Threaded Steerer Lengths

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Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby QuangVuong » Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:15 pm

I believe a 54cm Cadex frame has a 120mm steerer tube. I have found a Trek 5500 CF fork which has a 140mm steerer. Current the frame has a 600 headset, but that's a 37.5mm stack. Are there any headsets which are thin enough to fit the fork?

Or is my only option to not use the lock nut, and instead have a 1 1/8" quill adapter to keep the bearing top and the first nut from unscrewing? But theres another issue. I cant seem to find a stem which is for a 1 1/8" steerer and the other end for a 25.8mm bar. Or have I missed soemthing?

Otherwise, I can just search for another CF fork. Anyone have one to suit? 160mm would suit mine I reckon.
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by BNA » Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:35 pm

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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby drubie » Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:35 pm

QuangVuong wrote:I believe a 54cm Cadex frame has a 120mm steerer tube. I have found a Trek 5500 CF fork which has a 140mm steerer. Current the frame has a 600 headset, but that's a 37.5mm stack. Are there any headsets which are thin enough to fit the fork?

Or is my only option to not use the lock nut, and instead have a 1 1/8" quill adapter to keep the bearing top and the first nut from unscrewing? But theres another issue. I cant seem to find a stem which is for a 1 1/8" steerer and the other end for a 25.8mm bar. Or have I missed soemthing?

Otherwise, I can just search for another CF fork. Anyone have one to suit? 160mm would suit mine I reckon.


Why don't you get some more threads cut into the fork you already have and just lop off the bit you don't need? It's not difficult or expensive, most bike shops will have the gear to do it.
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby QuangVuong » Sun Apr 07, 2013 8:15 pm

Current forks are just some Giant aero composite forks. Im wanting a full CF bike, , but finding a 1" fork is proving to be a little difficult.
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby drubie » Sun Apr 07, 2013 8:35 pm

QuangVuong wrote:Current forks are just some Giant aero composite forks. Im wanting a full CF bike, , but finding a 1" fork is proving to be a little difficult.

I misunderstand what you're asking then - you said you found a (presumably) carbon fork that just has too much steerer on it, getting that cut to fit your cadex frame is trivial.
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby QuangVuong » Sun Apr 07, 2013 8:39 pm

Nah, other way around. Im looking for a carbon fork, but the steerer may be a little short. Ive only got 2cm of thread for both the top race nut and the lock nut. I am usure if I am able to use this fork or not.
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby kukamunga » Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:15 pm

QuangVuong wrote:..... a 120mm steerer tube...... fork which has a 140mm steerer...... headset 37.5mm stack. Are there any headsets which are thin enough to fit the fork?
A 20mm stackheight threaded headset? I think NOT
Or is my only option to not use the lock nut, and instead have a 1 1/8" quill adapter to keep the bearing top and the first nut from unscrewing?
I'd be using some very strong Loctite on the threads
But theres another issue. I cant seem to find a stem which is for a 1 1/8" steerer and the other end for a 25.8mm bar. Or have I missed soemthing?
Bar standard sizes are 25.4mm or 26.0mm, each using specific size stems. Some manufacturers (Ritchey being one, I think) make 25.8mm bar clamp size bars which they claim will be ok in either 25.4 and 26.0 stems. 26.0mm bar bore 1 1/8" threadless stems are pretty common - try looking here. 25.4mm quill stems with 26.0mm bar bore are very rare, as are 1" threadless stems (though I have a fair collection)
Otherwise, I can just search for another CF fork. Anyone have one to suit? 160mm would suit mine I reckon.
You are potentially going to waste a lot of time and money trying to find a threaded 1" carbon road fork, if any exist at all (the steerer is going to have to be steel to be threaded or modified). Bite the bullet and go threadless

And why did you start up another thread on this build when you had one already with lots of info elsewhere? This one just confuses things.....
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby QuangVuong » Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:43 pm

THe other thread was about buying the frame. THis one's about the headset/fork.

I can see that 1" threadless CF forks slightly easier to find. So basically, I would need to swap out for a 1" threadless headset. Then find a 1" threadless fork, and a 1" stem(non quill).
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby kukamunga » Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:56 pm

I think I might have mentioned in your other thread * that you could cut off nice and squarely the threaded section of your current fork, and add one of those BBB extenders to give yourself any length of threadless steerer you want. Of course, it adds some weight

1" threadless headsets are cheap and easy to source (Shimano/PRO), and I can probably help with a 1" stem

(* How about a link?)
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby QuangVuong » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:06 pm

We did sidetrack over to forks a bit on this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=62443

Now looking, chainging to threadless aint so bad. So does that mean I can change to threadless, and use that Trek fork with an extender?
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby kukamunga » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:26 pm

QuangVuong wrote:Now looking, chainging to threadless aint so bad. So does that mean I can change to threadless, and use that Trek fork with an extender?
Assuming the 1" steerers on those forks are steel with an inside diameter of 22.2mm - yes

You'll need to check that what ever headset you get, the cup outer and crown race inner diameters match your head tube inner and steerer race diameters

You'll probably also need to source (or make) some harder to find 1" headset spacers
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby kukamunga » Mon Apr 08, 2013 12:51 pm

Some examples of one of those BBB extenders fitted....

Image Image

....and one or two 1" threadless stems (Bar Bore 26.0mm) I could possibly part with.....

