How to train for 20km TT

usernameforme
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby usernameforme » Thu Nov 10, 2016 8:12 pm

Hard to tell from the photos but it appears as though either the wheel is out of dish, or it isn't centered in the drop outs. Most likely that it isn't centered. Not sure what you're supposed to do with horizontal drop outs, but if they're vertical, make sure you have some weight placed on the wheel before/when you're tightening up the QR skewer to center it.

Not sure if the same applies for horizontal drop outs though.

linds
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Thu Nov 10, 2016 8:26 pm

Thks
Dropouts are horizontal.
I can centre the wheel (or at least improve its overall centrality) by moving the drive side axle end about a mm rearwards from its 'home' position on the dropout.

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foo on patrol
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby foo on patrol » Sat Nov 12, 2016 5:58 am

Is there a spacer on each side of the axle and if there is, are they the same size or is one thicker than the other? :?:

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linds
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:05 am

No spacer other than the axle end itself and both ends same width.

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usernameforme
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby usernameforme » Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:33 pm

Do you have horizontal drop outs with screws to help you adjust how far in/out the wheels sits? It might be that the screws are not symmetrical. Otherwise you could just need to center the rear wheel in the drop outs every time you mount it.

If you've got the spare time/money perhaps take it into a good bike shop and check if the frame is straight just for piece of mind? Rare to see frames that aren't straight but it can always be a possibility.

EDIT: just read that you tried other wheels and they seem to fit fine. Don't think the above will help, sorry. Sounds like the dish of your other wheels is different to your disc wheel. I suppose the next thing to dry is what happens when you mount the disc backwards? If it's too far to the other side then I'd suspect something was up with the dishing of the disc wheel.

linds
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Sun Nov 13, 2016 5:39 pm

Yes I have established it is the dishing of the disk wheel.
If I reverse it in the drops it is too far the other way.
My other wheels fit quite well.
I will take to the LBS tomorow and see if they can adjust the spokes to correct the dishing.
It could also be rectifed by fitting differnt hub ends if they wer available?
The seller 'Ronwheels' are not answering emails ....bad sign perhaps they have gone under.

dalai47
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby dalai47 » Sun Nov 13, 2016 5:59 pm

Do the dropouts have adjustment screws?

Image

Should be fine having the drive side back a few mm and held in place by the quick release. If you are still concerned , you could buy chain tensioners to back up the quick release?

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linds
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Sun Nov 13, 2016 6:19 pm

Hi dalai
Wouldnt using the grub screw to space the drive side out result in a wheel not traccking with the centreline of the frame? This could cause other problems couldnt it incl increased tyre wear and rolling reistance?
Thks

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:14 pm

Wheel is sorted now.
LBS corrected the dishing - sits nice in the frame.
I learned a bit about wheels from this little discussion thanks.

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Mon Dec 12, 2016 2:25 pm

Last week PR'd my 20 min power - 282w ( up from 268 in March)
This put my FTP above 260 according to Training Peaks
I think my current FTP should be sufficient to get my 40 avg on my local up and back TT course.

Last few 16 km TT's:

7/5 24.36s 273NP
19/6 25.06 271NP
29/8 24.17 272
7/11 24.12 278
21/11 24.07 271
12/12 23.59 274 Finally! Took 3 years to do a 40kph avg 16km TT!

Interesting that my race NP figures haven't changed much despite my FTP definitely increasing over that same time.
I think I am getting better at pacing...ie I put down the power more effectively.
But I am probably capable of a 280NP ride now...on a good day. Today I did not feel all that strong.
I think that I have done so much of my training indoors that there is now no difference between my indoor and outdoor power.

Next goal - do it again...then target 23.30.

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby g-boaf » Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:27 am

On a TT they probably won't change that much as you are doing steadier power levels rather than many massive accelerations as they do in a crit race for instance (and with easier laps at times).

Good work!

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Wed Dec 14, 2016 8:58 pm

Thanks I am pretty stoked to have finally got to the 40kph/ sub 24 minute point.

