Tell Me The Difference Please

Workshop tales, trials and disasters.
Maintenance tips, techniques and myths.
Technical discussion, description and outright lies

Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby foo on patrol » Sat Jun 22, 2013 5:37 pm

Ok, I want to know if there is any difference, other than the name = Ultegra, Durace, 105, Tiagra and Sora in the clusters oh sorry cassettes as they are called now? :?

Now I want to know if, they are able to be use with the same chain. I currently have Durace shifters (front and back) with Rotor Q rings. Seeing as I don't do many Ks and won't be able to for another 3-4yrs if the lower end stuff will be fine. I just bought some wheels off Redsonic and need to put a cassette/cluster on these wheels. :wink:

If it was the same as when I was racing in the 70/80s I would be fine but things are so different now with the gear. :? :(

Foo
I don't suffer fools easily and so long as you have done your best,you should have no regrets.
Goal 6000km
Image
User avatar
foo on patrol
 
Posts: 4400
Joined: Sat Dec 19, 2009 10:12 am
Location: Sanstone Point QLD

by BNA » Sat Jun 22, 2013 5:55 pm

BNA
 

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby warthog1 » Sat Jun 22, 2013 5:55 pm

I buy sram clusters for use with my 10 speed shimano and just get the cheaper ones. The expensive ones are just a bit lighter, a couple of mouthfulls of water :)
As far as shimano goes the dura ace has titanium sprockets for the 4 largest cogs in the cluster which may be why they are so expensive. I've never tried them 105 and ultegra have been fine and I can buy 3 or 4 of them for the price of one dura ace cluster. I get the 28\11 sram pg 1050 or 1070's now and they shift as well or better than the shimano I reckon.
User avatar
warthog1
 
Posts: 2800
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:40 pm

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby open roader » Sat Jun 22, 2013 5:59 pm

I had need to replace a 105 cassette and did so with Ultegra 6700 cassette as only Ultegra offered the ratios i wanted but there was no chain compatibility issues at all - out with one and in with the other........ At the same time I also had the option to purchase D.A. over Ultegra and was told by LBS that D.A. was lighter weight, but offered no better shifting than a correctly tuned 105 or Ultegra set up so chances are D.A. cassettes use Ti on some cogs to shed weight..........
3rd class cycling is always better than 1st class walking
User avatar
open roader
 
Posts: 2356
Joined: Tue Jul 28, 2009 7:05 pm
Location: Dueling Banjo Country

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby ldrcycles » Sat Jun 22, 2013 6:49 pm

You can also get SunRace cassettes (Taiwanese company that bought out Sturmey Archer a few years back). I used a 9spd one on my old Scott and it worked fine.
When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments- Elizabeth West.
User avatar
ldrcycles
 
Posts: 6529
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:19 pm
Location: Kin Kin, Queensland

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby Duck! » Sat Jun 22, 2013 7:15 pm

The differences are in the materials used, and the manufacturing processes, resulting in lighter, stronger & harder-wearing components the higher up the range you go. Dura Ace cassettes have several sprockets made from titanium, while all others are all steel. All levels of components with a given number of gears are compatible with each other, but you'll strike problems trying to mix 9-speed chains/cassettes with an otherwise 10-sp. group & vice versa.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
Duck!
Expert
 
Posts: 1782
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 8:21 pm
Location: On The Tools

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby foo on patrol » Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:01 pm

Thanks all, it a bugger trying to come to grips with all the new stuff. :oops:

Foo
I don't suffer fools easily and so long as you have done your best,you should have no regrets.
Goal 6000km
Image
User avatar
foo on patrol
 
Posts: 4400
Joined: Sat Dec 19, 2009 10:12 am
Location: Sanstone Point QLD

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby foo on patrol » Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:04 pm

warthog1 wrote:I buy sram clusters for use with my 10 speed shimano and just get the cheaper ones. The expensive ones are just a bit lighter, a couple of mouthfulls of water :)
As far as shimano goes the dura ace has titanium sprockets for the 4 largest cogs in the cluster which may be why they are so expensive. I've never tried them 105 and ultegra have been fine and I can buy 3 or 4 of them for the price of one dura ace cluster. I get the 28\11 sram pg 1050 or 1070's now and they shift as well or better than the shimano I reckon.


Um dumb question time. I thought you needed Sram specific hubs, to be able to use them or have I been reading some threads wrong? :? be gentle with me now. :mrgreen:

Foo
I don't suffer fools easily and so long as you have done your best,you should have no regrets.
Goal 6000km
Image
User avatar
foo on patrol
 
Posts: 4400
Joined: Sat Dec 19, 2009 10:12 am
Location: Sanstone Point QLD

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby ldrcycles » Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:15 pm

Nope, SRAM and Shimano use the same freehub spline pattern, Campagnolo's is different.

