CUPERTINO, Calif. (BRAIN) — Apple Inc. has applied for a patent that would allow for an indirect measurement of a cyclist's power output, by calculating wind resistance, road surface smoothness, rider position, heart rate and accelleration. The application suggests that by using these factors, gathered from a wearable device that has a GPS, accellerometer, heart rate monitor and other features, it could calculate rider power without the expense of a traditional power meter.
The application, filed Thursday, might suggest that Apple wants to up its game against Garmin, which has seen continued sales growth of its wearables and bike-related products, although Apple's Watch continues to dominate sales in the smart watch category.
The patent application calls for using a wearable device, such as a watch, that would be able to determine the rider's position on the bike, including whether the rider's hands were on the handlebar tops or drops. The system would use known factors, including road grade, traveling direction, speed, and rider position to estimate wind speed and direction and, ultimately, estimate power output.
Last year, Apple was granted 2,102 patents, according to IFI Claims.
Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
- Ross
- Posts: 5742
- Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 8:53 pm
Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby Ross » Fri Mar 17, 2017 6:31 am
- Alex Simmons/RST
- Expert
- Posts: 4997
- Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 3:51 pm
- Contact:
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Fri Mar 17, 2017 7:12 am
- g-boaf
- Posts: 21325
- Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby g-boaf » Fri Mar 17, 2017 8:37 am
However, I don't see people rushing to get rid of their SRM and Pioneer power meters any time soon.
- Alex Simmons/RST
- Expert
- Posts: 4997
- Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 3:51 pm
- Contact:
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:03 pm
- g-boaf
- Posts: 21325
- Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby g-boaf » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:09 pm
How did iBike manage to get away with that name.. Usually Apple is doing iEverything. In any case, whatever Apple does won't be on my shopping list.Alex Simmons/RST wrote:Well it's hardly a novel idea, even using the mathematical model of the physics of cycling, like say iBike have done for more than a decade, to estimate power from measurements of energy demand factors. But hey, if Apple think they can measure wind velocity and direction with a watch, I'm all ears.
- Thoglette
- Posts: 6606
- Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 1:01 pm
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby Thoglette » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:32 pm
And two dollars to a bucket of horse puckey, they're as laughable as this one. Unfortunately that the way the patent warsIFI Claims wrote:Last year, Apple was granted 2,102 patents.
"People are worthy of respect, ideas are not." Peter Ellerton, UQ
- silentC
- Posts: 2442
- Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 5:24 pm
- Location: Far South Coast NSW
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby silentC » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:39 pm
- Me
-
- Posts: 219
- Joined: Wed Dec 02, 2015 10:38 am
- Location: Brisbane
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby adam0bmx0 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:49 pm
There is an app/software avialable that currently does that, I saw it a couple of weeks ago but cant think of the name.silentC wrote:I've always thought it would be neat if Strava could pull in data from the BOM and apply it to your rides. It wouldn't be wildly accurate, given the way wind direction changes around hills etc, but nothing about Strava is particularly accurate anyway.
There is this one;
http://strava-weather-analysis.paperpla ... index.html
But pretty sure it was a different one im thinking of.
- silentC
- Posts: 2442
- Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 5:24 pm
- Location: Far South Coast NSW
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby silentC » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:59 pm
(Just for fun, not because I take it seriously )
- Me
- andrewjcw
- Posts: 197
- Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:56 pm
- Location: Newcastle, NSW
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby andrewjcw » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:01 pm
- g-boaf
- Posts: 21325
- Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby g-boaf » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:04 pm
All big businesses do that, it's how they compete effectively these days.andrewjcw wrote:Apple would patent getting out of bed in the morning if they thought they could. Don't get your hopes up...
- Comedian
- Posts: 9166
- Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:35 pm
- Location: Brisbane
-
- Posts: 1703
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2016 3:08 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby RobertL » Fri Mar 17, 2017 4:47 pm
silentC wrote:I've always thought it would be neat if Strava could pull in data from the BOM and apply it to your rides. It wouldn't be wildly accurate, given the way wind direction changes around hills etc, but nothing about Strava is particularly accurate anyway.