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foo on patrol
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby foo on patrol » Fri Dec 16, 2016 9:56 am

Well done mate! 8)

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby mikesbytes » Fri Dec 16, 2016 11:07 pm

linds wrote:Wheel is sorted now.
LBS corrected the dishing - sits nice in the frame.
I learned a bit about wheels from this little discussion thanks.
What was the solution?
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

linds
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Mon Dec 19, 2016 7:48 pm

Dishing was corrected by adjusting spokes.

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:40 pm

foo on patrol wrote:Well done mate! 8)

Foo


Thanks Foo and thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread which has given me a lot of ideas and motivation along the way

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:06 pm

TT race this morning.
Did a PR by 30 seconds - very surprised and happy!
16km, 23m29s
Thats 40.8kph.
That ticks my 23.30 goal....now to 23 flat. But going need more watts and better aero for that.

My NP for the race was about what it has been the last several attempts at 272.

I put this great result down to the following factors:

-I focussed on turtling more than usual
-I had my tire pressures abut 5 psi lower than usual I think around the 90 mark ( my pump gauge is very dodgy)
-the atmospheric pressure was lowish (1010hpa) as a front was coming over
-the wind ( about 8kph) was WNW which means that I basically went straight into it outwards and had it right behind me homewards
With the wind like this my pacing strategy is very obvious and easy. I needed to do a positive power split as outwards was uphill and into the wind. I did that - 276 outwards and about 267 homewards. That had me about 37 at the turn and I came home with an avg of nearly 47.
Despite this good time I feel like I was just a tad lazy on this ride......

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Thu Jan 19, 2017 6:17 pm

Raced again on Monday.
3rd consequtive 40+kph result. 23.55s. About 40.2. NP 276
Seems I have def achieved this goal now.

I think I will keep chipping away at this but add a new goal....over 40km.
Never raced that distance so will choose a course and see what I can do then set a goal time.
Last edited by linds on Fri Jan 20, 2017 1:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

dalai47
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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby dalai47 » Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:37 pm

Good luck finding a 40km TT! Though the only one I've raced was held by Wangaratta in 2012 so at there might be one least somewhat local to you if they are still running them. Definitely interesting racing the longer distance. Only won that one by 13 second...

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby piledhigher » Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:54 pm

dalai47 wrote:Good luck finding a 40km TT! Though the only one I've raced was held by Wangaratta in 2012 so at there might be one least somewhat local to you if they are still running them. Definitely interesting racing the longer distance. Only won that one by 13 second...


There are about seven or eight around the country every year, mostly you have to do a warm up swim of 1500m swim and a 10km run cool down..

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Fri Jan 20, 2017 7:38 am

dalai47 wrote:Good luck finding a 40km TT! Though the only one I've raced was held by Wangaratta in 2012 so at there might be one least somewhat local to you if they are still running them. Definitely interesting racing the longer distance. Only won that one by 13 second...


Yep...I will race against myself or friends, more a personal challenge...I havent seen a club TT of that distance but would be fun. A team tri might be on the cards though?

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby mikesbytes » Fri Jan 20, 2017 10:14 am

Check out ATTA. In Sydney they have a 43k TT route so they might have one for you too
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby dalai47 » Fri Jan 20, 2017 12:26 pm

ATTA doesn't have a presence in Vic. They did hold some races in Vic for one or two years at most a while back...

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby mikesbytes » Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:01 pm

dalai47 wrote:ATTA doesn't have a presence in Vic. They did hold some races in Vic for one or two years at most a while back...
Didn't know that, it made me look them up and it looks like they are largely NSW and WA. There's a course maps page and there's a 40k TT route in Kinglake West, which is driveable from Melbourne. Unfortunately most of the maps don't have the state in the title so unless you are good with towns and localities, its a bit of needle in a haystack

http://www.atta.asn.au/maps/Course_Maps.html
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

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Re: How to train for 20km TT

Postby linds » Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:35 pm

Been a bit unmotivated to ride as my mother died a month ago.
Now getting back into some training.
Bought a good pump and found that my old one under registers by at least 20 psi :!:
So i have been at 110 thinking i was at 90
Will be interesting to see if correct pressures save a watt or 2. Should be more comfortable at the least.
Have centred the rear brakes, put a new chain on and dropped the cockpit 1 spacer-5mm.
Will go for a 16km TT maybe in the next day or 2.

Going to shout myself a new gen helmet...not sure which one yet. Bambino? Aerohead?

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