Base Yourself

The foundations for successful riding

Base Yourself

Postby ft_critical » Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:29 pm

Cyclingnews Fitness Q&A - April 20, 2010 wrote:What I'm sure of is that when we have people do a good base followed by LT work and more base for another month, and then have them start racing, their best racing form hits a few weeks later. Then, as they continue to get plenty of super hard training in the form of racing in a field where they have to suffer to compete, form begins to disappear roughly 6-10 weeks later. If hard training were the secret to racing ability, they should only get stronger and stronger once racing starts, but that never happens.


I have often wondered when one should go back to base training.

The unanswered question in my head is whether the above applies to Club level riders or just to pros? My theory, of the year, is race more and I will get better at racing. However, the above indicates that I need to have breaks (and quite long ones) where I go back to base training. I know from reading Friel that you plan your year as a 1 to x peak season and do a recovery then base 2, followed by a build 2 phase after each peak. Peaks being your A races. My schedule looks like a whole bunch of races with some more important than the others. i.e., I am in Build 2 all year.

I read another article on PEZ that indicated that with the amount of time most club cyclists have to train - 12hr pw I think was the figure mentioned - the should spend much more time on intensive training rather than base miles.

Building Early Season Fitness 2: Tempo Training, Tuesday, January 12, 2010 wrote:...but for the athlete on limited time you are well served on a diet of tempo/threshold workouts week to week.


Discuss?
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by BNA » Wed Apr 21, 2010 2:24 pm

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Re: Base Yourself

Postby Dunk » Wed Apr 21, 2010 2:24 pm

Good topic...

I always drop the intensity, and to a lesser extent quantity in July and a bit of August for about 6 weeks all up. It's sort of my "off season" and helps with the late nights watching the Tour. :lol:
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby toolonglegs » Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:05 pm

Throw the Friel book away :lol: .
My base is in freezing weather...so I can't ride long outside (or go over 90 minutes on the trainer)...so it is all at tempo or above.
Plan this year is to race from March till June...peaking for hopefully 4 weeks from end of May till 20 June...then if I still have great form race it a bit longer...maybe a week or two.Then go and watch the tour with the kids...go visit family in Spain and relax etc.
Pretty much back off a bit in July and then refocus for a hopeful mini peak in late August/Sept.
Having a proper winter makes it easy to lay things out thou...unlike Oz where you can race all year round.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby brendancg » Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:41 pm

I am not the best rider in the world but this is what I do for my road riding.

1) Identify races that I really want to race through various times of the year.
2) Have a base training for most of the year which is just heart rate stuff, maintain a certain heart rate, not overly long rides just mix up the courses to make it interesting
3) A couple of months out from the race ramp up the efforts, pushing the bigger k's and doing some interval training
4) 6 weeks out start to compete in the local club type races, make you put extra effort and push yourself into the hurt box
5) Compete in the race
6) Have a week or two off after the targeted race, then start again for the next one.

I find the aiming at particular races makes it easier for you to put yourself in the hurt box in training. Otherwise I tend to get a bit jaded and slack. Also having the break after the race, makes the missus happy and regenerates the love for the effort so to speak.
Yesterday was an easy day.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby ft_critical » Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:02 pm

Another thing I wonder... 'cause I am given to wondering.

So when you want to stay at 96% LT which for me is HR 156 and imagining I had a power meter 256watts (just making it up,) when you do a base ride do you:

1. try to stay as close to that number in all terrain, or
2. just try to get the avg for the ride to be as close to that number as possible?

For me it is #1.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby brendancg » Thu Apr 22, 2010 1:03 pm

Mate for me it is #1 as well. That way you are not really going into the hurt box that often and it is easier to maintain the motivation but you are still putting your body at times into an overload section so that the body doesn't fully adapt and you can still get some benefit from the effort.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby toolonglegs » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:17 pm

I have no idea of my LT...only my FTP (not the same).
I have no motivation for base k's...they are boring and suck.
Tempo / SST / Threshold and above...ask Ant how much time he spends below SST :lol: .
PS...he is way over 5w per kg these days :shock: .
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby ft_critical » Fri Apr 23, 2010 8:24 am

toolonglegs wrote:I have no idea of my LT...only my FTP (not the same).
I have no motivation for base k's...they are boring and suck.
Tempo / SST / Threshold and above...ask Ant how much time he spends below SST :lol: .
PS...he is way over 5w per kg these days :shock: .