(disclaimer, i'm not actually sure that SRAM and Shimano freehubs are exactly the same, but the cassettes are interchangeable, I used a SRAM cassette for a while).
When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments- Elizabeth West.
User avatar
ldrcycles
 
Posts: 6529
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:19 pm
Location: Kin Kin, Queensland

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby Duck! » Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:43 pm

foo on patrol wrote:Um dumb question time. I thought you needed Sram specific hubs, to be able to use them or have I been reading some threads wrong? :?

Only for XX1 MTB stuff. All other SRAM cassettes use the Shimano pattern.
Last edited by Duck! on Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
Duck!
Expert
 
Posts: 1782
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 8:21 pm
Location: On The Tools

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby foo on patrol » Sun Jun 23, 2013 7:13 am

See, told ya it was dumb question time. :lol: Thanks. :)

Foo
I don't suffer fools easily and so long as you have done your best,you should have no regrets.
Goal 6000km
Image
User avatar
foo on patrol
 
Posts: 4400
Joined: Sat Dec 19, 2009 10:12 am
Location: Sanstone Point QLD

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby pjt » Fri Jun 28, 2013 2:14 pm

One thing to note. If your Shimano-compatible wheelset/rear hub has an aluminium freehub body, you want a cassette with as many cogs as possible on a spider-carrier - and generally this is the more expensive groupset cassette. If it's lots of individual cogs (which tend to be the case at the Tiagra-ish level) each cog will bite into the freehub body and start chewing up the aluminium.

It's not a disaster (you can use a file, or Dremel tool to file the chewed up bits out) but it makes getting cassettes on and off a real bear, and in general isn't a great thing to do to your fancy expensive freehub/wheelset.

Not an issue with Campag freehub bodies, or the short lived "deep spline" 10 speed Shimano freehub body (which was only on their 7800 hubs and a select few 3rd party wheelsets). Haven't seen 11sp freehub bodies so don't know if this issue persists - anyone know?
pjt
 
Posts: 20
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2013 4:30 pm

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby biker jk » Fri Jun 28, 2013 2:21 pm

pjt wrote:One thing to note. If your Shimano-compatible wheelset/rear hub has an aluminium freehub body, you want a cassette with as many cogs as possible on a spider-carrier - and generally this is the more expensive groupset cassette. If it's lots of individual cogs (which tend to be the case at the Tiagra-ish level) each cog will bite into the freehub body and start chewing up the aluminium.

It's not a disaster (you can use a file, or Dremel tool to file the chewed up bits out) but it makes getting cassettes on and off a real bear, and in general isn't a great thing to do to your fancy expensive freehub/wheelset.

Not an issue with Campag freehub bodies, or the short lived "deep spline" 10 speed Shimano freehub body (which was only on their 7800 hubs and a select few 3rd party wheelsets). Haven't seen 11sp freehub bodies so don't know if this issue persists - anyone know?


Not an issue on Shimano wheelsets since the freehub is steel or titanium (Dura-Ace). Also really not an issue with aluminium alloy freehubs if you tighten the cassette to specification.
User avatar
biker jk
 
Posts: 2592
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 5:18 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Tell Me The Difference Please

Postby Duck! » Sun Jun 30, 2013 11:55 pm

pjt wrote:Haven't seen 11sp freehub bodies so don't know if this issue persists - anyone know?

Shimano 11-sp freewheel bodies have reverted to the traditional shallow spline, it's just a longer body to fit the extra gear on. As with previous generations of Dura Ace hubs, the body is titanium, so sprocket bites are avoided, but third party manufacturers are using aluminium, which will suffer the same fate in years to come as 11-sp. trickles down the ranks (as it is, I think the biggest six sprockets in Dura Ace cassettes are mounted to carriers, the rest are individually mounted).
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.
Duck!
Expert
 
Posts: 1782
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 8:21 pm
Location: On The Tools


Return to The Shed

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users



Popular Bike Shops
Torpedo 7 Torpedo7 AU
Ground Effect Ground Effect NZ
Chain Reaction Cycles CRC UK
Wiggle Wiggle UK
Ebay Ebay AU

“Bicycles BNA Twitter
“Bicycles BNA Facebook
“Google+ BNA Google+
“Bicycles BNA Newsletter

> FREE BNA Stickers
> BNA Cycling Kit