that your post entails!

James