Alcohol

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Alcohol

Postby aussie » Wed Jan 06, 2010 7:29 pm

I luvs me riding, but i also luvs me alcohol, ive heard lots of different things, is having 3 or 4 beers after a hard day on the bike going to undo any hard work????
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by BNA » Wed Jan 06, 2010 8:03 pm

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Re: Alcohol

Postby damhooligan » Wed Jan 06, 2010 8:03 pm

does it matter??

I have fun riding, and i have fun drinking...
Don't see the problem... :mrgreen:

only just drinking and not riding would be worse...
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Re: Alcohol

Postby steveoc » Wed Jan 06, 2010 8:20 pm

Good question. I wish I could give you a positive answer to this one.

Improvement in fitness through training is a process where you exersize to cause damage, and then the 'damaged areas' - muscles,etc, repair themselves to be stronger than before during a recovery period. Its not the ride itself that does you any good, its the ride + the subsequent recovery after the ride that add up to improvement in form.

So it depends what you mean by 'after' the hard ride. You need to do recovery at some point soon after the ride, and alcohol definitely will interfere with recovery - the cells need plenty of water to function, but alcohol sucks up all the water. Have a good drink of water and a long sleep to let all those cells get their H2O, and then hit the p*** when you get up in order to minimize the downside.

Best case scenario is that with alcohol after the ride, recovery will be delayed through dehydration. Worse case is that recovery will be interfered with significantly to the point where muscle fibres damaged during training will not get any chance to recover ... so you will be worse off than if you skipped the ride altogether and sat on the couch all day. (But then, to get that far, we are well beyond the beers, mostly through the scotches, and seriously thinking that lining up the tequilas is a great idea)

Eating a tonne of bananas before hitting the beers is a good idea - give the body some carbs to replace what has been burnt up, and let them settle in. The extra potassium in the bananas works wonders in taking the kick out of tomorrows hangovers. Try it.

Alcohol before a ride (like the day before), is seriously wrong. Alcohol contains 7 Cals per gram (compared to 4/4/9 for carbs, protein, fats) ... so there is a lot of 'energy' in alcohol, but these calories are not useful for exersize energy ... they are only useful for generating heat. Go for a hard ride after a big night out, and you may do serious damage to your kidneys.

Another nasty with alcohol is that interferes with the krebs cycle - a metabolic process that allows the body to convert excess stored fat into something useful - energy or other building materials to make new muscles, grow the lungs, extend the network of veins, etc. If you drink consistently and ride ... then you may find that no matter how hard and how often you work out ... the fat just wont go away.

Finally, alcohol itself is a cell killer. It rips apart just about any living cell it comes in contact with. Thats not a good thing.

Having a few beers is fine in moderation - may as well go for quality not quantity - something expensive and full of carbs is the better option if you are going to enjoy it. The hardest bit is knowing when to stop.
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Re: Alcohol

Postby Baldy » Wed Jan 06, 2010 8:59 pm

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Re: Alcohol

Postby jules21 » Wed Jan 06, 2010 9:14 pm

principally, alcohol is known to kill brain cells and rot your liver. in today's world, it's trendy to attribute all sorts of nasty repercussions to 'anti social' activities, such as drinking, even when there seems to be a lack of medical evidence to support it. i think you can go overboard - there's nothing wrong with enjoying a few drinks, as long as you follow the usual guidelines, hydrate properly after a ride and keep it in moderation. but then, like some who would tell you it will chop 10 years off your life, i'm no expert :)
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Re: Alcohol

Postby wombatK » Wed Jan 06, 2010 9:40 pm

Depending on what you mean by "me riding" and "me alcohol", you'll certainly be undoing some good work. Just from a calorie balance point of view, lets suppose 3 or 4 beers means 3 cans. That about 400 calories. If "me riding" means one hour at about 30 kph for a 90 kg person, you'll have spent about 1000 calories. So the beer is undoing half of that.

There is more too it though than just taking on calories. 75% of the calories in beer are from alcohol, and alcohol interferes with the absorption of other essential nutrients your body needs - not just the hydration. That's why chronic alcoholics get thiamin deficiency related diseases (as well as numerous other health issues). If you are riding a few times a week, and taking on this much alcohol each time, you'd be well into the chronic alcoholic territory - and might not recognise this. 3 or 4 beers is well beyond the moderate intake range.

