When is close too close?

Beating the system - the cycling commuting section

When is close too close?

Postby Krellon » Sun Mar 16, 2014 3:12 am

Hi,

I wondered what your thoughts were on acceptable vehicle passes and when is close too close.

I had a few in the past on my commutes which I thought were maybe a little too close. Especially considering the speed they were doing.

Here is a link to some of those passes. What do you think?

http://youtu.be/77-5-IPF-jk

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by BNA » Sun Mar 16, 2014 6:34 am

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Re: When is close too close?

Postby trailgumby » Sun Mar 16, 2014 6:34 am

Most if not all of those were culpably dangerous. You need to ride either fully on the shoulder or take control of the lane.

Drivers are notoriously poor at judging gap distances and you need to help them by removing ambiguity.

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Re: When is close too close?

Postby lobstermash » Sun Mar 16, 2014 6:51 am

Whenever your reaction is 'whoa, that was close' it's too close.
Passing on your right - me, said just about never...
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby thecaptn » Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:51 am

Can you tell us where abouts these videos were recorded?
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby R12RT » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:34 am

In my opinion there are far too many drivers who don't know where the left hand side of their car is to be able to judge safe passing distance.

Another example of this is two way unmarked roads. Without a centre line to guide them, many drivers will drive down the middle of the road. This forces oncoming drivers to scrape the kerb of move off the road to avoid them.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby thecaptn » Sun Mar 16, 2014 12:16 pm

R12RT wrote:In my opinion there are far too many drivers who don't know where the left hand side of their car is to be able to judge safe passing distance.

Another example of this is two way unmarked roads. Without a centre line to guide them, many drivers will drive down the middle of the road. This forces oncoming drivers to scrape the kerb of move off the road to avoid them.

I think it's too easy to get and keep a drivers licence when the results of getting it wrong can be the death of another. We as a community are far to tolerant of poor driving and poor driving atitudes.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Krellon » Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:45 pm

trailgumby wrote:Most if not all of those were culpably dangerous. You need to ride either fully on the shoulder or take control of the lane.

Drivers are notoriously poor at judging gap distances and you need to help them by removing ambiguity.

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I do try and ride too the conditions. On busy roads I get nervous at some of the speeds cars do and move over to give them more room. Most observe and pass safely but the odd crazies don't care and deliberately drive as close as they can to scare you. Normally the anti cyclist type.

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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Krellon » Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:47 pm

thecaptn wrote:Can you tell us where abouts these videos were recorded?


Hello Captain,

This is in the UK. Southern part. I posted to a couple of none UK forums to gauge global opinion. The roads in the UK suck and although the government rant on about how pro cyclist they are I really don't think there doing anough.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Krellon » Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:48 pm

R12RT wrote:In my opinion there are far too many drivers who don't know where the left hand side of their car is to be able to judge safe passing distance.

Another example of this is two way unmarked roads. Without a centre line to guide them, many drivers will drive down the middle of the road. This forces oncoming drivers to scrape the kerb of move off the road to avoid them.


I agree and I see all too often that it's not the cyclist put in danger but the oncoming traffic.

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Re: When is close too close?

Postby briztoon » Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:57 pm

thecaptn wrote:Can you tell us where abouts these videos were recorded?


I believe he is UK based.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Krellon » Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:09 am

Hi,

Today I rode further out from the curb as posters suggested.
For the best part the drivers did give me a wider birth but I sensed there frustration with speed and revs.
One actually took a very silly risk in a overtake into a blind bend on a hill.

http://youtu.be/2sa1r0e2-68

These are the risky overtake maneuvers drivers take the further out we ride.
We become safer but oncoming traffic is put in more danger.
Looks like we can't win.

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Re: When is close too close?

Postby mick243 » Mon Mar 17, 2014 7:39 am

But in both cases, it's the following driver causing danger, so do what keeps you safer and let the driver be his own problem.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby bychosis » Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:39 am

Like above, too close is when I feel uncomfortable with the pass. At a faster speed the same pass distance might still feel too close.

I take the lane where required, but realis that I am much slower than motorised traffic and do my bit to keep to wide shoulders etc if there is enough space me. The more I have ridden, the more I realise that leaving space for a car will be treated as an opportunity to pass, when I really want to control when the vehicles pass as best I can. Often that means getting right out wide
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Krellon » Tue Mar 18, 2014 6:35 am

bychosis wrote:Like above, too close is when I feel uncomfortable with the pass. At a faster speed the same pass distance might still feel too close.

