tyres for go fast...

Where speeds may exceed 60 kmph

tyres for go fast...

Postby boyracer » Thu Feb 12, 2009 3:18 pm

whats the best tyres for sustained high speed running ala derny paced hour. currently use clinchers,lots of different brands, but building new wheelset. should i go tubular. have seen some old boys running tubulars on track with rim tapes bound/shellacked(?!!?) over rim and tyre. thoughts appreciated but really after definitive technical data or actual user advice. cheers,G.
User avatar
boyracer
 
Posts: 604
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:29 pm

by BNA » Fri Feb 13, 2009 8:05 am

BNA
 

Postby toff » Fri Feb 13, 2009 8:05 am

Are you going to ride indoor or outdoor?

In my experience the indoor wooden tracks can be pretty slippery, so regardless of whether you go clincher or single, you want a tyre that will grip. I've seen plenty of riders come down in the bunch because of sideways slip. The wood is partially at fault, but the higher centrifugal forces on the tighter indoor tracks probably causes the traction loss.

For outdoor, these things matter less in my experience as the tracks are bigger and there is less centrifugal force.

I use clinchers on outdoor tracks, and for training. There is sometimes debris on the track outdoors, so if you get a puncture, it's easier to fix. (Having said that, I've NEVER had a puncture on any track!)

I use singles for indoor and racing. Mine are some sort of Vittorias, but it's been so long since I changed them I forget which type. Singles are much smoother. You can pump some of them up to as much as 220 PSI. Even at comparable pressures to clinchers, singles feel smoother, and you may see this reflected in your speed. Be careful though, because choosing to use singles with road glue will probably increase your rolling resistance over clinchers. The glue never fully hardens, so it constantly deforms under load as your wheels spin. If you can get the shellack, use it, and you'll feel faster, and will go faster.
User avatar
toff
 
Posts: 584
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2008 5:19 pm
Location: Between my seatpost and my stem.

Postby boyracer » Fri Feb 13, 2009 2:40 pm

outdoors at this stage. Edwardstown and Kilkenny? (south australia) and (mostly) road. Seems there's nothing wrong with the ol' school ways.
I know there is an art to mounting tubulars, anyone seen any video tutorials...you tube, etc?
what about TUFO tape?
with such big pressures and no sidewall strength i guess you're going down hard if they do pop.
Any one use FMB (french ) hand made tubulars. Have seen thread elsewhere raving about 'em.
User avatar
boyracer
 
Posts: 604
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:29 pm

Postby tallywhacker » Fri Feb 13, 2009 4:22 pm

I had a puncture on the track when using clinchers. You do not want that to happen, the tyre does not stay on the rim. One of the benfits of singles is if you do puncture it will generally stay on the rim because its glued on.
I'm using Tufo s3's wit6h tufo extreme tape. Those buggers are not moving once I pump them up to 160. Was speaking to a mechanic at a shop about gluing singles, they hate the tufo tape because its harder to get the tyre off than the regular glue.
Ever since the vasectomy...I mostly ride fixed.
User avatar
tallywhacker
 
Posts: 1589
Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2007 3:21 pm
Location: on the road

Postby mikesbytes » Fri Feb 13, 2009 5:57 pm

I ride on Contential Supersonic clinchers. 20mm on the front and 23mm on the rear.

I use 140psi front and rear on a concrete track and 155psi front and rear on a wooden track.
A helmet saved my life
User avatar
mikesbytes
Super Mod
Super Mod
 
Posts: 14541
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:42 pm
Location: Tempe, Sydney

Track Tubulars

Postby gemm » Mon Mar 23, 2009 12:34 pm

boyracer wrote:outdoors at this stage. Edwardstown and Kilkenny? (south australia) and (mostly) road. Seems there's nothing wrong with the ol' school ways.
I know there is an art to mounting tubulars, anyone seen any video tutorials...you tube, etc?
what about TUFO tape?
with such big pressures and no sidewall strength i guess you're going down hard if they do pop.
Any one use FMB (french ) hand made tubulars. Have seen thread elsewhere raving about 'em.