Really, alcohol is probably the worst recovery drink you could turn to. Do your body a huge favour and moderate the alcohol intake. Better still, why not try a purpose made recovery drink and see how much better you'll feel for it ?
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Re: Alcohol

Postby jules21 » Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:13 am

wombatK wrote:That about 400 calories. If "me riding" means one hour at about 30 kph for a 90 kg person, you'll have spent about 1000 calories. So the beer is undoing half of that.

i don't think that's quite right. if you spend 1000 calories, you need to replace 1000 calories. if you only drink the beer, there's still another 600 you need to source. obviously calories ain't calories and beer is a poor means of replacing them, which i suspect is the bigger issue. if you were replacing the 1000 calories with dinner, however, the 400 beer calories would contribute towards growing your gut :)
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Re: Alcohol

Postby toolonglegs » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:03 pm

I would say it would be detrimental for sure...but it depends if this is everyday or not.I be surprised if you could train hard 5 days a week and drink 3 or 4 beers a day...I would be asleep all day long drinking that :lol: .If you are talking about a once a week hard ride then relaxing with a drink then I wouldn't worry.
Me....cycling just seems to make me go without...I spend too much time on the bike and having a drink just hammers me...probably getting old!.But I can always use the "well if I wasn't riding I would be down the pub" line... :twisted: .
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Re: Alcohol

Postby PortableDave » Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:06 pm

http://cyclingnutrition.blogspot.com/20 ... ction.html

Interesting post about the subject.
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Re: Alcohol

Postby wombatK » Fri Jan 08, 2010 7:06 pm

PortableDave wrote:http://cyclingnutrition.blogspot.com/2009/10/alcohol-blunts-atp-production.html

Interesting post about the subject.

+1. The sooner some of Sydney's NRL footbrawlers wise up to this, the better their footy will be. Unfortunately, alcohol also impairs mental performance and obviously prevents them seeing this.

Still, it was refreshing to hear Nathan Hauritz's comment on celebrating the Test win this week. He mentioned he would have a drink with the team, but would limit his intake because he needed to work on the recovery of his injured thumb. The smarter sports men and women know what's good for them. You don't need to be a wowser - just not a walking talking brewery advertisement.

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Re: Alcohol

Postby catnfiddle » Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:04 pm

Alcohol is bad, I was going to post a similar post, but you beat me too it.

I got back on my saddle last year, after basically 14 years of abuse and socialising, although I dont think I was an alcho, when i look at it, I think I am bordering on the edge.......

Anyhow as I started riding, 3-4 times a week last year, i kicked the booze most nights, a few here and there to reward me, nothing night before a ride, now my fitness increased and I did some reasonable times, but as xmas arrived and I hit the booze it all become hard again, my times deteriorated, the heat, the hangovers, and even a few beers just whacked the showtime out of me...I started to become lazy again....

Its NY, and I havent drank all week, which is a long time, when you look at the last 5 weeks, not ridden hard since beginning of Dec and I have a new riding partner, who is fit, and I am unconditioned totally now, I can feel it waking up, before a ride etc...and during the day, I have stacked 3.2kg back on since Dec.....

One thing is for sure, I am trying hard to go T-total..... serious tho, I am worried, how alchol is so important in my life....therefore i am replacing it with cycling hopefully....as for the money, I'd have a full tour bus with the money I spent on grog....... just a rant thats all.....
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Re: Alcohol

Postby foo on patrol » Thu Jan 14, 2010 5:00 am

Nothing wrong with a couple of beers each day, just don't do the 4 beers every day. Make sure you have a big glass of water before you have the beers to. :)
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Re: Alcohol

Postby aussie » Thu Jan 14, 2010 12:00 pm

Definitely not talking about 4 beers every day, maybe friday saturday night, im no alco.

I did experience the bad side the other day, i got a little bit excited with my alcohol consumption one night, then the next morning i felt fine so i thought i would go for a short roll, and oh my god what an effort, my legs just didnt seem to want to go, but i perservered thinking it will get easier....bzzzzzz wrong it got worse big time, my legs felt like they were drunk they had no coordination, they felt overly tired and just plain crap. So in the end just stomped the pedals all the way home and spent the rest of the day drinking water trying to get my fluids back up.

