Chucked me guts up

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Chucked me guts up

Postby Missy24 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:18 am

I was in the pool last night, had just finished lap 21 of 30 when I started to feel light headed and sick, I thought, no I must be imagining it, HFTU Missy, so I did, I'd been doing reallyreally good consistent laps.

Did my best lap time on lap 22 of 30, got to the end, felt like hell, pulled myself out of the pool and then chucked me guts up, had to call my mum to collect me cause I couldn't walk in a straigh line without stopping every two metres.

For the record.
- I hadn't swallowed any water that session
- I don't drink
- I know this is cycling health, but before I cycle, I NEED to be able swim 1.5km before I ride 40km then run 10km

Diagnose me... you know you want to
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by BNA » Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:24 am

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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby hannos » Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:24 am

Missy24 wrote:I was in the pool last night, had just finished lap 21 of 30 when I started to feel light headed and sick, I thought, no I must be imagining it, HFTU Missy, so I did, I'd been doing reallyreally good consistent laps.

Did my best lap time on lap 22 of 30, got to the end, felt like hell, pulled myself out of the pool and then chucked me guts up, had to call my mum to collect me cause I couldn't walk in a straigh line without stopping every two metres.

For the record.
- I hadn't swallowed any water that session
- I don't drink
- I know this is cycling health, but before I cycle, I NEED to be able swim 1.5km before I ride 40km then run 10km

Diagnose me... you know you want to


Not enough cement in your diet!

Seriously? It could be anything. Maybe pushing too hard in the swim? Something you ate up to 6 hours earlier, a bug you picked up from a colleague or someone you might have walked past in the street.


I'd have a day of all training and start out again witha lighter session.


For the part I put in bold above, you only need to swim it, not make it a record time. When i did my (admittedly) short Tri in january I started racing after I got out of the water. (I can't swim for sht)
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby Missy24 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:26 am

Yeah but I can already swim it well... now I NEED to swim it better
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby ClownBoy » Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:13 am

If you feel okay the next day forget about it unless it happens again.

Sometimes you just have to puke something up. Could be anything.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby Wayfarer » Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:24 am

That's no good :( did you feel better later on? I dont really know why, but this weather lately has been putting alot of people off training. everytime i do my usual (fast) commute, i end up seeing stars and almost passing out too. What my swimming coach got us to do during winter was longer distance swimming at a slightly lower pace (30-40 laps) twice a week, and faster 15 lap swims twice week.

Sounds like a weird question, but was the water chlorinated that day to the point you could taste it? One time it wasn't, and my mate (state level and ex-squads swimmer) was throwing up on the bike trip home..
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby Missy24 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:53 am

ClownBoy wrote:If you feel okay the next day forget about it unless it happens again.

Sometimes you just have to puke something up. Could be anything.

I'm really tired today, I basically go to bed and I don't sleep... its more that I pass out these days, which is good cause there used to be a time when I didn't sleep.

I've got a lot of work on at the moment and doing a lot of correspondance between Europe, so I'm kind of living in another Timezone as well.

I'm taking tonight off to catch up with work and some domestic duties that I need to attend to, hopefully I'll feel better tomorrow.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby hannos » Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:01 am

What time do you finish training in the evening?
What time do you usually try to go to bed?
What time (roughly) do you fall asleep?
How many hours sleep per night do you get (unbroken)?
How many hours are you spending in the office per day?

You might be over-working yourself.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby Missy24 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:07 am

hannos wrote:What time do you finish training in the evening?
What time do you usually try to go to bed?
What time (roughly) do you fall asleep?
How many hours sleep per night do you get (unbroken)?
How many hours are you spending in the office per day?

You might be over-working yourself.

Finish at 7-7:30
Bed time at the moment 12pm
Falling asleep... when head hits pillow
3 hours per night uninterrupted
Office is only between 8.30 and 5:00pm
I do work for a website on the side of things
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby ClownBoy » Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:09 am

Missy24 wrote:
ClownBoy wrote:If you feel okay the next day forget about it unless it happens again.