I take the lane where required, but realis that I am much slower than motorised traffic and do my bit to keep to wide shoulders etc if there is enough space me. The more I have ridden, the more I realise that leaving space for a car will be treated as an opportunity to pass, when I really want to control when the vehicles pass as best I can. Often that means getting right out wide


"leaving space for a car will be treated as an opportunity to pass" Yes, today I rode further out and less people tried too squeeze through though they were more agitated because they couldn't get through.

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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Xplora » Wed Mar 19, 2014 10:13 am

^^ That's because they are retarded... they wouldn't run their grandmother off the road, and they wouldn't let someone else run their grandmother off the road, so part of growing a pair involves getting around them in a safe manner. Moving across is all well and fine, but there are a million times when this isn't appropriate, it's not a God given right, and often a car user can simply pull into the other lane and overtake. You know... they might have to drive the car. :shock:
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby bychosis » Wed Mar 19, 2014 10:21 am

Unfortunately its a balancing act between getting out wide (in the way) and staying out of harm.

Cyclist rammed from behind - webcam footage

I still tend towards getting out wide and now have a few sections of my regular riding where I conserve some energy beforehand and get out wide and go for it. At least then I look like I'm putting in some effort for those motorists that think I'm just out to spoil their drive.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Blackrock » Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:13 pm

Here's one I had last week. I was riding close to the edge and it is a narrow bridge. I was semi-ok with the truck passing mearby, but wasn't expecting the trailer and it could have caught me out.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby InTheWoods » Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:26 pm

:shock: That was bad. What was that, 10cm? Should put it in the moron motorists thread...
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Hugh Stone » Fri Mar 21, 2014 8:46 pm

That couldn't have been much closer! Was that Prospect Hwy? Scary patch either direction there.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Rhubarb » Fri Mar 21, 2014 8:50 pm

Blackrock wrote:Here's one I had last week. I was riding close to the edge and it is a narrow bridge. I was semi-ok with the truck passing mearby, but wasn't expecting the trailer and it could have caught me out.


Come April 7 in Qld, that pass will cost the driver $330 and 3 demerit points. Repeat offences will cost him his license and thus his job.

I think this is going to make a few of these guys change their thinking. At least I hope so.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Blackrock » Sun Mar 23, 2014 9:42 am

Hugh Stone wrote:That couldn't have been much closer! Was that Prospect Hwy? Scary patch either direction there.

Yeah it was the overpass of the Great Western Highway, heading towards the M4 roundabout. Many close calls all along that stretch....
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Bentnose » Sat Mar 29, 2014 7:18 am

Why don't they put a ramp up on to the footpath and make it a shared zone, or does that make too much sense?
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby ldrcycles » Sat Mar 29, 2014 10:30 am

thecaptn wrote:I think it's too easy to get and keep a drivers licence when the results of getting it wrong can be the death of another. We as a community are far too tolerant of poor driving and poor driving atitudes.


+HEAPS. Enough is enough.
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Mububban » Fri Apr 04, 2014 11:50 am

R12RT wrote:In my opinion there are far too many drivers who don't know where the left hand side of their car is to be able to judge safe passing distance.


I get this all the time and it baffles me. The roads I commute on are wide enough to allow me to hug the kerb, and a full sized vehicle like a Toyota Landcruiser or a delivery van can hug the white lane line and overtake me safely without having to cross into the second lane. I don't slow down traffic and I also don't worry about getting smooshed. Easy right?
Then why is it that Joe Moron can watch me being safely overtaken by the cars in front of them, but when it's their turn to drive their city hatchback past me, they suddenly think they have no room to do so?!?!? They then back up traffic behind them, probably swearing all the while at the "dumb cyclist hogging the road".

I guess if you want evidence of how poor many drivers are at knowing where their corners of their car are, watch your average suburban shopping centre carpark as people do 5 point turns, when their bumper is still over a metre away from the parked cars :roll:
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Re: When is close too close?

Postby Mububban » Fri Apr 04, 2014 11:59 am

I think it's too easy to get and keep a drivers licence when the results of getting it wrong can be the death of another. We as a community are far to tolerant of poor driving and poor driving atitudes.


Some of the stories you hear about exceptional licenses being granted to repeat offenders who then go on to kill/hospitalise someone just boggle the mind
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