So dehydration i think is what it mainly comes down to, and i guess i answered my own question in the end :?
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Re: Alcohol

Postby JV911 » Fri Jan 15, 2010 6:55 am

This is what booze does to you. Lucky it wasn't in the US or the guy would have been shot...

Man too drunk to find own house, court told

A Brisbane man who entered his neighbour's apartment and got dressed up in the man's cycling outfit was so drunk he thought he was in his own home, a court has heard.

Nicholas Bruce O'Keefe, 22, climbed into the Dunmore Terrace apartment in Auchenflower through a window on the night of December 5 last year.

O'Keefe, who actually lived two doors down, rummaged through a cupboard full of health supplements before rooting around in drawers and cupboards in a bedroom.

Police prosecutor Sergeant Karen Friedrichs said the apartment's owner returned home some time later to find O'Keefe in the loungeroom, wearing the man's cycling gloves, bike helmet and tampering with his bicycle.
O'Keefe pleaded guilty in the Brisbane Magistrates Court today to one count of entering a dwelling and stealing.

Representing himself, O'Keefe said he had been "extremely intoxicated" at the time and only realised his mistake when the police turned up.

"I actually believed I was in my own house," O'Keefe said.

"I only realised what was happening when police arrived to arrest me."

O'Keefe, who has now moved to Toowoomba, apologised to the court, saying he had never been in trouble before.

Magistrate Chris Callaghan accepted O'Keefe's explanation and fined him $200, sparing him a criminal conviction.
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Re: Alcohol

Postby toolonglegs » Sat Jan 16, 2010 4:48 am

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Re: Alcohol

Postby ft_critical » Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:35 pm

Henrich Haussler wrote:"During my time with Gerolsteiner I wasn’t so serious, and was doing other stuff like drinking and partying," he admitted. "I started thinking stupid, spending my money on showtime. I was thinking I was it. That’s the reason why in 2006 or 2007 I had glandular fever, because in the winter I was drinking like crazy and turning up to training drunk.

“It was really stupid and I maybe I threw four or five years of my career out of the window, but I had to go through it to learn how to respect my body and learn how to live like a professional. Because if you want to be good at this level, you’ve got to be 100 percent otherwise you’ve no chance.”


Turning up to Pro Training drunk, are you kidding? :shock:
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Re: Alcohol

Postby casual_cyclist » Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:10 am

catnfiddle wrote:as for the money, I'd have a full tour bus with the money I spent on grog....... just a rant thats all.....

hmm, lets see... if you cut back on the booze and save the money... you will be able to buy a lovely, shiny new bike! :D :D :D

I know that would motivate me! :mrgreen:
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Re: Alcohol

Postby Bruce » Sat Jan 23, 2010 2:02 am

toolonglegs wrote:I would say it would be detrimental for sure...but it depends if this is everyday or not.I be surprised if you could train hard 5 days a week and drink 3 or 4 beers a day...I would be asleep all day long drinking that :lol: .If you are talking about a once a week hard ride then relaxing with a drink then I wouldn't worry.
Me....cycling just seems to make me go without...I spend too much time on the bike and having a drink just hammers me...probably getting old!.But I can always use the "well if I wasn't riding I would be down the pub" line... :twisted: .

OR the line 'cycling keeps me off the streets and out of trouble' :P
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Re: Alcohol

Postby toolonglegs » Sat Jan 23, 2010 2:04 am

Bruce wrote:
toolonglegs wrote:I would say it would be detrimental for sure...but it depends if this is everyday or not.I be surprised if you could train hard 5 days a week and drink 3 or 4 beers a day...I would be asleep all day long drinking that :lol: .If you are talking about a once a week hard ride then relaxing with a drink then I wouldn't worry.
Me....cycling just seems to make me go without...I spend too much time on the bike and having a drink just hammers me...probably getting old!.But I can always use the "well if I wasn't riding I would be down the pub" line... :twisted: .

