Glueless patches - bad experience or bad product?

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Glueless patches - bad experience or bad product?

Postby jasimon » Mon Jun 23, 2008 2:27 pm

I have recently been unlucky enough to experience a couple of flats.

The first time I put a new tube in and patched the old tube once I got home and made that my spare. The second time I used the patched tube and it got me home.

But this morning I found it flat - slow leak apparently as I couldn't find any actual hole. So I swapped in the other patched tube - that is now also flat. Another slow leak apparently. I'm guessing that the patches I have are faulty in some way.

I've followed the directions closely and haven't cut any corners I'm aware of (sand the area around the hole, hold for 30 seconds, inflate to check). So, is it that the particular brand of patches I got are dodgy (BBB) and not up to holding 100psi or is there a more general problem with the product? The patches themselves have more of the quality of wetsuit rubber than tube rubber in that they are 'thick' and can be compressed a little with squashing.

Any recommendations for glueless patches that work? (And 700x28C tubes that cost less than $10 per piece delivered?)

(To top it all off I need to practice changing tubes a bit more - these were both rear wheel flats and this morning I couldn't get the wheel to centre in the brakes properly when I put it back on. I gave up given that time was short and caught the bus. Anyone got any suggestions for ensuring proper alignment of the rear wheel when you put it back on?)
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by BNA » Mon Jun 23, 2008 2:42 pm

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Postby sogood » Mon Jun 23, 2008 2:42 pm

I carry and used Park Tool's self-adhesive patches. They work but can leak over time. So I just use it for emergencies. For patching at home, I use traditional patches and have found them far more reliable.
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Postby familyguy » Mon Jun 23, 2008 2:45 pm

+1 for Park patches and usage.

The glueless patches dont seem to be a permanent fix.

Jim
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Postby DavidH » Mon Jun 23, 2008 3:13 pm

I started using the Park self-adhesive patches a couple of months ago and I'm totally converted. I've repaired two punctures in the same tube with the glueless patches and both times the tube has held up perfectly under 110psi.

According to the instructions you are supposed to LIGHTLY sand the area with the supplied sandpaper before applying the patch, but I read somewhere that it's better just to make sure the are is clean and dry before applying the patch. Personally I give the area a clean and then a very light sand.
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Postby MJF » Mon Jun 23, 2008 4:13 pm

I used the Slime Scabs - seemed to work O.K. for first puncture, but on the second puncture, the first patch crinkled up when the tyre deflated and left paths for the air to escape.

If the patches were flexible and matched the expansion/contraction of the tube, it would probably work O.K... but in my experience, they are a temporary solution. And they are impossible to use in heavy rain...
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Postby nzdans » Mon Jun 23, 2008 7:12 pm

Another vote for the Park patches they are popular for a reason.

I have tried 3 or 4 other brands with less confidence, one was called a speedpatch and another looked like the Scabs but I don't think it was. From my experience any patch that has a foam look or closed cell appearance is not going to do the trick. I have also been known to take disposable alcohol wipes with me (multi purpose) and have used these for cleaning the tube before and / or after buffing with the emery paper.
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Postby eucryphia » Mon Jun 23, 2008 10:16 pm

I tried them, they'll get you home until you can put on a proper patch.

Saves having to carry two spare tubes...
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Postby sogood » Tue Jun 24, 2008 7:14 am

eucryphia wrote:I tried them, they'll get you home until you can put on a proper patch.

Don't count on it. The Park Tool's self-adhesive patch will leave a sticky residue on the tube and will render the area un-repairable using the traditional technique. So yes, it's good enough for emergency use but may also trash that same tube should it fail at some point.
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Postby jasimon » Tue Jun 24, 2008 8:21 am

sogood wrote:
eucryphia wrote:I tried them, they'll get you home until you can put on a proper patch.

Don't count on it. The Park Tool's self-adhesive patch will leave a sticky residue on the tube and will render the area un-repairable using the traditional technique. So yes, it's good enough for emergency use but may also trash that same tube should it fail at some point.

I experimented a little last night with my failed-patch tubes. I could peel the patches off with a little effort. To get the sticky gunk off I used turps. It cleaned the area up really well. Meths or similar may also work - but turps is what I had around the house. I then applied a different brand of glueless patch (Wrench Force I think - they have a much better feel than the previous ones and the glue is much stickier). These patches have done better than the old ones in that my tyre was still inflated to 100psi this morning. I'll see how it goes when I actually ride it tomorrow.
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Postby sogood » Tue Jun 24, 2008 8:29 am

jasimon wrote:I experimented a little last night with my failed-patch tubes. I could peel the patches off with a little effort. To get the sticky gunk off I used turps. It cleaned the area up really well. Meths or similar may also work - but turps is what I had around the house. I then applied a different brand of glueless patch (Wrench Force I think - they have a much better feel than the previous ones and the glue is much stickier). These patches have done better than the old ones in that my tyre was still inflated to 100psi this morning. I'll see how it goes when I actually ride it tomorrow.