Sometimes you just have to puke something up. Could be anything.

I'm really tired today, I basically go to bed and I don't sleep... its more that I pass out these days, which is good cause there used to be a time when I didn't sleep.


This can be a sign of overtraining. Can also be things like Iron deficiency, etc.

I would recommend taking 2-3 days off before you get back into it.

Also go to the doc and get a panel done. Overtraining can affect your hormone levels, etc. Plus the doc can tell you if you are getting a bit anaemic (common problem for athletes).
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby ClownBoy » Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:15 am

Missy24 wrote:Finish at 7-7:30
Bed time at the moment 12pm
Falling asleep... when head hits pillow
3 hours per night uninterrupted
Office is only between 8.30 and 5:00pm
I do work for a website on the side of things


Tough love moment (so take this as a wake up call with good intentions).

That is f*&king stupid. You are sleeping for 3 hours uninterrupted per night?

Quick lesson - sleep is every bit as important to an athlete as training.

I can say it in a different language if you like?

The full lecture includes information on sleep cycles, time in deep sleep, etc. What you are describing is not sufficient.

If you commit to triathlon and upholding this sort of training load you need to commit to adequate sleep as well.

I get up at 4am every day - but I go to bed at 7:30-8:00 on the nights I don't swim and by 8:30 on the nights I do (and I get home the same time you do on swim nights - 7:30-8:00. I have dinner ready from the night before, chat to my wife while I eat then hit the hay.

Avg about 7 hours per night during the week and get a big 10hours or so on Saturday nights as often as possible.

It seems hard at first but you get into a routine and suddenly going to bed at that time becomes easier. I used doxylamine succinate for a week to help (ask your chemist) and keep some in the drawer for when sleep is difficult. It is not a sleeping tablet but it does help send you to sleep - wears off in a couple of hours, you get natural sleep.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby Missy24 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:21 am

Ok but after the first 3hours, I get another 4 hours... yeah I get it, I need to sleep more.

Which means I have to work more effectively at the work that I need to do.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby ClownBoy » Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:31 am

Missy24 wrote:Ok but after the first 3hours, I get another 4 hours... yeah I get it, I need to sleep more.

Which means I have to work more effectively at the work that I need to do.


If you go to bed at 12, sleep for 3 hours uninterrupted then get 4 more hours sleep - you are getting up at 7 and starting work at 8. So when do you train?

I don't believe you really do get that extra 4 hours. But either way, your body has cycles it goes through during sleep. You need uninterupted sleep to reach the deeper stages where your brain recovers itself. Interrupted sleep means you keep restarting that cycle and you don't geto ne of the most beneficial stages in sufficient quality.

I checked wikipedia (which I hate using as a reference but it is quick to hand) and the link is overly scientific but it is here - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_patterns

A key part for you is on the circadian clock. It controls when you feel sleepy and when not. It is entirely possible for you to 'program yourself' to accpet unsafe amounts of sleep until you start to fall over. That is why it is helpful to use something to help you slip into a deliberate sleep pattern. The circadian clock does not work just on time (since you don't have a time piece in your brain) - things like light patterns, etc, have an effect. So keep that in mind in preparing your bedroom.

But you will learn more with a bit of self led research so I hope this helps lead you in the right direction. The alternative is your body brakes down for several days every couple of months and you hit your triathlon in poor form and get a sucky result irrespective of the effort you put in.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby hannos » Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:42 am

From my non-mdeical background I'd have to concur with clown.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby Missy24 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:49 am

ClownBoy wrote:
Missy24 wrote:Ok but after the first 3hours, I get another 4 hours... yeah I get it, I need to sleep more.

Which means I have to work more effectively at the work that I need to do.


If you go to bed at 12, sleep for 3 hours uninterrupted then get 4 more hours sleep - you are getting up at 7 and starting work at 8. So when do you train?


I'm training in the evenings at the moment, physically getting out of bed is the shittiest part of my day.

Just had a look at my diary... think I'll take a few days off.