OR the line 'cycling keeps me off the streets and out of trouble' :P


But my wife knows me too well...cycling doesn't keep me off the streets and I am often in trouble :lol: .
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Re: Alcohol

Postby the_clydesdale » Sat Jan 23, 2010 4:02 pm

I know it is still Alcohol but Wine is meant to be a bit better than beer, especially my prefered Red.

I will be having a bottle tonight but have been (today) and will continue to down the water with the Wine to minimise the Dehydration effect and hope I will be fine.

In regards to drinking after training, what does that mean. If you go for a ride at dawn does drinking that night class as drinking after training, particularly after a lot of water and good common sense food?

Interesting subject!
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Re: Alcohol

Postby wombatK » Sat Jan 23, 2010 4:48 pm

the_clydesdale wrote:In regards to drinking after training, what does that mean. If you go for a ride at dawn does drinking that night class as drinking after training, particularly after a lot of water and good common sense food?

Good question. The study referred to above involved having athletes have six drinks within 3 hours of training, and was shown to be damaging. Don't know if anyone has researched your question - i.e. drinking a bottle of red about 12 hours after training.

So u might have to guess the answer. There is research that moderate drinking of red wine has benefits for the average person. By moderate, people are talking one or two glasses. But they're not talking about people training for peak performance.

Probably need a sports exercise specialist to answer this, but my guess would be that your body would not have recovered from a full training session within 24 hours and drinking in that time will impair the benefits.

The Australian sports dietitians recommend minimal alcohol. By way of further explanation:
Alcohol is usually available after surf carnivals and is often readily consumed after competition. Alcohol has the potential to significantly hamper recovery from exercise and it is usually not recommended. However, one or two drinks after competition are not likely to impact too much on recovery as long as sufficient food and non-alcoholic beverages are consumed prior to taking in alcohol.

It would be fair to conclude that even 1 or 2 drinks will impact your recovery, but that you can minimize the damage by hydrating well and having sufficient food. But if you drink more than 1 or 2 drinks per day, you will probably have drunkards digestion and would be seriously undermining your training and recovery.

It doesn't matter whether the alcohol is in beer or wine - it's the alcohol causing the effect. The benefit in red wine comes from other things in the mix - believed to be anti-oxidants or flavinoids. Some of these are considered to help heart health through action in raising good cholesterol (HDL) while lowering bad cholesterol (LDL), and other mechanisms. But it may also raise triglycerides (bad!), raises the risk of cancer, and alcohol is empty calories that raise the risk of obesity. The American Heart Association cautions people NOT to start drinking if they do not already drink alcohol.

Your bottle of red wine probably contains 500+ calories - nearly an hour of serious riding needed to take that off.

Cheers
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Re: Alcohol

Postby foo on patrol » Sat Jan 23, 2010 6:32 pm

There is nothing wrong with, having a couple of drinks, at night!!!!!! Not 4-5 or 6, that is the big difference :!:
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Re: Alcohol

Postby wombatK » Sat Jan 23, 2010 8:51 pm

foo on patrol wrote:There is nothing wrong with, having a couple of drinks, at night!!!!!! Not 4-5 or 6, that is the big difference :!:
Gary

Whether there is something wrong with a couple of drinks depends on your objectives.

FWIW - I do have 1 or sometimes 2 drinks at nights (red wine, but sometimes a beer). It's enjoyable, and a risk I'm prepared to take given that I'm cycling for fitness only. If I was training to win races, and wanted to squeeze out the last ounce of benefit from the training, I'd reduce my consumption.

Certainly agree that 4 or more drinks is a different scenario. That's a drinking problem for anyone.
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Re: Alcohol

Postby JV911 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 8:43 am

the_clydesdale wrote:I know it is still Alcohol but Wine is meant to be a bit better than beer, especially my prefered Red.


presumably for the anti-oxidants?

from what i've read its not unusual for some of the pros to have "a glass of beer" with dinner, i assume for the carbs
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Re: Alcohol

Postby Burt 'Pigeon Racer' Jones » Mon Jan 25, 2010 8:06 pm

JV911 wrote:from what i've read its not unusual for some of the pros to have "a glass of beer" with dinner, i assume for the carbs


I'm carbo loading right now then.
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