I assume the below is for a season. I am not even sure I have the data to work this out for myself. Anyone else know for a training year?

Building Early Season Fitness 2: Tempo Training, Tuesday, January 12, 2010 wrote:Esteve-Lanao et al. (2007) prescribed a polarized program of 77-3-20% of training time in zones 1-2-3 respectively (endurance, threshold, high intensity), yet found that the athletes defaulted to 65-21-14% of training time in the same 1-2-3 zones.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby toolonglegs » Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:35 pm

Looking at my chart for the last 28 days...
19 Hours under 187w...not including zero watts.Bunch rides /Races are full of times not doing anything!.
10 Hours at endurance pace...188-254w...thats a lot of JRA...will have to see how much is in races.
5 Hours at Tempo...254-304w.
4 Hours at Threshold 304-354w...FTP is at 345 at the moment.
3 Hours at VO2 Max...355-404w.
4 Hours at Anaerobic Cap...404w and above.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby twizzle » Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:58 pm

toolonglegs wrote:Looking at my chart for the last 28 days...


How many hours of riding, and can you convert the number to percentages?
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby toolonglegs » Fri Apr 23, 2010 4:09 pm

45 hours by the looks...maybe a hour or so extra without pedaling.Also a few mountain bike rides which skew it a tiny bit.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby ft_critical » Fri Apr 23, 2010 4:34 pm

twizzle wrote:
toolonglegs wrote:Looking at my chart for the last 28 days...


How many hours of riding, and can you convert the number to percentages?


So that is totally default. 64-20-16%. Amazing.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby Ant. » Fri Apr 23, 2010 8:47 pm

ft_critical wrote:
twizzle wrote:
toolonglegs wrote:Looking at my chart for the last 28 days...


How many hours of riding, and can you convert the number to percentages?


So that is totally default. 64-20-16%. Amazing.

WKO 3.0 is frustrating me at the moment, stupid device agent+parallels, won't create a folder for me. I wish I could get golden cheetah to work!
My graphs look wonky too from changing threshold numbers, wko isn't picking up on that apparently (I have NOT spent more time at AWC than threshold)

But when my graphs looked pretty, endurance-tempo-threshold looked 30-35-35. Amazing :P

Bugger all at vo2, a fair bit in active recovery though but excluding that for this purpose.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby ft_critical » Tue Apr 27, 2010 8:28 am

Ant. wrote:But when my graphs looked pretty, endurance-tempo-threshold looked 30-35-35. Amazing :P


Yes Amazing Ant. Sure it is not time for an LT Test to reset your levels? :lol:
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby twizzle » Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:30 am

Have a look at "Aerobic Decoupling" (percentage) which looks at Avg HR vs. Avg power over a long ride and comes up with a percentage number that indicates if your base training is up to scratch. Supposed to work best with long rides ie. 3+ hours. I'm under the 5% recommended number, which means I can concentrate on specific training rather than base training. It's built into Golden Cheetah, not sure about the other tools.
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby toolonglegs » Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:18 pm

I suppose you have to wear a hr strap for that :lol: ...OK I admit I have worn mine once this year!.
I am back loading into golden cheetah and then into WKO+...PowerAgent has died a huge death!.
Golden Cheetah has the best Peak Performance Chart by far!!!.
Ant...have you seen a good article on "Base" anywhere lately :wink: .
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Re: Base Yourself

Postby Ant. » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:32 pm

ft_critical wrote:
Ant. wrote:But when my graphs looked pretty, endurance-tempo-threshold looked 30-35-35. Amazing :P


Yes Amazing Ant. Sure it is not time for an LT Test to reset your levels? :lol:

Oh I do hope you're not implying that I don't know my functional threshold power :wink:


(I don't know what my lactate threshold is, and I certainly wouldn't set any levels off THAT :P )
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