Thanks for the reality check CB and hannos, time to re-shuffle.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby ClownBoy » Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:19 pm

Missy24 wrote:physically getting out of bed is the shittiest part of my day.


Funny how we miss the most obvious signs.

I get up at 4am 6 days per week and train - 9/10 I don't even need a coffee until after I start work - around 8-ish. Can train quality for 3 hours, have brekky, etc, etc. On the 7th day, as often as not, I still wake up at 4 and just relax in bed - no alarm clock but that is how my body is set now.

The contrast is I am rested and ready to go at 4am whereas your body is trying to get you to stay still at 7am.

Take the rest of the week off. (maybe keep up your swimming or some light jogging so you don't feel bad).

Before the weekend - duck into the chemist for the doxylamine succinate I recommended (different chemists = different product name but that is the drug name. Many sell it as Dozile). Take a dose mid afternoon Saturday after a nice big meal and see if you can sleep through and get a really restful sleep.

You can use this stuff daily for a week or so but you do build up a dependancy and a resistance so stop daily user after a week. But take it at 7:30 and hop into bed by 8. It will make you feel drowsy after 30-60 minutes and that is all it does. Your sleep is very natural (as oppossed to a sleeping drug that will knock you out and sleep is not as good quality).

Then keep it in a drawer for the occasional big sleep on the weekend if you have issues during the week.

Want to talk about your training schedule as well?

Oh - big point - don't forget to get a general check up from the doc. Ask for your bloodwork to be done. Common things are an iron deficiency.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby hannos » Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:24 pm

Missy24 wrote:physically getting out of bed is the shittiest part of my day.



I agree with you here Missy, I hate mornings (I am a confirmed "night person").


ClownBoy wrote:Common things are an iron deficiency.


Especially for women.

Get some Spinach into you! :)

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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby ClownBoy » Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:29 pm

hannos wrote:Get some Spinach into you! :)

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Forget that.

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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby Missy24 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:31 pm

ClownBoy wrote:
Missy24 wrote:physically getting out of bed is the shittiest part of my day.


Funny how we miss the most obvious signs.

Want to talk about your training schedule as well?

Oh - big point - don't forget to get a general check up from the doc. Ask for your bloodwork to be done. Common things are an iron deficiency.

I don't know how you do it... your wife is a good women CB.

Training wise.... I really want to.

1. Do my run training on the way to work, not as effective, but its when I have time, its 4km each way and I can take it as hard and easy as I like.

2. Leave my bike on the trainer between Monday to Friday

3. Swim 3 nights between Monday - Friday and get two rest days in.

Thoughts?
2.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby ClownBoy » Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:39 pm

Make Monday, Wednesday and Saturday your peak days.

Monday do your run - make it a 10km route finishing at work. In the evening do your swim.

Wednesday do your cycle - Hard session on the indoor trainer (I am new to indoor trainer but probably 30-45 minutes hard effort) then light jog into work (no brake inbetween). In the evening do your swim.

Friday evening you can swim again.

Saturdays do a key session (get your bike out on the road for a long ride or go for a long run - I alternate weekends).

These are your key sessions (3xswim, 2.5xrun, 1.5xcycle - the .5 comes from alternating your Saturdays).

Tuesday, Thursday and Sunday have nothing. Friday is very light - so plot in some non-key sessions and some off time according to whatever feels good.

That is how I started anyway. The Monday and Wednesday morning sessions are about getting better and faster. Same with the swimming. Your non-key sessions can be about getting faster, maybe some recovery and really having fun as well. Saturday is about endurance. You need to know how to deliver power for 2.5-3 hours (which is probably your target completion time?).
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby twizzle » Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:41 pm

I'd go Kangaroo myself - huge amount of iron.

Missy - have a week off. And do some research on sleep cycles and required sleep - and check what the pro's get.

Tip : If you can nod off in the middle of the day when you have a few quiet moments, you are sleep deprived. I'm often in this state, giving up serious training for winter has resulted in my sleep hours jumping from ~ 7 per night to ~8+ per night. And I feel much better for it.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby ClownBoy » Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:43 pm

If it helps - I am training for Ironman so while the distances have increased, I do similar andh ave done so for some time - I consider it very maintainable.