I thought that the Strava estimated power figure was reasonably accurate, as long as you accurately enter your bodyweight and the weight of your bike + gear. Is that not the case?
- silentC
- Posts: 2442
- Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 5:24 pm
- Location: Far South Coast NSW
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby silentC » Fri Mar 17, 2017 5:56 pm
But generally, Strava relies on GPS and I have seen widely different measurements taken by cyclists on the same ride as me, with elevation gains differing by 100m or more. Distances are usually fairly close. It is what it is, I'm just saying that combining BOM data with your ride is not going to be an exact science, but it's probably no worse than the other inputs and assumptions made.
I checked on segment with the site above. I'd held the KOM since 2014 but one of my mates took it off me a couple of weeks ago. That site said that I had a 10kph tail wind and he had a 20kph tailwind, so I'm happy with that Not that he will care
- Me
-
- Posts: 1703
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2016 3:08 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby RobertL » Fri Mar 17, 2017 6:00 pm
-
- Posts: 1703
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2016 3:08 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby RobertL » Fri Mar 17, 2017 6:06 pm
And then this guy found the opposite: https://stevebalescyclingblog.wordpress ... eal-power/
So, who knows?
- silentC
- Posts: 2442
- Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 5:24 pm
- Location: Far South Coast NSW
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby silentC » Fri Mar 17, 2017 6:18 pm
- Me
- find_bruce
- Moderator
- Posts: 10579
- Joined: Mon May 09, 2011 8:42 pm
- Location: Sydney
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby find_bruce » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:11 am
- Alex Simmons/RST
- Expert
- Posts: 4997
- Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 3:51 pm
- Contact:
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:16 am
Such estimates will be nothing more than some light comic relief.RobertL wrote:silentC wrote:I've always thought it would be neat if Strava could pull in data from the BOM and apply it to your rides. It wouldn't be wildly accurate, given the way wind direction changes around hills etc, but nothing about Strava is particularly accurate anyway.
I thought that the Strava estimated power figure was reasonably accurate, as long as you accurately enter your bodyweight and the weight of your bike + gear. Is that not the case?
- Alex Simmons/RST
- Expert
- Posts: 4997
- Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 3:51 pm
- Contact:
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:20 am
He makes the mistake of thinking the calorie estimate from his power meter data is accurate. It's not - it relies on an assumption about gross efficiency made by the algorithm. Assuming the meter is a good one and it is properly calibrated, then the mechanical energy number will be accurate. But converting that to energy metabolised requires some assumptions. Nailing that down a little tighter for each individual requires laboratory testing but there are still acute variations in gross efficiency.RobertL wrote:In fact, this guy tested Strava against actual data and found some problems, but that it's pretty accurate on climbs: https://www.velopress.com/how-accurate- ... and-hills/
-
- Posts: 3459
- Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2014 10:23 am
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby CKinnard » Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:23 am
With their resources they could have applied themselves to making serious medical tech more broadly available. Technology I think would benefit from being dumbed and priced down to fitness enthusiast level is indirect calorimetry and ecg.
Consumer ecg units interpreted by computer algorithms would have enormous potential for unmasking heart pathology sometimes years earlier than otherwise, and prevent more serious morbidity and early mortality. Problems like transient or stress induced arrhythmias, heart valve disease, compromised coronary artery patency could all be picked up earlier with more regular wearing of ecg devices.
And calorimetry provides enormous insight into metabolic rate and substrate usage, which would help people understand bodyweight management better.
Below is one of my favorite pieces of tech that I first used 12 years ago in previous iterations.
http://www.bodpod.com/en/products/cardi ... obile-cpet
-
- Posts: 572
- Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:13 pm
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby madmacca » Thu May 18, 2017 8:49 am
When confronted with the regulatory requirements and potential liabilities of the medical device industry, most consumer electronics companies head the other direction FAST. They take a great deal of care NOT to suggest that their devices can be used for medicalCKinnard wrote:Apple has always been more about style than substance, and gee whiz consumerism than science.
With their resources they could have applied themselves to making serious medical tech more broadly available. Technology I think would benefit from being dumbed and priced down to fitness enthusiast level is indirect calorimetry and ecg.