In my case, the sticky residue was only noted when the patch failed a few months down the track. I suspect there may be a difference b/n newly applied patch and aged ones. I'll try turp should I get another chance and see if it's worthwhile.
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Postby Bnej » Tue Jun 24, 2008 9:07 am

I have park tool patches for emergencies on the road bike but generally you can't beat a traditional vulcanising cement rubber patch, they stick better and can last forever.

You'll never see someone finally changing the tube they've patched with 14 pre-glued patches!
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Postby sogood » Tue Jun 24, 2008 9:17 am

Bnej wrote:You'll never see someone finally changing the tube they've patched with 14 pre-glued patches!

And don't forget the cost of self-adhesive patches. That'd be an expensive tube with 14 of them on.
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Postby jasimon » Tue Jun 24, 2008 11:31 am

sogood wrote:And don't forget the cost of self-adhesive patches. That'd be an expensive tube with 14 of them on.

14xtubes = $140 (LBS price - and I have difficulty finding 700x28s elsewhere)
14xpatches= $14 (a little more for Park Tools patches)

Works for me.
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Postby Bnej » Tue Jun 24, 2008 12:05 pm

jasimon wrote:14xpatches= $14 (a little more for Park Tools patches)


You can buy rolls of regular patches at 20c per patch from phantomcycles.com.au, some bike shops will stock them too.

Just get one kit (BBB with 6 patches is $4) for the glue and you'll be able to repair each tube many times.
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Postby sogood » Tue Jun 24, 2008 12:09 pm

Bnej wrote:You can buy rolls of regular patches at 20c per patch from phantomcycles.com.au, some bike shops will stock them too.

Just get one kit (BBB with 6 patches is $4) for the glue and you'll be able to repair each tube many times.

One of the LBS in the inner west of Sydney sells them for 10¢ each. I think you can also get them in sheets on eBay. It's definitely the most economical and dependable route.
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Postby DavidH » Sun Jul 06, 2008 4:22 pm

Used my third Park glueless patch on Wednesday and 80km later the tube is still holding 110psi. As I said before, I'm completely sold on these things. The other two patches are on the same tube on a different bike, and it's holding up fine as well.

Tip: When I apply the patch I flatten out the tube/patch on the corner of a table and "work" the patch into the tube with a tyre lever. Takes about a minute.

No, they're not as cheap as traditional patches but I prefer them because they're so damn simple to apply and they work (so far anyway).
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Postby Bnej » Sun Jul 06, 2008 5:59 pm

DavidH wrote:Used my third Park glueless patch on Wednesday and 80km later the tube is still holding 110psi. As I said before, I'm completely sold on these things. The other two patches are on the same tube on a different bike, and it's holding up fine as well.


Mine lasted about 3 months.

The air pressure slowly pushes the glue off the tube from the puncture outwards. It's a slow process, but the air channel will eventually creep to the edge of the patch and the tyre will go down.

It's just the nature of the things - glue is not going to stick as well as a patch that fuses into the rubber of the tube.
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Postby DavidH » Sun Jul 06, 2008 9:58 pm

Bnej wrote:The air pressure slowly pushes the glue off the tube from the puncture outwards. It's a slow process, but the air channel will eventually creep to the edge of the patch and the tyre will go down.


I'll make a note of that and see how the tubes are holding up in three months time :D
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Postby r2160 » Mon Jul 07, 2008 6:07 pm

Hi

A while ago I heard about a company that was filling tubes with rubber under pressure that apparently did away with the need for air, flats, patches etc.

Are they still around? Do they really work like they say?

cheers
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"Pain is temporary. It may last a minute, or an hour, or a day, or a year, but eventually it will subside and something else will take its place. If I quit, however, it lasts forever" Lance Armstrong
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Postby HaywarM » Wed Jul 09, 2008 2:37 pm

when I used to mountain bike, and get flats, I used to use plain old electrical tape. It would last just fine to get home and even subsequent rides if I forgot. Until you ride through water!!

Now that I ride on the road, plenty of p's per si's and rubino Pros and i've had one flat in around 12000 kms. So I just carry a spare, CO2, and my mobile.
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