Tuesday (bike, run, swim - 3-4 hours across 2 sessions), Thursday (bike, swim - 3 hours across 2 sessions), Sat (run\bike - 3hours across 1 session) are my peak days.

Friday is a non-peak day - 1 hour of hard (almost puking hard) running with my coach

Monday is off except for pilates.

Wednesday, Sunday are off except for 45 minutes of weights and 45 minutes of stretching. (I call all 3 of these days active recovery).

That is in a nutshell anyway.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby ClownBoy » Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:44 pm

twizzle wrote:I'd go Kangaroo myself - huge amount of iron.


+1-million

I love skippy bolognaise. Or kanga bangas.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby Missy24 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:53 pm

ClownBoy wrote:Make Monday, Wednesday and Saturday your peak days.

Monday do your run - make it a 10km route finishing at work. In the evening do your swim.

Wednesday do your cycle - Hard session on the indoor trainer (I am new to indoor trainer but probably 30-45 minutes hard effort) then light jog into work (no brake inbetween). In the evening do your swim.

Friday evening you can swim again.

Saturdays do a key session (get your bike out on the road for a long ride or go for a long run - I alternate weekends).

These are your key sessions (3xswim, 2.5xrun, 1.5xcycle - the .5 comes from alternating your Saturdays).

Tuesday, Thursday and Sunday have nothing. Friday is very light - so plot in some non-key sessions and some off time according to whatever feels good.

That is how I started anyway. The Monday and Wednesday morning sessions are about getting better and faster. Same with the swimming. Your non-key sessions can be about getting faster, maybe some recovery and really having fun as well. Saturday is about endurance. You need to know how to deliver power for 2.5-3 hours (which is probably your target completion time?).

Yep target time is between 2.5-3.

Will follow this

twizzle wrote:I'd go Kangaroo myself - huge amount of iron.

Missy - have a week off. And do some research on sleep cycles and required sleep - and check what the pro's get.

Tip : If you can nod off in the middle of the day when you have a few quiet moments, you are sleep deprived. I'm often in this state, giving up serious training for winter has resulted in my sleep hours jumping from ~ 7 per night to ~8+ per night. And I feel much better for it.


I'm not falling asleep at work, I just don't have the same amount of pep that I'd like to have and I hate the feeling of not wanting to get out of bed.
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby flammer » Tue Jun 08, 2010 7:47 pm

A couple of possibilities:

You had a bug in your system.

Over doing the training drive

You are emotionally over stressed by work and private issues. Some recent topics you initiated point to this being in the bleeding obvious category. When your internal voice says, "I should be able to handle this." "Everything relies on me." " If I stick it out, it will be ok." "I feel like running away." then it's time to take a break before things get really serious. :(

You are not getting enough sleep. "Sleep that knits up the raveled sleave of care, /The death of each day's life, sore labor's bath, Balm of hurt minds, great nature's second course,/ Chief nourisher in life's feast." (Macbeth)

Look after yourself. Nurture your body, mind and spirit. Take some time to convalesce. :wink:
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Re: Chucked me guts up

Postby Missy24 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 7:55 pm

flammer wrote:You are emotionally over stressed by work and private issues. Some recent topics you initiated point to this being in the bleeding obvious category. When your internal voice says, "I should be able to handle this." "Everything relies on me." " If I stick it out, it will be ok." "I feel like running away." then it's time to take a break before things get really serious. :(

Um yes, but its not work, work is good and training is primarily good, its all the space I have inbetween thats the problem,

So instead of dealing with all the private issues that went wrong a few months ago, I'm just trying to fill as much as my time as possible, so I don't have time to think.

Its fair to say that I've over done it physically, can I deal with the personal issues? Yes but its not going to happen overnight... I'm kind of tired of being sad and upset, its getting really annoying but I can't figure out how to just push it out of my head.

I can focus on everything else, except getting this out of my head.
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