Image
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby QuangVuong » Mon Apr 08, 2013 1:07 pm

Which extender is it? I can only find the ones which a quill that's locked to a top cap, and not one like yours. And I'd be interested n that stem with the green band over it. 105/110mm?

But, I believe I have found a 1" threaded fork with a very long steerer. Awaiting response from that person.

But I could convert another bike. However i cant remove the quill stem. The hex would get stripped if I keep going. I could cut the stem, but that's a waste of a good stem. I can cut a slit into the bolt head, but I reckon it'll be stuck tight anyway. Any way to do this?
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby kukamunga » Mon Apr 08, 2013 2:31 pm

Any bike shop that deals with Bikesportz/BBB should be able to get one of these for you for about $30:

Image (clic on pic)

Whatever fork you use, you'll need an unthreaded steerer at least 70mm longer than your headtube. The (Shimano) PRO MT-01 headset (caged balls) has a pretty low stack height of ~23mm, and should set you back no more than $20. Cartridge/sealed bearing types will be a lot taller and more expensive. My stems have a 'stack height' of around 40-45mm

Image

^ PRO MT-01 on one of my Repcos. Once again, you need to check your frame and fork dimensions with a vernier/digital caliper to make sure headset will suit (check headset manufacturers website for their dimensions)

Having said all this, you seem to have sourced a number of different forks. How much time and money have you invested so far, and how much more do you need to spend adapting or modifying a second-hand carbon fork ???

In your other thread, kukamunga wrote:Shimano Australia do a PRO 1" carbon fork and 1" cartridge headset that should fit..... Priced at ~$200 and $40 respectively

^ Those prices were my AUD RRP "guesstimates".....

When you are sorted with a fork and headset, PM me about the stems
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby QuangVuong » Mon Apr 08, 2013 3:15 pm

Quite a bit of time, but no money spent thus far. And I will aim to spends no more than $100 all up. The threaded CF fork which will fit, will be about $50 + postage + costs to thread and cut at LBS. This will be easiest, as I can just stick with an old quill stem.

This threadless business will be with my Peugeot which has a Brinnelled race and stuck stem.
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby kukamunga » Mon Apr 08, 2013 3:32 pm

Peugeot? How old? Beware of French bikes of a certain era that have obscure metric sizings:

http://sheldonbrown.com/gloss_e-f.html#french
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby QuangVuong » Mon Apr 08, 2013 3:39 pm

91 Peugeot. It uses a SHimano RX100 groupset, which follows the normal standards. Only obsure thing would be a 25.4mm seatpost.

How would you go about a stuck stem bolt?
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby nihaz » Sat Jul 12, 2014 3:31 pm

Hi Guys,

Sorry to revive a dead thread, but figured I should post in an existing one instead of creating a new one.
I'm undertaking a rebuild of an old frame which I picked up for cheap, but have made a blunder!

I purchased a record headset to fit onto this frame but neglected to calculate whether the steerer would be long enough...
Rookie mistake :( I'm kicking myself right this minute :(

I installed the headset and only realised when I could not utilise the locknut, see photos for clarification..

Image
Image

Will I need a new fork? Or could I get away with using some threadlock on the top nut?
I daresay it would be near impossible for me to get a cheap lugged fork to go with this frame, that and I just got the frame powder coated :(

Kind regards,
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby Duck! » Sat Jul 12, 2014 3:39 pm

New fork I'm afraid. Given that you periodically want to be able to service the headset you can't use a super-strong Loctite, and I certainly wouldn't be putting any faith in a headset that's not secured with its necessary locknut.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby nihaz » Sat Jul 12, 2014 3:46 pm

Damn :(

Advice on the best place to pick up a 1" threaded fork?
If possible I'd want one with campy dropouts like the one it's going to replace..

Thanks very much for your help..

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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby QuangVuong » Sat Jul 12, 2014 3:59 pm

Best bet is used from some retro person for a Campag tipped fork. If not Campag tipped, then it is fairly easy to find a lugged fork, you just gotta know people. What's the headtube length you've got? And 700 or 27"?

It's a bit odd though, if that fork is original to the frame, why is the steerer so short?
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby nihaz » Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:33 pm

Thanks for your reply QuangVuong, I'm a fan of your work. :)

Very quickly, and using a steel rule, the head tube length I've got is 170mm and the fork is for a 700 wheel.
I should have calculated earlier, but using the data provided by Campagnolo for the headset, total headset stack? height is 36.5mm
Which gives:
170+36.5=206.5mm
My measurement of the current fork is that it's just a touch under 200mm :(
I'm an idiot for not checking prior.

The bike and fork (both of which are original to each other) did not come with a headset (which I would assume would have had a stack height less than 36.5mm)
I purchased the record headset as part of the build and only now have I realised that my steerer tube length is too short.
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby RonK » Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:41 pm

I think Chris King has a headset for such scenarios. Have a look at the Chris King Gripnut headset.
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Re: Threaded Steerer Lengths

Postby nihaz » Sat Jul 12, 2014 5:12 pm

Thanks RonK,

Current retail pricing for the Chris King Gripnut headset is around 140-160.
I want to compare the price between buying a new headset and getting a new fork before I buy one..
I'll post a WTB advert to see if anyone's got a spare fork lying around which might fit.

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