Consumer ecg units interpreted by computer algorithms would have enormous potential for unmasking heart pathology sometimes years earlier than otherwise, and prevent more serious morbidity and early mortality. Problems like transient or stress induced arrhythmias, heart valve disease, compromised coronary artery patency could all be picked up earlier with more regular wearing of ecg devices.
And calorimetry provides enormous insight into metabolic rate and substrate usage, which would help people understand bodyweight management better.
Below is one of my favorite pieces of tech that I first used 12 years ago in previous iterations.
http://www.bodpod.com/en/products/cardi ... obile-cpet
(as against sport) purposes. Thank the lawyers for that one.
- bychosis
- Posts: 7250
- Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
- Location: Lake Macquarie
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby bychosis » Thu May 18, 2017 10:42 am
Don't be silly. There are devices out there that regular consumers can buy that will stop you from ever having to see a dr again!madmacca wrote:When confronted with the regulatory requirements and potential liabilities of the medical device industry, most consumer electronics companies head the other direction FAST. They take a great deal of care NOT to suggest that their devices can be used for medical
(as against sport) purposes. Thank the lawyers for that one.
This popped up on my faceache feed last night: https://www.itovi.com/technology/. Gonna cancel my latest snake-oil order and throw away my Power Balance band immediately and get ten.
-
- Posts: 3459
- Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2014 10:23 am
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby CKinnard » Thu May 18, 2017 6:55 pm
It's a changing world.bychosis wrote:Don't be silly. There are devices out there that regular consumers can buy that will stop you from ever having to see a dr again!madmacca wrote:When confronted with the regulatory requirements and potential liabilities of the medical device industry, most consumer electronics companies head the other direction FAST. They take a great deal of care NOT to suggest that their devices can be used for medical
(as against sport) purposes. Thank the lawyers for that one.
This popped up on my faceache feed last night: https://www.itovi.com/technology/. Gonna cancel my latest snake-oil order and throw away my Power Balance band immediately and get ten.
home testing kits for continuous blood glucose monitoring and ketones, epi pens, home use heart rate monitors, heart rate variability, sphyg's, spirometry, CPAP, humidifers, sleep study harnesses, holter monitors, defibrillators, TENS and ultrasound therapy.
None of this stuff was around for use outside a doctor's surgery or hospital when I was a kid.
- bychosis
- Posts: 7250
- Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
- Location: Lake Macquarie
Re: Apple applies for patent to calculate cyclists' power from wind resistance and other factors
Postby bychosis » Thu May 18, 2017 8:48 pm
- General Australian Cycling Topics
- Info / announcements
- Buying a bike / parts
- General Cycling Discussion
- The Bike Shed
- Cycling Health
- Cycling Safety and Advocacy
- Women's Cycling
- Bike & Gear Reviews
- Cycling Trade
- Stolen Bikes
- Bicycle FAQs
- The Market Place
- Member to Member Bike and Gear Sales
- Want to Buy, Group Buy, Swap
- My Bikes or Gear Elsewhere
- Serious Biking
- Audax / Randonneuring
- Retro biking
- Commuting
- MTB
- Recumbents
- Fixed Gear/ Single Speed
- Track
- Electric Bicycles
- Cyclocross and Gravel Grinding
- Dragsters / Lowriders / Cruisers
- Children's Bikes
- Cargo Bikes and Utility Cycling
- Road Racing
- Road Biking
- Training
- Time Trial
- Triathlon
- International and National Tours and Events
- Cycle Touring
- Touring Australia
- Touring Overseas
- Touring Bikes and Equipment
- Australia
- Western Australia
- New South Wales
- Queensland
- South Australia
- Victoria
- ACT
- Tasmania
- Northern Territory
- Country & Regional
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users
- All times are UTC+11:00
- Top
- Delete cookies
About the Australian Cycling Forums
The Australian Cycling Forums is a welcoming community where you can ask questions and talk about the type of bikes and cycling topics you like.
Bicycles Network Australia
Forum Information
Connect with BNA
This website uses affiliate links to retail platforms including ebay, amazon, proviz and ribble.