For Edwardstown and Hanson the only track-specific tubular that will hold up for regular use is the Tufo S33Pro or Conti Tempo. Vittoria's tyres are too fragile (including the CS= CheapSkate).
I don't use gluing tape, it is no easier (but it is quicker) than real glue, and makes a mess when changing tyres.
Tubulars are very easy to control when you get a puncture, as somone else said they stay put, don't flap about or come off the rim (or even more dangerously, jamb a wheel up)

If you are serious about doing paced hours at either track, better join Port Adel CC cause I'm yer motorpacer :lol: I also glue on tyres for beer for club-mates, I like the smell of glue.... :oops:

www . pacc . org . au
gemm
 
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2009 10:05 am

Re: Track Tubulars

Postby rustychisel » Mon Mar 23, 2009 4:23 pm

gemm wrote: better join Port Adel CC cause I'm yer motorpacer :lol: I also glue on tyres for beer for club-mates, I like the smell of glue.... :oops:

www . pacc . org . au



Classic! :lol:

He doesn't know the pain he's buying into... :evil:
rustychisel
 
Posts: 3335
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 12:39 pm

Re: Track Tubulars

Postby gemm » Tue Mar 24, 2009 7:52 am

rustychisel wrote:
gemm wrote: better join Port Adel CC cause I'm yer motorpacer :lol: I also glue on tyres for beer for club-mates, I like the smell of glue.... :oops:

www . pacc . org . au



Classic! :lol:

He doesn't know the pain he's buying into... :evil:


:lol: :lol: which bit - the gluing or the riding? :lol: :lol: :lol:
gemm
 
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2009 10:05 am

Re:

Postby Thoglette » Sun Apr 05, 2009 9:10 pm

boyracer wrote:I know there is an art to mounting tubulars, anyone seen any video tutorials...you tube, etc?


FWIW
http://www.yellowjersey.org/frontwheel.html
http://davesbikeblog.blogspot.com/2007/ ... art-i.html

Note that there are two types of glue - strada and pista. The street stuff never goes hard. The track stuff does and is faster as a result
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/roll ... bular.html
User avatar
Thoglette
 
Posts: 963
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:01 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby snailman » Mon May 04, 2009 11:20 pm

personally on an outdoor track i would be using clinchers as the risk of getting punctures is much higher and it just means changing over is so much easier.

Definitely if you have the chance though and you decide to use tubulars i would schellack them up, otherwise if you want a quicker way that is simple and easy and i've had no problems with use road glue which you should be able to buy from any good LBS. I used the vittoria brand on my two deep dish carbon wheels and have not had a problem at all, that being said however they're used only on the indoor wooden track and always rubbed down and let the air out.

Most tyres will do the right thing by you if you take good care of them, but have a look into a few and let us know how ya go.
snailman
 
Posts: 87
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:29 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby Verbs & Nouns » Thu Jun 04, 2009 2:09 pm

No matter what tyres you use, you're not going fast on Kilkenny.
Ten Grand wrote:Goddamnit baby, this is soul... What's wrong with you?
User avatar
Verbs & Nouns
 
Posts: 778
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:13 am
Location: Australia, South

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby alex » Fri Jun 05, 2009 3:04 am

do you mean hanson
if i get killed while out on my bike i dont want a 'memorial ride' by random punters i have never met.
alex
 
Posts: 1000
Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2008 9:12 am

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby Verbs & Nouns » Fri Jun 05, 2009 4:47 pm

alex wrote:do you mean hanson

Yeah.
Ten Grand wrote:Goddamnit baby, this is soul... What's wrong with you?
User avatar
Verbs & Nouns
 
Posts: 778
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:13 am
Location: Australia, South

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby rustychisel » Fri Jun 05, 2009 6:00 pm

Verbs & Nouns wrote:
alex wrote:do you mean hanson

Yeah.


8) 8) but at least a bus won't push you above the sprinter's line... 8) 8)
rustychisel
 
Posts: 3335
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 12:39 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby singlespeedscott » Sat Jun 27, 2009 8:47 am

I cant remember were I read it but I found an article comparing the latest clincher tyres, conti 4000s etal, against variuos tubs from Conti., Vittoria etc. In the tests the 4000s beat all the other clinchers and tubs for it's grip, rolling and puncture resistance. Based on that if I had to choose I would use the new Conti. force and attack with the black chili compound over any tub. I don't understand why people think that tubs stay but because every major crash I have seen on the track the tubs have just peeled off the rims.
Image
User avatar
singlespeedscott
 
Posts: 2704
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:35 pm
Location: Elimbah, Queensland

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby Thoglette » Sat Jun 27, 2009 1:03 pm

singlespeedscott wrote:I cant remember were I read it but I found an article comparing the latest clincher tyres, conti 4000s etal, against variuos tubs from Conti., Vittoria etc. In the tests the 4000s beat all the other .....


Reminds me of one year when some major car magazine awarded the Subaru WRX "best sports car of the year" - over a field of hopefuls including the Lotus Elise and Porsche 911.

My interest was piqued and I obtained a copy of the review. Now I was expecting the 911 and Elise to be ruled out for "expense" and "cabin noise" or something similar. No, no, NO. Both of these cars were ruled out for "handling flaws".

It may not suprise you that Subaru adverts were found in the magazine and Porsche and Lotus adverts were absent.

