VO2Max power ----> Threshold power?

[toolonglegs]

I've lost nearly that much ftp in a couple of years but that's another story.
Surely if you took most average A or B graders and gave them a 20% boost they would be riding with the pro's?
along time ago now but if I could match my 5 min to 20 min power ( and get down to say 85kgs ) ... I would have a FTP of 5.3 wpkg... Crap even then I wouldn't stand a chance!.

[zill]

I feel I'm on track with my structured training so far. Getting some good advice from here and there (a lot from this forum) and just experiment with things myself a bit longer. The dream is to get to pro fitness (not necessarily actually pro) but one step at a time. Goal for this year is to get to high end of A grade TT.

Can I ask how long you have been training for and your age? I believe you said you used to be really overweight also?

Late 20's, training for 1.5 years starting with 0 fitness and obese. However, I did do a lot of sports in my high school days but not cycling. Current body fat in the single digits.

[zill]

I've lost nearly that much ftp in a couple of years but that's another story.
Surely if you took most average A or B graders and gave them a 20% boost they would be riding with the pro's?
along time ago now but if I could match my 5 min to 20 min power ( and get down to say 85kgs ) ... I would have a FTP of 5.3 wpkg... Crap even then I wouldn't stand a chance!.

Yeah this goal does seem like fantasy at the moment....

As people have said that it depends on a lot of things. I will give it a go nonetheless, one step at a time.

[CKinnard]

when standing with feet together and legs straight, can you bend forwards and put both hands flat on the floor in front of your feet?

how tall are you and what's your drop from saddle to bars? (not tri bars!)

how long does it take you to do 100 burpees? (proper burpees, with good form push up and star jump)

[zill]

when standing with feet together and legs straight, can you bend forwards and put both hands flat on the floor in front of your feet?

Can't do that! Why do you ask?

how tall are you and what's your drop from saddle to bars? (not tri bars!)

Which bar are you referring to? The stem? Why do you ask this question?

[CKinnard]

when standing with feet together and legs straight, can you bend forwards and put both hands flat on the floor in front of your feet?

Can't do that! Why do you ask?

how tall are you and what's your drop from saddle to bars? (not tri bars!)

Which bar are you referring to? The stem? Why do you ask this question?

asking for the same reason ITT'ers wear aero helmets and use tri bars.
I presume you have a roadie - vertical drop from top of saddle to top of bars.

also, see my burpee edit in previous post.

While we're at it, do the Rockport Walk Test and Step Up Test, and report your results.
If you want the protocols, pm me.

[dalai47]

asking for the same reason ITT'ers wear aero helmets and use tri bars.

Because they want to look silly and wobble all over the road?

[Bluejay87]

Impressive turn around zill, well done. You should start a dedicated thread about your quest for pro level fitness. Your posts seem to generate lots of discussion on this forum.

[dalai47]

There seems to be a trend with these sorts of "what if", "how long", "how can I" questions Zill; perhaps you need to speak with, and hire a reputable coach pick their brain of every ounce of knowledge they possess, set some defined goals, do as they say until you figure out how best your body respond to what training, start collaborating on what you feel you should be doing

I feel I'm on track with my structured training so far. Getting some good advice from here and there (a lot from this forum) and just experiment with things myself a bit longer.

The issue is you are relying on the goodwill of many on this forum to answer your many questions. Some who actually try and earn a living as coaches and nutritionalists to name a few... To continually keep asking questions and expecting answers for free is very poor form!

[zill]

There seems to be a trend with these sorts of "what if", "how long", "how can I" questions Zill; perhaps you need to speak with, and hire a reputable coach pick their brain of every ounce of knowledge they possess, set some defined goals, do as they say until you figure out how best your body respond to what training, start collaborating on what you feel you should be doing

I feel I'm on track with my structured training so far. Getting some good advice from here and there (a lot from this forum) and just experiment with things myself a bit longer.

The issue is you are relying on the goodwill of many on this forum to answer your many questions. Some who actually try and earn a living as coaches and nutritionalists to name a few... To continually keep asking questions and expecting answers for free is very poor form!

If people are happy posting here then it should be all good. I actually have had a cycling coach (hence the recent improvement) and seen a nutritionist. They have been helpful and that's what I meant by getting good advice here and there as well as reading books. I like my freedom though as well and not be too bounded at least at this stage where gains are not too diminishing. Can see myself needing some serious coaching in the future but that's probably not before I get an SRM and at the point end of A grade.

[zill]

Also I am still new to racing and haven't experienced a lot of races yet. Don't want to be locked into a specific schedule just yet.

[Alex Simmons/RST]

The issue is you are relying on the goodwill of many on this forum to answer your many questions. Some who actually try and earn a living as coaches and nutritionalists to name a few... To continually keep asking questions and expecting answers for free is very poor form!

If people are happy posting here then it should be all good.

Correct, professional people can choose to respond or not. Such responses however will tend to be general in nature and not specific to the individual as that would be inappropriate for a variety of reasons, not least of which any specific advice should be based on a far more thorough knowledge of the individual concerned and be made in-confidence and that confidence should extend both ways.

[Xplora]

My response is tailored to zill's situation. He's coming to the sport a bit later in life, which is common, and he's super keen, which is awesome, but has raced maybe 10 crits and decided it isn't for him so wants to move to TTs. There is very little difference between the competitive streak that drives you in TTs vs crits, I question the wisdom that makes you leave the crit scene in order to ride a monthly TT, when riding 1-2 crits every week will help build a strong base - it will help you learn to cope with the struggles of racing. You don't have to win, and a TT specialist will struggle against the big boys in the higher grades, BUT that's not the aim. It is exposure to competition. I dropped my chain in the prim sprint a week ago. Did I bitch out? No, I stayed calm, and carefully nursed my chain back on with the FD. Won the race later. If you notice the tantrums from Sir Wiggins, it's a sign of mental weakness which will cost you in the long run (I was a chronic tantrum thrower in my teens on the sporting field lol).

Milostic is virtually lapping the field in Sydney A grade when he's peaking, he's a TT guy. He did really well in the National Road Race. Tony Martin won a Grand Tour stage despite being a TT guy. We have to be realistic about our skills and talents, but it's riding a bike, and I feel "in zill's case" that the experience of regular participation in the cycling scene would be helpful to "his" development as a racer. Racing is training!

I don't think I could race once a month, with A grade training levels. I like the social aspect of racing, and the competitive and fitness aspects. I like a lot of stuff about racing. I would prefer to be sitting in twice a week getting torched than not race at all.

[thearthurdog]

Being a good TTer certainly provides a good platform for other kinds of racing. The ability to hold a high power output for 30min / 40min / 60min / whatever has to be a good thing. I don't think that crits help with TT performance at all. Sure its a high intensity race and that's going to be good for the legs in many ways but in terms of having a direct improvement relationship with TT performance, well I just don't see it. I am 'up there' in my age group for TTs at state level and I avoid crits like the plague. Just sayin'

[dalai47]

One word Xplora - specificity. Crits are great training, but won't have the same value as TT specific intervals.

Milostic is the exception and not a fair example. The bloke is a monster on the bike!

Please don't project your needs of having to race frequently on Zill - he may not see benefit in the social aspect etc. Though although zill has referred to a monthly TT, we have the good fortunate of having a very full dance card with TT's through winter. One winter a couple of years ago I raced somewhere well over 20 TT's across Vic!

[Xplora]

Simply getting an alternative opinion out there. I don't know any scheduled TTs in Sydney apart from Calga. It would be great to have a weekly TT (no more FTP tests forever!) but compared to 4-5 crits weekly? No contest for the beginning racer.

i've been having alot of conversations after the coffee sprint lately with guys who are solid riders, but unsure about getting down for a race, and the answer is always "do it ASAP - the longer you wait, the worse it will be" because you need to be able to handle the pressure of racing lower grades at lower speeds before you can handle the pressure of racing in higher grades at higher speeds.

[dalai47]

Agreed it is important to take part in all forms of racing starting out.

I do find it odd zill is focusing on TT's when I am not sure if he has even raced one yet! His comment about being top end of B for hill climbing TT's is odd, as we only have two hill climb TT's in the calendar for this year.

[zill]

My response is tailored to zill's situation. He's coming to the sport a bit later in life, which is common, and he's super keen, which is awesome, but has raced maybe 10 crits and decided it isn't for him so wants to move to TTs. There is very little difference between the competitive streak that drives you in TTs vs crits, I question the wisdom that makes you leave the crit scene in order to ride a monthly TT, when riding 1-2 crits every week will help build a strong base - it will help you learn to cope with the struggles of racing. You don't have to win, and a TT specialist will struggle against the big boys in the higher grades, BUT that's not the aim. It is exposure to competition. I dropped my chain in the prim sprint a week ago. Did I bitch out? No, I stayed calm, and carefully nursed my chain back on with the FD. Won the race later. If you notice the tantrums from Sir Wiggins, it's a sign of mental weakness which will cost you in the long run (I was a chronic tantrum thrower in my teens on the sporting field lol).

Milostic is virtually lapping the field in Sydney A grade when he's peaking, he's a TT guy. He did really well in the National Road Race. Tony Martin won a Grand Tour stage despite being a TT guy. We have to be realistic about our skills and talents, but it's riding a bike, and I feel "in zill's case" that the experience of regular participation in the cycling scene would be helpful to "his" development as a racer. Racing is training!

I don't think I could race once a month, with A grade training levels. I like the social aspect of racing, and the competitive and fitness aspects. I like a lot of stuff about racing. I would prefer to be sitting in twice a week getting torched than not race at all.

10???? Have done exactly 40 crits this season in D, C and B grade. Have placed in 5 crits in D and C grade. Don't think will be racing any more this season. Aim is to train super hard this year and win B grade solo in 2015/16 crit season then do a few crits in A grade but not likely to get placings. Train super hard in 2016 then win A grade solo in 2016/17 crit season.

In training there are power numbers to aim for so can't slack off and in the end probably push harder then in a race where tactics and race situation must also be taken into account.
Haven't done any road races in Winter yet so don't know what to expect. The thing I hate most about racing in groups is the risk of crashing. Don't like the social aspect either.

[zill]

I do find it odd zill is focusing on TT's when I am not sure if he has even raced one yet! His comment about being top end of B for hill climbing TT's is odd, as we only have two hill climb TT's in the calendar for this year.

True, but I've done the 1 in 20 a few times and my recent PB would in B grade come first in 2013, 2012 and 2009. Second in 2010 and 2011. Results with grades only go to up to 2009 and they didn't have a race last year. That's assuming the ITT starts and finishes at the usual spots which they seem to be according to Strava.

Haven't done Mt Donna Buang with fresh legs and carbon wheels yet.