Now it may be that the Conti 4000s arebetter. In which case one can expect about half the TdF peleton to be running them in a week or so (the other half will be running tubeless tyres, if the reviews are to be believed).

Don't forget your salt!
User avatar
Thoglette
 
Posts: 963
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:01 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby singlespeedscott » Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:41 pm

Ah yes but team riders are limited by sponsorship requirements and some teams do use clinchers over tubs.
Image
User avatar
singlespeedscott
 
Posts: 2704
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:35 pm
Location: Elimbah, Queensland

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby Thoglette » Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:51 pm

singlespeedscott wrote:Ah yes but team riders are limited by sponsorship requirements and some teams do use clinchers over tubs.


Yes - it's interesting watching is the number of de-badged and rebadged components on pro-bikes over the years . Including various sorts of tyres

Ah, google does it again. A smoking gun
User avatar
Thoglette
 
Posts: 963
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:01 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby Thoglette » Sun Jun 28, 2009 12:29 am

singlespeedscott wrote:Based on that if I had to choose I would use the new Conti. force and attack with the black chili compound over any tub.


Black Chili does seem to be on the list of sticky tyres - I think it's also available in tubular for Those That Must. (hmm... 'Competition 22 Tubular Tyres')
User avatar
Thoglette
 
Posts: 963
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:01 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby boyracer » Wed Sep 02, 2009 7:44 pm

so anyway,where does the time go? i got some tufo 33 tubs and 4000 black chilli clinchers and will test 'em back to back. If your lurking around Gemma, when will the motorpacing start again for the summer?
User avatar
boyracer
 
Posts: 604
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:29 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby mikesbytes » Wed Sep 02, 2009 10:45 pm

boyracer wrote:so anyway,where does the time go? i got some tufo 33 tubs and 4000 black chilli clinchers and will test 'em back to back. If your lurking around Gemma, when will the motorpacing start again for the summer?


So you've gone for road tyres, I've got them on my road bike.

Let us know how the tufo 33 tubes go.
A helmet saved my life
User avatar
mikesbytes
Super Mod
Super Mod
 
Posts: 14541
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:42 pm
Location: Tempe, Sydney

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:35 pm

boyracer wrote:so anyway,where does the time go? i got some tufo 33 tubs and 4000 black chilli clinchers and will test 'em back to back. If your lurking around Gemma, when will the motorpacing start again for the summer?

the tufos are, in general, not a fast tyre.

The best tufos have about 10% greater rolling resistance than the best tyres. The S33 is about 60% high RR than the best tyres.
User avatar
Alex Simmons/RST
Expert
 
Posts: 3251
Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 3:51 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby boyracer » Thu Sep 03, 2009 4:56 pm

as per OP most of my pacing is on the road. Local 'velo' is concrete and flat as. no place for clemente silks. What would you ride Alex, regardless of cost on bitumen/ concrete? have had no probs with my last (2nd hand) s33's but willing to look at all options.
User avatar
boyracer
 
Posts: 604
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:29 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Thu Sep 03, 2009 5:39 pm

boyracer wrote:as per OP most of my pacing is on the road. Local 'velo' is concrete and flat as. no place for clemente silks. What would you ride Alex, regardless of cost on bitumen/ concrete? have had no probs with my last (2nd hand) s33's but willing to look at all options.

Veloflex Record
User avatar
Alex Simmons/RST
Expert
 
Posts: 3251
Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 3:51 pm

Re: tyres for go fast...

Postby gemm » Wed Sep 16, 2009 1:07 pm

boyracer wrote:so anyway,where does the time go? i got some tufo 33 tubs and 4000 black chilli clinchers and will test 'em back to back. If your lurking around Gemma, when will the motorpacing start again for the summer?


Ooh I am lurking :twisted:
Might not be doing motorpacing this summer due to other time committments - PACC is doing some of the indoor Wednesday night track series (stay Tuned for more info, it will be different from the other stody fare!). It *may* be I bring the bike out on the occasional tuesday, assuming the club has the track booked.

Tuesday night - Crit, Wednesday night - Track (Superdrome), Friday Night - Track (Edwardstown), Sat- cruise, Sunday - Crits!!

See you on Friday nights? First cab off the rank is 9th Oct... Roller Derby upstairs afterwards (beers + rollers = fun)

Oh and a Veloflex Record tub will last about half a lap at Edwardstown!
gemm
 
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2009 10:05 am

Next

Return to Track

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users



Support BNA
Click for online shops
Torpedo 7 Torpedo7 AU
Ground Effect Ground Effect NZ
Chain Reaction Cycles CRC UK
Wiggle Wiggle UK
Cycling Express Cycling Express
Ebay Ebay AU
ProBikeKit ProBikeKit UK
Evans Cycles Evans Cycles UK
JensonUSA Jenson USA
JensonUSA Competitive Cyclist